advice on P&S for Denali climb

Lost Canadian

Expedition Leader
This is a G9, not G10, but close enough.

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Tucked away in the breast pocket of my winter coat.

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Not that you're looking for a manual focus, film rangerfinder...

oly_xa_1.jpg


oly_xa_3.jpg

I have that camera with the flash attachement! I bought it as a gift for my dad when they first came out, about 1980 or so. He loved it and shot some great photos with it. It has been mine since my father died several years ago. I haven't shot anything with it for five or six years. They are great little cameras. They are not technically rangefinder cameras as they have a three poistion fixed focus range. I also have a couple of twin lens reflex cameras that were his. It's hard to go back from digital. Sorry to chase a rabbit.
 

DaveInDenver

Middle Income Semi-Redneck
They are not technically rangefinder cameras as they have a three poistion fixed focus range.
You are referring to the XA2, the XA is a true rangefinder, 35mm f/2.8 reverse retrofocus continuous focus lens. See the little tab under the lens, that's the focusing tab, and you can see the scale on the top. To focus you bring the two images together in the viewfinder, just like any other rangefinder. The slider on the side of the lens is the aperture, it's aperture priority auto exposure.
 
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colotaco

Adventurer
Thanks for all the support! My next question is why is the G9 almost $100 more than the G10? I figured if the G9 is awesome I'd just try and find one thinking they would be cheaper than the latest version, guess I don't know much about the camera world. Thanks again, and I will prepare a trip report with hopefully some good photos upon my return from Denali.
 

Lost Canadian

Expedition Leader
Thanks for all the support! My next question is why is the G9 almost $100 more than the G10? I figured if the G9 is awesome I'd just try and find one thinking they would be cheaper than the latest version, guess I don't know much about the camera world. Thanks again, and I will prepare a trip report with hopefully some good photos upon my return from Denali.
It shouldn't be. I'd look around some more, the G9 should be discounted by now.
 

dhackney

Expedition Leader
We've owned a wide variety of the Canon SD series P&S cameras since their introduction. I don't know how many we've owned in total, probably five or six.

The Canon SD cameras qualify as the world's product line most in need of nomenclature rationalization. They carry different model designations in different markets and within market, such as the U.S., the various model numbers make no sense whatsoever.

The short story is: there's a wide angle series and a non-wide angle series. We've used the wide angle series for a while now.

We currently use:
- SD870 - mine, pretty beat up, still ticking
- SD880 - Steph's new one, replaced the one she dropped from the cab (I'm not saying she used the dinged up case to justify a replacement. Really. I'm not. ;) )

They are our pocket cameras and are always with us.

For an example of image quality from the 870 click here: http://www.hackneys.com/travel/peru/docs/roomofwakes.pdf

I probably got more positive feedback on the photography in that essay than any other, and I shot every image with the 870. I purposely took only that camera that day just to demonstrate what was possible with a P&S.


We've used the SDs in high heat, cold, rain, fog, high altitude (16k feet), on beaches, on boats, on motorcycles, on oceans, driest desert in the world, etc. They've been dropped, slammed, crashed on and otherwise ridden hard and put up wet.

Failures:
1. Drop from Fuso FG cab seat to pavement. Bent the body a little bit. Camera still worked. Believe that one was an SD850.
2. Rear display burned two hotspots shooting a sunset in Chile. Imager still works fine. SD870.

Total get-off face-plants with an SD in my chest protector pouch or in front jacket pocket: Hey, we're talking me on a dirt bike trying to keep up with my buddies here - countless.

SD downsides for your purposes:
1. Proprietary batteries. This is mitigated somewhat by long battery life and small battery size. If you bought some extras and/or borrowed some extras from other SD owners they wouldn't take up much room and they don't weigh much either.
2. Small lens and imager chip.
3. Noisy high ISO.
4. No weather sealing.
5. No optical viewfinder, must use display which uses up battery power.
6. Rear panel controls for ISO and flash will be tough with heavy gloves.



I've also got a G10. I posted a review of it on this thread. http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18929&page=2


I don't think my results with the G10 compare favorably to Trevor's, which probably has a lot more to do with the shooter than the camera! :)


I think the G10 is a decent camera at low ISOs. My opinion of it suffers because I was hoping/expecting it to be a 50D or 5DMkI in a rangefinder form factor.

Upsides of the G10 for your purpose:
1. Ability to shoot in RAW format (highly recommended, even if you don't know why you would at this point).
2. Larger, better quality lens than most P&S type cameras
3. Good image quality at low ISO
4. High MP count enables digital zoom / crop that will still yield useful images
5. Knob controls will be useable with heavily gloved hands. P&S cameras typically rely on buttons and menus, which will be very tough to utilize with heavy gloves.
6. Large rear display
7. Optical viewfinder enables low-current operation mode, extends battery life.
8. Fully functional hot shoe
9. Semi-pro level controls and features (though frankly, these are unlikely to be used in your scenario)

Downsides of the G10 for your purposes:
1. Proprietary batteries.
2. Larger battery and charger form factor than SD series cameras.
3. Larger camera body form factor than SD series or other compact P&S
4. No weather sealing
5. Heavy, high mass compared to compact P&S
6. Steep learning curve if you plan to use semi-pro features, very deep menu system (this will be true of any camera with semi-pro capabilities)



Note: Canon also introduced a weatherproof / submersible P&S at PMA 2009, the D10. http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=2590&modelid=18332

They claim it is freeze-proof.
 
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colotaco

Adventurer
Has anyone heard of cameragiantinc.com? They have the G10 brand new for $209.00 That's less than half as other retailers? Still trying to find the G9 at a cheaper price than the G10, haven't found it yet.
 

dhackney

Expedition Leader
Has anyone heard of cameragiantinc.com? They have the G10 brand new for $209.00 That's less than half as other retailers?


If something seems too good to be true, then it almost always is...

Be very wary of buying from unknown, off-label or mystery suppliers.

Cameras are often sold "as new" that aren't.

Non U.S. market (grey market) cameras are often sold here that carry no U.S. warranty.

A few dollars, even a lot of dollars saved, will not seem worth it when you get out there if the camera doesn't work and it especially won't seem worth it when you get back and there's no U.S. market warranty.

Your local photography/camera store (if there are any left in your area) would be a good thing to support and be trustworthy.

B&H and the other well-known online retailers you see mentioned here are trusted suppliers.

A major big box store is a trusted supplier.
 

teotwaki

Excelsior!
Follow this link to our website: www.theveteranscoalition.org/operation_denali

Yes, I live in Colorado so I've been pulling sleds, tires and have done a few winter camps at altitude.

I followed as much as I could but some of the blogs are incomplete. I saw what I think was a video on YouTube. Overall it seemed as if there were no injuries and that the schedule worked out well. I'm very happy for the whole team.
 
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t0mills

Adventurer
This might not be ideal for you, but these cameras are pretty tough.

Casio Exilim Series

http://exilim.casio.com/



My ex had one, and used it quite a bit. One night we went out to eat, and when she got out, it fell out of the truck. Didn't see it when she got back in (dark outside) and I proceeded to run directly over it. Keep in mind, this was in a parking lot, so the pavement was quite hard.

A few miles down the road, we realized it was missing, and turned around to look for it. It was laying right where I had ran it over, and I figured it was ruined...

Turned out, that the screen was broken, so you couldn't really see what pictures you were taking, but it still took great pics! The zoom lens still extended and retracted, and all of the features worked.


It's durability really surprised me, especially since it isn't marketed as "rugged" or anything.
 

teotwaki

Excelsior!
He has not been on the forum since May 11th. Probably still recuperating from the climb. Looks like two of the folks summited on the 16th and the whole group was off the mountain around the 19th.

http://alaskamountaineeringschool.b...-max=2009-06-18T19:18:00-08:00&max-results=10

Tuesday, June 16, 2009
Operation Denali Summits!

Kirby called at about 6:30 pm Alaska Time from the summit of Denali! "The first Wounded Warrior to summit was David Shebib, followed by Marc, followed by Bob" He said it was cold and windy so they were going to take some pictures and move on down. Their "SPOT" tracker is a bit off, but more accurate than we expected - Matt had informed me before they left that maps tend to be off by about 500 meters south and 200 meters east. If you want to follow their Spot Tracker, check out their website: Operation Denali These guys have worked tirelessly to make this climb happen, before they ever arrived in Talkeetna. Job Well Done! Congratulations!
 

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