Todd780
OverCamper
Agreed. Which I guess is why I feel even a decade old Corolla with 600,000 could even have 'soul'. I guess 'character is a more fitting word. But, as you said it's semantics.
Comparison shopping: Colorado, Gladiator, Tacoma
- Thread starter spectre6000
- Start date
spectre6000
Observer
I used to work in biodiesel feedstocks. I have a buddy at NREL in Golden who I believe is working with ethanol feedstocks by way of microbiology who says biodiesel research is practically dead. It's not his department, so to speak, but that doesn't bode incredibly well. I figure I can make my own though if it came down to it. From an emissions perspective though, a modern diesel is almost assuredly cleaner than a gasser. The issue (used to be at least) the way diesel emissions were tested in the US on the one end, and super crappy diesels in the 80s leading to poor public perception on the other.
As for removing emission equipment, the way Colorado tests, it'd be easy to do. Totally asinine, but easy. I like how clean modern diesels run.
Explorerinil
Observer
My buddy who lives in Canada and I were comparing health care this summer as we both recently had children. I paid $3500 total after what my insurance wouldn’t cover, he paid $0. I apologize for derailing this thread also.
jadmt
ignore button user
if you were an illegal in Cali it would have been free.......
nickw
Adventurer
The bugs may have been worked out but it's still a complicated system, expensive and difficult to deal with. You can certainly delete the stuff if you'd like but it's not reasonable on the newer rigs since your essentially throwing any resemblance of a warranty out the window including potential resale value....depending on who your are selling too and what state your in e.g. smog testing requirements. Its adds more cost the the diesels and makes them pencil out even worse based on cost....
I lived the VW thing with my Sportwagen....I was worried before the emissions scandal hit based on feedback from other users...
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AbleGuy
Officious Intermeddler
How long ago was this?
I'm asking because, from what I've seen in recent years, members in the Oregon legislature seem to be overly fond of continually recycling bad ideas that initially didn't pass, until they do finally get them approved. So, unfortunately we might very well see this stupid idea return for a do over.
85_Ranger4x4
Well-known member
And that is why the price is hideous in pre-emissions diesel trucks. If it is 4x4 and you can't fit your fist thru a rust hole I see them listed all the time with 2-300k miles for $15-20k
No DEF, no regen, no particulate filter, no EGR... just rattlin' and knockin' and leakin' forever.
I will forever pass on a modern rube goldberg diesel.
Mike W.
Well-known member
Anyone who believes diesel engines and the emissions are all well and good are in for a surprise. They are nowhere near being at a point they are efficient or lasting. I have the pleasure of driving a emissions equipped rig about 100,000 miles a years for profit and pleasure..and to keep peace in my humble abode. I have been doing it since 2010, the beginning of the California induced money machine call clean diesel technology. None of the systems are yet at the point of good or workable. Cummins is still a lagging far behind Detroit Diesel in working technology..I own a 2000 F350 with a 7.3 that has 450,000 miles on it and runs like new..Why you ask? Sulfur..I use sulfur additives by the gallon. Good luck with small untested and unproven diesel technologies..
nickw
Adventurer
Buckstopper was being a drama queen - here is the actual law that was not only proposed but was also passed:
Lawmakers Approve New Diesel Truck Regulations For Portland
Amid a flurry of last-minute votes on Sunday, Oregon lawmakers passed a bill regulating diesel trucks in the Portland metro area.
www.opb.org
There will always be losers with rules like this, but if it's for the better good....so be it, a handful of enthusiasts like @Buckstopper getting caught up in this isn't a reason to bail on it. Like what @85_Ranger4x4 suggested, the older trucks are just continually recycled and nobody was jumping to new ones....the air isn't getting any cleaner, gotta do something.
Mike W.
Well-known member
California has had diesel emissions in place for 10 years..Guess what the air isn't getting any cleaner but the politicians are all getting rich..It's never been about clean air it's about political influence..and to get back on subject..My new Nissan Frontier is one heck of a truck..It fit well price was right and I didn't have the need to be the cool kid on the block..It will go anyplace more pricey trucks go.. probably many places they won't..
phsycle
Adventurer
A neighbor of mine has the same, a 99(?) F350 with something like 60k miles, in pristine shape. I get jealous of that truck.
calicamper
Expedition Leader
Nope
calicamper
Expedition Leader
Actually our air is dramatically better in the major metro areas than they were in the 60’s-80’s. Late 80’s -90’s yr after yr improvement along with our coastal water quality. It wasn’t till just the past 10-12 yrs we have started too see increases again in pollution types linked to transportation again. Today its just sheer numbers of vehicles many of which are idling in traffic longer.
No one is getting rich from emissions standards thats for sure. Ford and a few other companies Signed onto to CA mileage and emissions goals recently because Ford has the technology and vehicles in the pipeline that meet these new standards already. And people do buy them.
My wife’s current car is a Large Ford Sedan that averages 72mpg all yr long. First Ford Ive had since 1995. I’m also close to buying a new Expedition mainly because nothing else comes close to its 8passenger ability and technology. The few friends with them get constantly better mileage than my Sequoia making it pretty much a gas pig given its power and size.
I love diesels my first car was a diesel. My boat is a diesel. I’d love to have a modern diesel except my typical use around town short trips would destroy the particulate system less than a yr likely. So I go gasser for now.
85_Ranger4x4
Well-known member
Buckstopper was being a drama queen - here is the actual law that was not only proposed but was also passed:
Lawmakers Approve New Diesel Truck Regulations For Portland
Amid a flurry of last-minute votes on Sunday, Oregon lawmakers passed a bill regulating diesel trucks in the Portland metro area.www.opb.org
There will always be losers with rules like this, but if it's for the better good....so be it, a handful of enthusiasts like @Buckstopper getting caught up in this isn't a reason to bail on it. Like what @85_Ranger4x4 suggested, the older trucks are just continually recycled and nobody was jumping to new ones....the air isn't getting any cleaner, gotta do something.
Attrition still takes them out. Accidents, rust etc. They command a premium because there are not many left, the fact that 200k is "low miles" says a lot.
That new law thing is just feel good BS. The 15+ year old commercial diesel trucks in fleets are not getting a ton of miles... so it isn't polluting that much anyway. Yee-haw the govt gets a company's third string backup truck out of their bullpen... big whoop.
The private people that want to drive a 20+ year old truck are generally not the same people that want a new truck so you really are not saving anything that way either. It isn't like they are not selling new trucks... like hand over fist because everybody still has to have the latest and greatest. The private citizen that drives old iron either does it because they can't afford any better or because they are an enthusiast.
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calicamper
Expedition Leader
Or they simply don’t need a new truck yet. My neighbor just replaced his 18yr old F250 with a new loaded to the max diesel F250. His old one had 400,000 miles on it. Used in his man made pond / lake company. The new one is getting similar use.
People who can actually afford these high dollar vehicles don’t buy new vehicles very often. I’m shopping $70k SUVs barring any accidents I’ll likely replace it in 12-18yrs. I might pay cash or zero finance it free loans are hard to pass up.