Black Friday Ambo

flightcancled

Explorer
It doesn't seem that bad. Most switches on both boards have terminals for power, ground, and signal. What's funky is that the Road Rescue (donor) pulled power from the board to the switch, then sent signal back. Med-Tec ran a single hot wire to the board and then jumped that to the switches to give power for the signal back to the board. Not a big deal.

What's going to be a major headache is figuring out the illumination for the board, and how to make the meters work. There's a huge cluster of wires with tons of labels to circuits that don't seem related going to the board that runs all that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

flightcancled

Explorer
6emyna5y.jpg


Steps are finally installed. They run from the lowest point I could drill to the highest in the frame. Spacing is 14" center to center.

Hopefully I can muster the courage to swap the panels over tomorrow. It's scary pulling apart something that's working and risk making a HUGE mess.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

patoz

Expedition Leader
Steps are finally installed. They run from the lowest point I could drill to the highest in the frame. Spacing is 14" center to center.

Hopefully I can muster the courage to swap the panels over tomorrow. It's scary pulling apart something that's working and risk making a HUGE mess.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


The steps look good! Have you tried climbing them yet?

On your wiring, the only thing I can suggest from here is to:

1. Take lots of pictures before you take anything apart.
2. Draw lots of diagrams first.
3. Label everything with some masking tape or computer labels before disconnecting.
4. Don't beat yourself up too bad for trying to 'fix something that wasn't broke', in case it doesn't work afterwards. :)
 

flightcancled

Explorer
Alrighty well it all came apart. Going back together wasn't horrible but I still have glitches to sort out. I have lost the modular disconnect (AGAIN!!!). Whatever switch I put it to plugging the signal wire into the signal slot causes the relay to throw on the board (not all the way I'm guessing, but I can hear it), and the indicator light to glow on the switch saying its on- even when it's off!

The reverse signal kill switch is working too well. It seems to be working when I put it in reverse, but I am not able to get the reverse signal back on.

The primary/secondary switch doesn't want to work with the master power on, but with the master power off I can toss the secondaries on (but not all of them I think)

I'm stumped, but my thought is it has to do with how those circuits pull their power. At least the master and most of what it controls are working. It's also cool to see the voltage display work. Amps are reading zero but there might be something I'm missing with that too.

The cat had the right idea. I'll try again later.

u2agejad.jpg



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

flightcancled

Explorer
So the board has slowly been coming to life. I figured out that some circuits (modular disconnect and flashers) are reverse polarized. So instead of sending a current as signal, grounding the signal wire trips the relay.

The only switch that is still stumping me is restoring the backup alarm. It has a labeled wire which gets power from the relay board when I put the truck in reverse. From there though I can't make the siren turn on. This has to work or I can't legally drive the rig...

Since that's been going well I also started working on pulling other elements into the heads-up display. I have no use for the patient code lights, but if I can make the compartment or door signals working that would be cool (not really important or helpful, but cool). All I really want is to get the board illumination working, but this far I can't figure it out. Jumping power or ground to the labeled wire doesn't do anything.

I have managed to get the amp and volt meter displays up and running, so that's a start! What's funny about that though is one amp wire is labeled amps signal P and one is amps signal -. The - gives a really negative reading while the p gives a correct reading. Also the volts were supposed to read from the modular disconnect circuit, but that gives a rather inaccurate and volatile reading compared to jumping power from somewhere else on the circuit board.

I will say that there is no underestimating the complexity of the ambulance wiring. For example, I never would have dreamed that removing the cab switch board would have killed my reversing lights, but somehow they only come on when a board (any board) is connected up front.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

patoz

Expedition Leader
So the board has slowly been coming to life. I figured out that some circuits (modular disconnect and flashers) are reverse polarized. So instead of sending a current as signal, grounding the signal wire trips the relay.

I meant to suggest that to you a while back, but apparently I forgot to. Sorry!

The only switch that is still stumping me is restoring the backup alarm. It has a labeled wire which gets power from the relay board when I put the truck in reverse. From there though I can't make the siren turn on. This has to work or I can't legally drive the rig...

When you say "siren", I assume you are referring to the backup 'beeper' alarm, right? It would be illegal to drive with the emergency siren going since you are not an emergency vehicle, but I'm sure you know that.

Since that's been going well I also started working on pulling other elements into the heads-up display. I have no use for the patient code lights, but if I can make the compartment or door signals working that would be cool (not really important or helpful, but cool). All I really want is to get the board illumination working, but this far I can't figure it out. Jumping power or ground to the labeled wire doesn't do anything.

Normally, that would just consist of a circuit from the vehicle dash lights to the illumination terminal of each switch, just like any add-on switch or gage, but in this case I don't know. Those from the donor vehicle look like Carling Contura II or III V Series switches. The much older ones had incandescent backlight bulbs, and the newer ones are LED. Some of the first generation LEDs needed a small voltage regulator circuit to fire them, so if yours are LED you might look for something like that. Also, they have two bulbs in each switch. One (usually green) is the dash light and indicates the presence of power, and the other one (usually red) lights when the switch is activated. The newer LEDs can even have a controller that can adjust things like brightness, flashing, and lockout. Here are the Switch Circuit Diagrams, but the trick is figuring out which switch you have, and you have several types.

I have managed to get the amp and volt meter displays up and running, so that's a start! What's funny about that though is one amp wire is labeled amps signal P and one is amps signal -. The - gives a really negative reading while the p gives a correct reading. Also the volts were supposed to read from the modular disconnect circuit, but that gives a rather inaccurate and volatile reading compared to jumping power from somewhere else on the circuit board.

I have an idea about the AMP meter, but I'll come back to this one after a little more research.

I will say that there is no underestimating the complexity of the ambulance wiring. For example, I never would have dreamed that removing the cab switch board would have killed my reversing lights, but somehow they only come on when a board (any board) is connected up front.

Some vehicles use a negatively switched backup light switch also, so check the switch mounted on your brake pedal to find out which type you have.

Good luck and just remember, I'll be going through all of this in a little while also.
 

flightcancled

Explorer
I actually have been around carling switches for a while now between working on boats and adding them into my truck. These are the oldest I think I have worked with though.

Luckily these are incandescent because otherwise making the switch indicator light up would be an even bigger pain for the reverse wired circuits. I did take advantage of this bug for the modular disconnect- any time power is on to the board the modular disconnect light glows green. That should be handy!

What I am having issues with is the display illumination, the circuit that lights up the panel itself so I can read what switch is what. I haven't tried pulling power directly from the designated illumination wire because it seemed like it shouldn't matter, but maybe that will be the trick.

I forgot to mention that amoung all the other wires I found a "low volt light" display wire. This would not come on when given a normal ~12v or ground. Maybe the board actually has a built in system to tell you when the batteries are low? If I had a 9v battery lying around I could probably find out that way.

Finally, the one thing I will loose as it now stands is my battery display telling me what is on and what's off. Below you can see in the top right that both lights are on showing my batteries as being both on.

be3e2uhe.jpg


This sounds silly, but the selector only turns both on if rotated counterclockwise, and sometimes it's hard to figure out if both are on without something telling you it's on. I am going to have to try and see if I can use the patient code lights to work as a new indicator. From what I can see all the color signal wires go to one multiple-color LED. Will I burn it out if I am sending it two codes at once? Hooking battery indicator lights to a corresponding color is simple, but what happens when I throw both on at once?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

patoz

Expedition Leader
This sounds silly, but the selector only turns both on if rotated counterclockwise, and sometimes it's hard to figure out if both are on without something telling you it's on. I am going to have to try and see if I can use the patient code lights to work as a new indicator. From what I can see all the color signal wires go to one multiple-color LED. Will I burn it out if I am sending it two codes at once? Hooking battery indicator lights to a corresponding color is simple, but what happens when I throw both on at once?

I can't answer that question, but I do know when you get into printed circuit boards and microprocessors, etc. you open up a whole new can of worms. Voltage, resistance, current flow, etc. are a lot more critical that it is with plain old toggle switches and wire.

Alex, I'm guessing the main reason you wanted to change the panels out was to gain more leg room when moving back and forth. With all of the problems and incompatibilities you have run into so far, have you considered keeping the original panel and just redesigning a housing for it similar to the one from the donor vehicle? It looks to be in good condition and is not a bad looking panel, especially if it was cleaned up some. That way everything will work as designed, and you could add a small sub panel if you need additional circuits.

Just an observation from someone who's been there, done that, and then decided it didn't need fixing in the first place. :confused:
 

flightcancled

Explorer
I don't really do things halfway. At this point I am all in. As it stands I have everything back to where I started with the exception of the back-up alarm. Realistically there are only so many ways that it could possibly be wired together so I'll have it all soon.

With a little more tweaking I will find what it takes to make the illumination work, and then I'll be ahead if where I started. Anything else from there is gravy. I'm pretty close on the "door/compartment open" and the "modular disconnect on" signals too.


Realistically I haven't blown enough time on this to make it anywhere close to a waste in my eyes. Plus I already had to strip the stock board clean and snip wiring harnesses so I'm in too deep to start looking back....

Once spring paddling and work calm down I'm sure things will be back up to speed.

3u5ymara.jpg


6yru4ajy.jpg



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

patoz

Expedition Leader
Yep, it sounds like you're past the point of no return on that. Actually you sound like me, once I make my mind up to do something a certain way, I'm not happy until I get it there.

You must be near a dam in those pictures. I had a flatwater 16' kayak for 10 years that I camped out of, and I've done a little whitewater rafting, but nothing like that. Looks like fun!

BTW, I returned your PM with my shipping info. Thanks..
 

flightcancled

Explorer
PM'ed you back. Hope you don't have sticker shock!

So the mutli-color patient code display I want to convert to my heads-up battery display has 3 colors, red, amber and green. My thought is that this is probably 3 different LEDs on the same spot, or a single multi-led. Knowing a led is limited by a minimum voltage and a maximum current, I have to be cautious combining both battery signal wires to one led. Even if I did though there isn't a combination of those colors that doesn't end with something confusing (red+amber= sorta amber orange) or a lovely brown.

My thought is to use a relay to solve this problem. Someone correct me if I am wrong, but a double pull- triple throw relay could be wired to both indicator circuits then it could turn on green (both batteries are on) and simultaneously kill red (batt 1) and amber (batt 2).

I'm going to keep looking for a relay that will do all this in one unit, or possibly just suffer with red/amber/"orange"

Also is there any reason to swap my current old school idle controller with this new one?
u4a7enez.jpg



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Last edited:

flightcancled

Explorer
sasa5aze.jpg


You can see the displays are running to show amps/volts. Turned out it was 3 LEDs. Red is battery one and yellow battery 2. I guess in looking away to touch wires to power I never noticed they weren't in the exact same place. You can also see the modular disconnect switch is illuminated so I can find it quickly at night.

I wound up abandoning the signal lights for the compartments, doors and modular disconnect. They were just not compatible with the medtec system for reasons I still don't understand.

The only thing that I am still fighting with is the illumination lighting. I really want the board to glow! The only thing I can think of is there is some sort of little box between the board and the strip which says 14 volts on it. Maybe it wants more juice?

Now on to cleaning up the mounting box and getting it in place.

e7ejuzyd.jpg


Nothing too fancy. I am making brackets from angle aluminum to bolt into the dog house and bending the box tabs as best as I can to make a good fit. When it's done it will be compact while still having room for the wires in the back to clear the doghouse. (It's suddenly way more crowded back there)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Last edited:

patoz

Expedition Leader
That looks really nice, and I can see why you wanted the digital gages now. Of course, now you're going to have to put some kind of cool kayaking sticker over the Road Rescue logo to make it look like it belongs there! :cool:

Are the labels painted on/decals or are they stick on? Blue Sea Systems has a set which is primarily for boats, but also has a lot in common with campers. These are stick on, but may fit just inside of the painted rectangles of your panel. The dimensions are: (H)3/8in x (W)5/8in.

http://www.amazon.com/Blue-Sea-Syst...sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1397705106&sr=1-23

http://www.jamestowndistributors.com/userportal/product.do?part=39318&AMAZON&CA_6C15C=458013293
 
Last edited:

flightcancled

Explorer
Great thought, had it too. Mine are printed on so where you see lettering is actually transparent. The whole thing is on a piece of plexi that's supposed to diffuse light from a little strip thingy. The strip is the source of my frustrations. I had issues with them on my old board too, they seem to like to burn out. Hopefully there is a reasonable way to fix it.

Forgot to add that reverse alarm is still MIA. I have a feeling that the issue is elsewhere though because I am tripping the relay with the switch.

More information to any that follow: I can't remember if this is my doing, but when I shift into reverse my rear load lights come on automatically. (I added the rear scene lights into the loop which has been extremely helpful.) Now if power to your rear load switch is bussed together with other switches controlled by the master this can bring your whole master circuit to life. This can be a good or bad thing, but so far I have found it handy to be able to add more lights while in reverse without having to hit the master. This could be really bad if you are reversing out of a parking lot and your illegal flashers suddenly come on. Yes, I checked, and even white flashers can be illegal without a permit.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

flightcancled

Explorer
Spent some time wrapping up the board conversion. Here's the initial mounting for the box:

9yne3e8y.jpg


anu4y6a7.jpg


Now that it is at least held in place I can make brackets to pull the top back so it tilts upwards for easier use.

I also took a few minutes to start finalizing mounting arrangements.

ena6emus.jpg


ha8uhe2y.jpg


The steps are working very well for me thus far. Now that I am getting used to them I am flying up an down this thing.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Forum statistics

Threads
188,694
Messages
2,909,174
Members
230,892
Latest member
jesus m anderson
Top