Kmrtnsn
Explorer
You and me both.
Barn Door for JK factory hardtops
- Thread starter jscherb
- Start date
You and me both.
Haf-E
Expedition Leader
This would be a great option for Ursa Minor to offer for the J30 poptop camper for the JKs. I would think that the glass lift gate is a hassle with the poptop open and it would negate the need to buy the rear glass hatch when the starting JK is a soft top....
I am not convinced a rear wiper is necessary though.
I am not convinced a rear wiper is necessary though.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
A wiper (and defroster) could be optional, if you don't currently find a use for them on your JK then I guess you wouldn't need them on the barn door either.
Personally I use the wiper and washer on my LJ Safari Cab barn door all the time, I wouldn't want to be without that feature. I don't have a defroster on my Safari Cab though, and I don't miss that at all, even though I live in snowy upstate NY.
Both could be optional and could be eliminated to reduce cost if someone didn't want them.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
Here's the part that was molded yesterday just popped off the mold master. It needs to be trimmed and the PVA mold release (the greenish color) needs to be washed off.
After rough trimming and washing:
This part is a negative image of the mold master, so it could serve as a mold to make the final outer skins, but instead this one will be used to make the mold master for the inner skin. The inner skin basically has to be a negative of the outer skin, plus the window framing structure and the wiper motor cavity. The barn door upper is made up of two skins which will be bonded together after molding. They'll look something like this:
There are several reasons for making inner and outer skins. First, the smooth gelcoat surface is only on one side of a fiberglass part, so doing two skins means that a nice gelcoat surface can be on all surfaces of the final part - the raw fiberglass sides of the two skins get bonded together. Second, there needs to be a cavity at the bottom for the wiper motor, and having double skins makes it easy to form that cavity.
So the part just molded will have the wiper the cavity and window framing built up on it, and when that's done the result will be the mold master for the inner skin. Then a mold will be made of that new master. Also a mold will be made of the original mold master for the outer skin and the set of molds will be complete.
BTW making the mold master for the inner skin from a part molded off the outer skin master accomplishes two things - it ensures that the curves on the two skins will be an exact match for each other, and it provides a nice gelcoat finish for the mold master for the inner skin.
After rough trimming and washing:
This part is a negative image of the mold master, so it could serve as a mold to make the final outer skins, but instead this one will be used to make the mold master for the inner skin. The inner skin basically has to be a negative of the outer skin, plus the window framing structure and the wiper motor cavity. The barn door upper is made up of two skins which will be bonded together after molding. They'll look something like this:
There are several reasons for making inner and outer skins. First, the smooth gelcoat surface is only on one side of a fiberglass part, so doing two skins means that a nice gelcoat surface can be on all surfaces of the final part - the raw fiberglass sides of the two skins get bonded together. Second, there needs to be a cavity at the bottom for the wiper motor, and having double skins makes it easy to form that cavity.
So the part just molded will have the wiper the cavity and window framing built up on it, and when that's done the result will be the mold master for the inner skin. Then a mold will be made of that new master. Also a mold will be made of the original mold master for the outer skin and the set of molds will be complete.
BTW making the mold master for the inner skin from a part molded off the outer skin master accomplishes two things - it ensures that the curves on the two skins will be an exact match for each other, and it provides a nice gelcoat finish for the mold master for the inner skin.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
I did some concept drawings of ambulance doors (that's what 2 doors in the back are commonly called) for the JK a few years ago (one of the concept drawings is below), but decided the barn door project I'm currently doing made more sense.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
The problem with a window that opens at the bottom is that if it opens out, the third brake light mount will interfere with it. If the third brake light mount wasn't installed you'd pick up a couple of inches of clearance, so you could install a swing-out window, although it wouldn't be able to open as far as the ones in this photo because the spare would still interfere. And you'd likely have to remove the wiper blade to for the window to swing out.
A slider could be installed, although the center divider would interfere with the wiper, so you'd have to choose between a slider or a wiper.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
This is off-topic for the hard barn door subject, but I've been playing with more ideas for a freedom panel replacement idea...
This concept would consist of 2 hard panels, plus a wrap-around rear soft panel:
I've shown both hard panels with sunroofs, but the panels could be solid, or a sunroof could only be in one of them. Whatever the person wanted.
The rear soft panel would unsnap, leaving just the two hard panels in place:
And one or both hard panels could be removed, here I've removed the front one:
Could also be made to accept the factory freedom panels in the front:
This concept would consist of 2 hard panels, plus a wrap-around rear soft panel:
I've shown both hard panels with sunroofs, but the panels could be solid, or a sunroof could only be in one of them. Whatever the person wanted.
The rear soft panel would unsnap, leaving just the two hard panels in place:
And one or both hard panels could be removed, here I've removed the front one:
Could also be made to accept the factory freedom panels in the front:
Not to highjack any further, but speaking of Freedom panels I called the dealership the otherday and they wanted $750 Canadian for each side! And 2800 bucks for the whole top! And that's just for a 2 door! I was thinking it would be neat to run the panels as a hardtop bikini but not at that price!
jscherb
Expedition Leader
Another way the barn door parts could be configured would be as a swing-up hatch. The factory hatch glass probably would be preferable to this option, but if you managed to break the factory glass and needed a replacement, this would be a possible way to go.
A few years ago I built a proof-of-concept camper using LJ Safari Cab parts. I based it on my Jeep-tub trailer, which has tailgates front and rear, so I configured the rear opening as a barn door, and the front one as a swing-up hatch with a drop-down CJ tailgate. I never took the proof-of-concept to completion, so there are no windows installed, but these photos show the two different configurations.
Barn door configuration:
Swing-up hatch configuration:
I configured the swing-up with a separate locking latch, but if the JK barn door were configured as a swing-up hatch, it could be held closed by the tailgate the same way a factory liftgate glass would be.
I doubt the barn door as a swing-up would be a popular configuration but for those who broke their expensive factory glass, it could be an option
.
A few years ago I built a proof-of-concept camper using LJ Safari Cab parts. I based it on my Jeep-tub trailer, which has tailgates front and rear, so I configured the rear opening as a barn door, and the front one as a swing-up hatch with a drop-down CJ tailgate. I never took the proof-of-concept to completion, so there are no windows installed, but these photos show the two different configurations.
Barn door configuration:
Swing-up hatch configuration:
I configured the swing-up with a separate locking latch, but if the JK barn door were configured as a swing-up hatch, it could be held closed by the tailgate the same way a factory liftgate glass would be.
I doubt the barn door as a swing-up would be a popular configuration but for those who broke their expensive factory glass, it could be an option
.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
It would cost WAY less than that to make my one-piece Freedom panel replacement panel
.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
Today I'm beginning construction of the framing around the window and the wiper motor cavity for the inner skin mold master. It'll look approximately like the drawing below - there will be a raised structure surrounding the window to give the barn door the rigidity it needs, and a cavity across the bottom that will house the wiper motor, and provide a place for the door mounting hardware to attach.
The first step is laying out the locations of the components on the fiberglass piece we made the other day. The black line is the outline of the inside of the hatch opening in the hardtop, it was traced by holding the fiberglass part up against the hardtop. The blue tape represents the outline of the window. The wiper motor is a printout at full scale, and an actual wiper arm is used for the mockup. The thin lines of 1/4" masking tape show where the wiper is at its highest vertical point and at full 110-degree travel. The green tape is the location of the hardware to mount it to the tailgate.
The other night Tom and I epoxied the fiberglass shell to a set of forms made to the exact curve of the hatch glass. The fiberglass part was already molded to that shape, but since until the inner structure gets built up and the final mold is made it'll be a little flexible, the forms will ensure the curves are exactly correct.
The first step is laying out the locations of the components on the fiberglass piece we made the other day. The black line is the outline of the inside of the hatch opening in the hardtop, it was traced by holding the fiberglass part up against the hardtop. The blue tape represents the outline of the window. The wiper motor is a printout at full scale, and an actual wiper arm is used for the mockup. The thin lines of 1/4" masking tape show where the wiper is at its highest vertical point and at full 110-degree travel. The green tape is the location of the hardware to mount it to the tailgate.
The other night Tom and I epoxied the fiberglass shell to a set of forms made to the exact curve of the hatch glass. The fiberglass part was already molded to that shape, but since until the inner structure gets built up and the final mold is made it'll be a little flexible, the forms will ensure the curves are exactly correct.
jscherb
Expedition Leader
The mold master for the inner skin of the barn door is almost done. All it needs is some bodywork to smooth the frame into the fiberglass panel, then everything will be shot with high-build primer, sanded, and shot with epoxy for a final finish. Then the final mold will be made from it.
Here's how it fits in the opening of the hardtop (photo was taken before the frame was epoxied to the fiberglass shell):
Here's how it fits in the opening of the hardtop (photo was taken before the frame was epoxied to the fiberglass shell):
greggNJ
Observer
This is an interesting idea. I run my soft top as much as I can so a barn door wouldn't work for me but I like see cool stuff for JK's anyhow.
I will be following the development of the JK Gatezilla. That really interests me since I'd like to have the option for a cargo rack above the spare tire and maybe a gas can like in one of your pictures.
I really like that LJ!
I will be following the development of the JK Gatezilla. That really interests me since I'd like to have the option for a cargo rack above the spare tire and maybe a gas can like in one of your pictures.
I really like that LJ!