Communication options

[Lynn]

You may want to take some time to review and listen to Doug Ritter's presentation on commercial distress alerting services vs. PLBs (linked a few posts back). It's from a couple years ago, so his reference for commercial service was SPOT (inReach didn't exist at the time). He makes a case that the USAF guys on the other end of the line will be more likely to know who to call for a specific type of rescue in a particular area than 911 will. It's the difference between someone who does something full time, vs. someone who mainly gets other types of calls such as a report of an auto accident, a heart attack or other critical health issue, or (from a recent news item) a sandwich not being made correctly.

Again, I don't claim to be an expert, so in deference to Mr. Ritter, I did go back to the referenced link. It takes me to the EquippedToSurvive main page, not a specific article. So I searched 'PLB' on his site, and still did not find that specific presentation. I did, however, find a paper in which he stated that the absolute MINIMUM comm set he carries is a SAT phone and a PLB. And the PLB is only in case the SAT phone fails. He also mentioned that the PLB distress signal eventually gets routed to the RCMP (Canadian Sheriff ) for first action.

So I have to stick to my argument, that a cell phone, SAT phone, or HAM radio autopatch to 911 should get a faster response.

His comment about the Air Force knowing who to call to respond to a particular area may have been in reference to the fact that the AFRCC handles inland (PLB), marine (EPIRB), and aviation (ELT) beacons, and will respond appropriately?

 

[Karma]

Hi,
I don't see that fast response is the most important criteria to judge emergency response systems. Obviously, there are limits to this statement. Fast response is desirable but a few minutes is not important. Hours, days, yes, they are important. But that's not what we are talking about. PLB response time has historically been shown to be excellent. Is it the fastest possible? I don't know and I don't care.

But far more important than minor differences in response time is the basic reliability of the system. In the case of the PLB system, it is the most reliable based upon its track record. This is what is important to me. No need to guess or speculate about this.

Sparky

 

[Lynn]

Wow, after really hijacking the thread I discovered we (maybe just I?) have really been muddying the waters. Good thing I pointed out I'm no expert. Twice.

My apologies, but please allow me one additional post to try to straighten things out. Even though it's lengthy. Maybe a clear understanding will help the OP with his decision?

InReach IS NOT A PLB per se. I was under the misconception that it is.

InReach, SPOT, Yellowbrick, etc. are better referred to as Satellite Emergency Notification Devices (SENDs).

SENDs can send and (some) receive complex messages. PLBs just send a simple distress signal.

SENDs require a subscription service. PLBs don't.

SENDs use the Iridium satellite network. PLBs use SARSAT.

SENDs route distress calls to International Emergency Response Coordination Centres (IERCCs), presumably also a commercial entity. PLBs send distress calls to NOAA* and AFRCC*, government agencies.

In the PLB world, the AFRCC* tries to establish it is a true emergency before passing the distress call to 'local POCs (Sheriff*).'

In the SEND world, the IERCC tries to establish it is a true emergency before passing the distress call to 'the appropriate responders.' Presumably a 'missing person' type report to the local LE (Sheriff), since I can't imagine a commercial agency directing the activites of the USAF*.

Which to choose? Maybe it depends on where you travel. PLBs have a 40-country international agreement. SENDs use an international satellite system, but response would be limited to areas that the IERCCs database has contact info for. I couldn't find any info on that.

Personally, I'd get a PLB since I don't need the texting (or online tracking) capabilites of a SEND, emergency response is supported by international agreement, and there is no subscription to pay. But I would try my cell phone first...

Again, my apologies.

*Or equivalent agencies outside the US.

 

[Karma]

HI Lynn,
Yes, I carry a cell phone into the wilds. It would be my method of first resort in a rescue scenario. Often, I can't get a signal. But at other times I can get out in some of the most surprising places. It's a total crap shoot. Generally, in deep canyons the cell will not work and neither will 2m ham radio. The Moab area is a good example of where cell towers and 2m repeaters are very problematic especially in the huge Canyonlands National Park where neither are allowed. Neither method is one you would want to bet your life on. This, in fact, applies to any technology that is based on cell phone technology such as SPOT.

Without trying to be overly redundant, but to make a point, PLB's do not suffer from the same system drawbacks. With PLB you are communicating directly with a satellite using a strong and powerful signal (much more potent than SPOT) with a fixed message content that defines the GPS position of the emergency call (your position). Furthermore, after a contact has been sent, multiple times, the PLB switches out of the high power mode to the low power Radio Direction Finder mode where the unit sends a series of RF beeps until the battery finally runs out. This is to help Search and Rescue precisely locate you using radio direction finding gear. All Search and Rescue teams are equipped to receive this signal and, since it is standardized, there is no guess work.

While the PLB system does not have all the bells and whistles that, for example, SPOT provides, its simplicity accounts for much of its reliability. I really don't care what my wife had for diner that night. The PLB is not a participant in the social network. I like it that way. All I want is to get rescued in a timely manner.

Other PLB system aspects may interest you. The battery in a PLB is not user serviceable. It is sealed inside the PLB. It is a high capacity lithium battery with a shelf life of 5 years. The battery replacement date is stamped on a label that is applied to the PLB in a very robust way. It will not fall off! After 5 years from the time the PLB is registered, it must replaced. This can only be done by an authorized PLB service center. You must send your unit in for service. It's not cheap. But is cheapness the issue? ACR, the manufacturer of my PLB, charges $150 for a replacement battery. But, this is much more than a simple battery replacement. The entire unit is tested and compared to a set of strict data sets. This is to insure that the unit is operating properly. All this is part of the PLB protocol, not a manufacturers choice. And it is documented.

Furthermore, after the PLB has been activated it is strongly suggested that the unit is sent in for a battery replacement and system test. My ACR PLB is due for a battery replacement in December of this year. Dates and serial numbers are all maintained by the agency with which you registered the unit. Every year an email message is sent to me asking for verification of my ownership (that I haven't sold it), and that my contact information is still valid. The protocol tries to do what it can to insure that the system will work when it is needed without fail.

Additionally, all PLB's are subjected to rigorous development testing much like NASA qualification programs. So, when you buy a PLB, there is a very high assurance that the design and the individual unit are operating according to spec. And it is documented.

None of the other systems have such careful quality assurance. SPOT, for example, has nothing more than the good graces of the manufacturer to guarantee proper and reliable operation. Depending on the manufacturer, this may be OK but there are no watchdog agencies overlooking the process. Again, it's a crap shoot. PLB is different and infinitely better.

Sparky

 

[cnynrat]

The FCC Order FCC 02-271 referenced by Lynn above is indeed the Report & Order that established the FCC rules regarding 406 MHz distress alerting beacons (aka PLBs) in 2002. Note that this rulemaking does not apply to SPOT, inReach et al as these devices do not operate on the 406 MHz frequency used by the COSPAS-SARSAT satellite system. This rulemaking is only applicable to devices operating at 406 MHz.

As Lynn already described, the order mandates that the USAF continue to be the central location where all PLB distress messages are received and forwarded to the proper local agency. I note that the order mandates that each state designate a single point of contact with the USAF AFRCC. I don't know which agency that would be for each state, but I'm guessing there are at least three layers or steps involved in engaging the appropriate SAR agency in response to a distress alert: AFRCC --> Designated State Agency --> Appropriate local SAR agency (Sheriff, etc.).

Also, we should clarify that not all SENDS type devices use Iridium. Here are the constellations used by each of the three major types of distress alerting devices:

• The DeLorme inReach service does use the Iridium constellation
• SPOT uses the Globalstar constellation
• PLB's use the COSPAS-SARSAT constellation. COSPAS-SARSAT was developed as an international distress alerting system by Canada, France, the U.S. and the former Soviet Union.

Lynn - If you are interested in Doug Ritter's presentation, follow this link to his page titled "What Price Your Life? Distress Alerting as a Commercial Service.". Scroll down to the fourth paragraph and you will find a link to download a PDF of the presentation as well as a link to the audio of his talk. I would again emphasize that the standardization activities underway by the RTCM may eventually overcome some of the concerns expressed by Doug to the extent that the standard establishes service level commitments that the commercial services agree to uphold.

I suspect none of us are truely experts in the area. Certainly I am not. A part of my real life work has been in the area of satellite communications for aviation applications, but not specifically in the domain of distress alerting. I probably fall in the zone of "knows enough to be dangerous" on this particular subject. That said, I think the community here benefits when we all share what we do know.

 

[Edroid]

Iridium Sat Phone

I'll chime in in this regarding the sat phone. I do a lot of solo back country skiing and mountain biking, and I always carry an iridium extreme phone.

It is light, tough, water resistant, the batteries last seemingly forever, and it always seems to work. Cost is up to $1,700 plus additional talk time packages; mine is $38 per month and $1.20/min. (My talk time package does not seem to be available to newer subscribers.)

The question was asked, "who you gonna call?" The answer is any one I want, anywhere in the world! In practice I make very few calls (mostly to just test the phone) due to the $1.20 per minute charge on my particular plan.

The extreme model has a "panic button" type feature that will send the GPS coordinates to a contact that you program into the phone, including GEOS, a private search and rescue and medivac coordination service (at no additional fee).

The sat phone saved my brothers legs two years ago. To make a long story short, my brother had an accident out on a hiking trip where a huge log rolled onto his legs. The location was reported incorrectly to the local SAR guys, and we couldn't find my brother. I was able to call the individual who had reported the accident and verify the correct location from out in the field, and coordinate the medivac helicopter. There was no other communication available. The doctor said that if he were out much longer he certainly would have lost his leg due to the extreme trauma.

To me it is well worth the expense. In the long list of expensive insurance that we all buy, the iridium phone is a bargain.

 

[cnynrat]

The extreme model has a "panic button" type feature that will send the GPS coordinates to a contact that you program into the phone, including GEOS, a private search and rescue and medivac coordination service (at no additional fee).

Just a note, GEOS is the same commercial service used by SPOT. They operate a call center located in Houston.

The sat phone saved my brothers legs two years ago. To make a long story short, my brother had an accident out on a hiking trip where a huge log rolled onto his legs. The location was reported incorrectly to the local SAR guys, and we couldn't find my brother. I was able to call the individual who had reported the accident and verify the correct location from out in the field, and coordinate the medivac helicopter. There was no other communication available. The doctor said that if he were out much longer he certainly would have lost his leg due to the extreme trauma.

I'd be interested in understanding a few more details about how the confusion about your brother's location arose. How was the original report made? At what point in the communication chain did the location information get reported wrong?

I think learning from these sorts of real world event can be very instructive about how the various systems work, and where the shortcomings might be found.

 

[Edroid]

I'd be interested in understanding a few more details about how the confusion about your brother's location arose. How was the original report made? At what point in the communication chain did the location information get reported wrong?

I think learning from these sorts of real world event can be very instructive about how the various systems work, and where the shortcomings might be found.

My brother was out hiking with his two kids. He was several miles from a forest service type road. No cell service here. He stopped to take a picture of his daughter who was climbing on a log, when the log rolled over on him and pinned (and crushed) his legs. Somehow, the kids got the extremely heavy log off his legs. . . .

His son, about 12 years old, ran out to the forest service road to get help. An older gentleman stopped and picked him up. As soon as he was in cell phone range he made a call to the local sheriff, but gave the wrong location to the sheriff. The older gentleman (luckily) called me also to tell me my brother had been in an accident. I threw my kit together and drove up to the reported location, just as the first wave of SAR guys were returning to the trailhead without finding my brother. It was only due to the sat phone that I could call the guy who had reported the accident and clarify exactly where he had picked up my nephew. He had just plain mixed up "Summit Creek" with "Kane Creek." I was then able to call the Blaine Co dispatcher and correct the accident location so that a closer SAR team could be dispatched.

I high tailed it back to the correct location and was actually the first person on the scene. He was mighty happy to see me. . . . I then used the sat phone to call dispatch with the exact GPS coordinates.

If my brother had had his own sat phone, he would have been rescued abut 8 hours sooner, and the rescue would not have been in the dark of night.

By the time it was all said and done the rescue involved 911 dispatchers from two counties, SAR from two counties, paramedics from Ketchum, forest service rangers, and a life flight helicopter.

I am totally sold on the Iridium phone. Not only can you make the emergency call from almost anywhere on earth, you can also differentiate and explain the nature of the emergency. It is a big difference between having an "emergency" of running out of margarita mix, or having someone with crushed legs. . .

 

[KA5IVR]

Sparky, I simply can’t let this go unchallenged. I see your point and yes I do enjoy Ham as a hobby but I got into it because I wanted access to the very valuable 2m band primarily for emergencies. I have been a ham for only a bit over two years. In that time it has brought one escalating dicey situation under control where it saved me from having to chose between two bad options. I’m sure I and other hams do bring a bias but you clearly do as well.

To say that 2m is not to be trusted is simply ridiculous. Does it work everywhere no questions asked? No. Is it unreliable? I would call that a gross simplification. I don’t think it is ‘the’ one and only right answer. But for some people and the type of travel they actually engage in, I think it is extremely valuable as a tool. The OP is a perfect example on this. Like any tool it has it uses but it not appropriate for every use.

To say hams should not be trusted to accurately reflect the uses and limitations of the modes they use… I would ask to whom you would recommend one turn for this information? Do you feel you or someone ells has a better idea of what kind of coverage to expect from 2m than say I do as a daily user?

Your facts are both inaccurate and misleading. While 2m is nominally considered a line of site band because it generally does not propagate it is MUCH lower than cell. The lowest cell stuff is around 800MHz ranging all the way up to 2600MHz. 2m is around 146MHz. These lower frequencies are better at “walking around” terrain and vegetation. This is just a fact. In addition you insinuate that 2m repeater coverage is similar to cell coverage and at least in northern California that is a ridiculous comparison. I barely get cell coverage at my home but I can hit dozens of repeaters up to 120 miles away with a 5w hand held.

Anyway I can concede that there are some that think ham is the end all be all of communications because they are ham zealots. But I think your comment is very over the top. There is a lot of good, true and useful information on this site about amateur radio and its uses that should not be discounted.

I strongly concur!

Sorry Sparky, but I have several experiences using VHF (2m) that proves your theory wrong. We have had this discussion before and I still feel having backup or redundant devices is very important. Just to let you know, I am planning on getting a PLB before my next Jeep trip to CO, even though I will have repeater coverage and limited cell service. Hope you guys in LA are doing good!

 

[Karma]

HI KA5IVR,
I have no problems with redundant devices at all. I think it is a good idea. However, that is not the issue we are discussing. Hell, have as many radios as you want. But be sure at least one of them is 100% effective. That would be the PLB. Everything else is just a play toy for ham zealots. :ylsmoke: We have no disagreement.

Sparky

 

[cnynrat]

My brother was out hiking with his two kids. He was several miles from a forest service type road. No cell service here. He stopped to take a picture of his daughter who was climbing on a log, when the log rolled over on him and pinned (and crushed) his legs. Somehow, the kids got the extremely heavy log off his legs. . . .

His son, about 12 years old, ran out to the forest service road to get help. An older gentleman stopped and picked him up. As soon as he was in cell phone range he made a call to the local sheriff, but gave the wrong location to the sheriff. The older gentleman (luckily) called me also to tell me my brother had been in an accident. I threw my kit together and drove up to the reported location, just as the first wave of SAR guys were returning to the trailhead without finding my brother. It was only due to the sat phone that I could call the guy who had reported the accident and clarify exactly where he had picked up my nephew. He had just plain mixed up "Summit Creek" with "Kane Creek." I was then able to call the Blaine Co dispatcher and correct the accident location so that a closer SAR team could be dispatched.

I high tailed it back to the correct location and was actually the first person on the scene. He was mighty happy to see me. . . . I then used the sat phone to call dispatch with the exact GPS coordinates.

If my brother had had his own sat phone, he would have been rescued abut 8 hours sooner, and the rescue would not have been in the dark of night.

By the time it was all said and done the rescue involved 911 dispatchers from two counties, SAR from two counties, paramedics from Ketchum, forest service rangers, and a life flight helicopter.

I am totally sold on the Iridium phone. Not only can you make the emergency call from almost anywhere on earth, you can also differentiate and explain the nature of the emergency. It is a big difference between having an "emergency" of running out of margarita mix, or having someone with crushed legs. . .

Thanks for sharing that story. One of the things to take away from this is that even seemingly routine low risk trips into the backcountry can turn into critical emergencies.

Clearly the Iridium phone option has a big advantage in terms of the richness of the communication it provides. The ability to communicate the nature of the emergency can be very valuable in many circumstances. It does come with a hefty price tag though.

 

[Mash5]

HI KA5IVR,
I have no problems with redundant devices at all. I think it is a good idea. However, that is not the issue we are discussing. Hell, have as many radios as you want. But be sure at least one of them is 100% effective. That would be the PLB. Everything else is just a play toy for ham zealots. :ylsmoke: We have no disagreement.

Sparky

Sparky,
I think everyone hears what you are saying, agrees more or less, and would maybe like to have discussion that goes a bit further into the merits of a vanity of Ecomms. For the OP I don't think an PLB would have been any use at all. A comfort yes, but I don't think he would have pulled the trigger. I know I would not have. He still had options, nobody was hurt etc. That opens the door for other types of communications to fill the void.

You have latched onto my use of the word zealots to describe the rare ham (I don't see any in this thread) that sees ham as the end all be all or communication, but I'm kinda seeing you as the one in the room that fits the following definition best.

Zealots: a person who has very strong feelings about something (such as religion or politics) and who wants other people to have those feelings: a zealous person

When anyone brings up or tries to discuss anything ells you reassert that it is not what we are talking about. In fact this thread is about a situation for which a PLB would not have been an appropriate use. PLBs are not the end all be all of communications.

 

[chris snell]

Great thread. I'm going to have to pick up a PLB. They're the perfect device for my own nightmare scenario: a vehicle fire or wreck while travelling solo in the backcountry.

My commo system of choice for a non-emergency vehicle breakdown situation is a portable HF amateur radio. I'm not about to summon SAR for a situation that a brother-in-law or AAA can remedy.

Here's my recommendation for a portable HF amateur radio setup that almost certainly could have summoned your brother-in-law to your GPS grid. This can easily fit under your seat, in a backpack, or in a small Pelican case:

- General-class FCC amateur license - VHF, APRS, and repeaters alone don't cut it when you're out in the sticks
- Radio: Elecraft KX3 (if you can afford it) or Yaesu FT-817 (if you can't)
- Battery: A123 Systems 4S1P battery and charger
- Buddistick from Buddipole Antennas, w/ coax cable
- cheap monopod (for cameras) from Amazon - $11
- bungee cords to secure monopod to tree/fence post/roof rack
- a laminated list of common emergency and low-power frequencies (14.300, QRP freqs, etc.)

I carry this setup whenever I'm on the trail. It's not dependent on the truck, the truck's batteries, or antenna mounted on the truck--these can all fail you. I don't use ham radio frequently but every time I've turned on my portable HF radio, I've made contact with someone within 10 minutes, regardless of where I am.

 

[FusoFG]

I think the inReach does the same thing a PLB does and more.

You can send an SOS to SAR that includes a lat lon. It doesn't have a homing beacon, but I think that's a holdover to before GPS location was provided with the SOS message.

You can communicate with SAR during the rescue to describe the nature of your emergency, get medical advice, etc.

Plus you can communicate with friends, family, support team members, etc to get assistance in event of non life threatening emergencies.

You can change the batteries yourself. You can test the unit easily before and during your trip.

The two way communication features of the Iridium network ensure an acknowledgement that your messages have been sent successfully.

You can use automatic tracking feature to indicate where to start a search in the event you don't return on time and are unable to initiate an SOS request.

 

[1911]

My commo system of choice for a non-emergency vehicle breakdown situation is a portable HF amateur radio. I'm not about to summon SAR for a situation that a brother-in-law or AAA can remedy.

Bingo; and as Mashurst pointed out this was the premise of the OP in the first place.

Here's my recommendation for a portable HF amateur radio setup that almost certainly could have summoned your brother-in-law to your GPS grid. This can easily fit under your seat, in a backpack, or in a small Pelican case:

- General-class FCC amateur license - VHF, APRS, and repeaters alone don't cut it when you're out in the sticks
- Radio: Elecraft KX3 (if you can afford it) or Yaesu FT-817 (if you can't)

As a third suggestion, the Kenwood TS-480 works well in this regard also.

- Battery: A123 Systems 4S1P battery and charger
- Buddistick from Buddipole Antennas, w/ coax cable
- cheap monopod (for cameras) from Amazon - $11
- bungee cords to secure monopod to tree/fence post/roof rack
- a laminated list of common emergency and low-power frequencies (14.300, QRP freqs, etc.)

I carry this setup whenever I'm on the trail. It's not dependent on the truck, the truck's batteries, or antenna mounted on the truck--these can all fail you.

Good list IMO. I also carry and use a Buddipole (configured as a Buddistick).

... every time I've turned on my portable HF radio, I've made contact with someone within 10 minutes, regardless of where I am.

I use mine fairly frequently (guess that qualifies me as a "zealot", LOL) and have had the same experience - never had to call more than a few minutes to talk to someone on one or another of the HF bands.