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Custom 35 gallon gas tank for '09 Tacoma
- Thread starter cwvandy
- Start date
Original Tank build update
Before I begin my latest update, a continual hats-off to TscotR214 for his patience, great attitude and willingness to share his experiences. I know I, for one, learned a ton from his posts.
Because of the rust diagnosis, I decided to have my tank pulled, cleaned and coated. Shane, always in customer service mode, pulled the new tank, reinstalled my old tank and sent the tank off to be professionally cleaned and the inside coated with an industry standard, rust preventative material. We put the old tank back on so I would have the truck while the coating was done. Shane picked up the tab for removal of the new tank, putting my old one back on the truck and reinstalling the new tank once coated. I dropped the truck off at 9:30 and had it back by lunch. Coating takes a couple of days and will cost about $200. Anyone thinking about this upgrade should hang onto their old tank and brackets. The swap is easy if you have the parts.
It is interesting to note that when the new tank was pulled off, there was absolutely no rust. Not one spec. Nothing on any of the walls of the tank, nothing in the filter or fuel pump. Clean as the proverbial whistle. I know this is a very different situation than TscotR214's and must be attributable to the difference in water content in CA vs Oregon. Anyway, I am glad to do this simply as a smart preventative step, but also to make sure that any future owner can have peace of mind if they drive in high-water content gas areas. Shane can do the swap in a couple of hours and the coating provides a good guarantee that TscotR214's experience...curse....isn't shared by others.
Other than this preventative maintenance, the tank has functioned absolutely perfectly. Not one single issue and many miles of fuel security!
Before I begin my latest update, a continual hats-off to TscotR214 for his patience, great attitude and willingness to share his experiences. I know I, for one, learned a ton from his posts.
Because of the rust diagnosis, I decided to have my tank pulled, cleaned and coated. Shane, always in customer service mode, pulled the new tank, reinstalled my old tank and sent the tank off to be professionally cleaned and the inside coated with an industry standard, rust preventative material. We put the old tank back on so I would have the truck while the coating was done. Shane picked up the tab for removal of the new tank, putting my old one back on the truck and reinstalling the new tank once coated. I dropped the truck off at 9:30 and had it back by lunch. Coating takes a couple of days and will cost about $200. Anyone thinking about this upgrade should hang onto their old tank and brackets. The swap is easy if you have the parts.
It is interesting to note that when the new tank was pulled off, there was absolutely no rust. Not one spec. Nothing on any of the walls of the tank, nothing in the filter or fuel pump. Clean as the proverbial whistle. I know this is a very different situation than TscotR214's and must be attributable to the difference in water content in CA vs Oregon. Anyway, I am glad to do this simply as a smart preventative step, but also to make sure that any future owner can have peace of mind if they drive in high-water content gas areas. Shane can do the swap in a couple of hours and the coating provides a good guarantee that TscotR214's experience...curse....isn't shared by others.
Other than this preventative maintenance, the tank has functioned absolutely perfectly. Not one single issue and many miles of fuel security!
To beat a dead horse on an old thread, and in response to several PM inquiries, I need to update my CES experience. The CES tank hangs from straps and evidently can freely move, enough to get hung up on the rear axle and drive shaft. Tank punctured on trip in desert, spent two days trailside draining, drying, epoxy plug. Trying to continue trip, tank continued to hang on driveshaft. Inspection revealed issue from day one. I thought metal on metal grinding noise was undercarriage on rocks, was instead driveshaft grinding against tank and axle against tank. Intalled nylon straps to pull tank away from rear drive components and limped home spilling fuel entire way. Unbolted that thing and threw it in the dump scrap metal bin immediately. Well over 10k spent, happily in trash, thrilled to be rid of cursed CES tank. Just my experience, your mileage may vary.
I now run the Outback Proven tank. While only 33gal, it does bolt directly to the frame in seven locations, never to swing and hang on any moving suspension part (axle, drive shaft, leaf springs, etc) and rupture as my CES tank did. Also, Proven tank is completely aluminized, no bare steel to rust. Maybe my CES tank was a tad too long, maybe my straps were a tad too long, maybe my Tacoma was built a quarter inch shorter than everybody else's, who knows. I'm just soooo happy to be rid of the thing.
I'm fairly certain that no one else has had similar issues, so this is solely my unique experience. Plenty of other folks have this tank and love it, and Shane is great to deal with. With my Tacoma, when I'm cross suspended (front axle twists driver side, rear axle twists passenger side, for example), my doors cannot open and are jammed shut due to the amount of torsional frame twist, while my suspension keeps all four tires nicely planted on the ground in all four corners. Must not spill beer, but also must not puncture gas tank.
If you stick to mild well graded dirt roads, CES works great. If you get into expedition travel and have the slightest horizontal suspension articulation, you may have issues.
I now run the Outback Proven tank. While only 33gal, it does bolt directly to the frame in seven locations, never to swing and hang on any moving suspension part (axle, drive shaft, leaf springs, etc) and rupture as my CES tank did. Also, Proven tank is completely aluminized, no bare steel to rust. Maybe my CES tank was a tad too long, maybe my straps were a tad too long, maybe my Tacoma was built a quarter inch shorter than everybody else's, who knows. I'm just soooo happy to be rid of the thing.
I'm fairly certain that no one else has had similar issues, so this is solely my unique experience. Plenty of other folks have this tank and love it, and Shane is great to deal with. With my Tacoma, when I'm cross suspended (front axle twists driver side, rear axle twists passenger side, for example), my doors cannot open and are jammed shut due to the amount of torsional frame twist, while my suspension keeps all four tires nicely planted on the ground in all four corners. Must not spill beer, but also must not puncture gas tank.
If you stick to mild well graded dirt roads, CES works great. If you get into expedition travel and have the slightest horizontal suspension articulation, you may have issues.
Google for links and phone numbers, Custom Exhaust Specialties Bend Oregon, talk to Shane, and Outback Proven Las Vegas Nevada, talk to Ben. Shane hand builds in his own (really nice) shop, while Ben imports from Long Range Automotive in Australia.
Proven tank is less expensive, mass produced, but also only half the additional fuel, 42gal vs 33gal. Depends on your needs. Oh, also need to add that CES tank had 38gal usable (my engine dies at 4gal remaining), while Proven tank has 30gal usable (engine dies at 3gal remaining), so CES gives 8 more gallons essentially. Also, venting on CES tank is way superior, I changed my Proven vent hoses to match my CES install, thanks to Shane and Chris for pioneering the vent issues. And sealing a fuel tank with a static compression o-ring is just a bad idea, I used cork gaskets and plenty of aviation gasket sealer on my Proven tank (again thanks to Shane). And don't use the Proven clear plastic hose, replace with standard black fuel hose and tighten the crap out of hose clamp at charcoal canister end with loop up to fuel cap and back. PM w questions best.
Proven tank is less expensive, mass produced, but also only half the additional fuel, 42gal vs 33gal. Depends on your needs. Oh, also need to add that CES tank had 38gal usable (my engine dies at 4gal remaining), while Proven tank has 30gal usable (engine dies at 3gal remaining), so CES gives 8 more gallons essentially. Also, venting on CES tank is way superior, I changed my Proven vent hoses to match my CES install, thanks to Shane and Chris for pioneering the vent issues. And sealing a fuel tank with a static compression o-ring is just a bad idea, I used cork gaskets and plenty of aviation gasket sealer on my Proven tank (again thanks to Shane). And don't use the Proven clear plastic hose, replace with standard black fuel hose and tighten the crap out of hose clamp at charcoal canister end with loop up to fuel cap and back. PM w questions best.
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Google for links and phone numbers, Custom Exhaust Specialties Bend Oregon, talk to Shane, and Outback Proven Las Vegas Nevada, talk to Ben. Shane hand builds in his own (really nice) shop, while Ben imports from Long Range Automotive in Australia.
Proven tank is less expensive, mass produced, but also only half the additional fuel, 42gal vs 33gal. Depends on your needs. Oh, also need to add that CES tank had 38gal usable (my engine dies at 4gal remaining), while Proven tank has 30gal usable (engine dies at 3gal remaining), so CES gives 8 more gallons essentially. Also, venting on CES tank is way superior, I changed my Proven vent hoses to match my CES install, thanks to Shane and Chris for pioneering the vent issues. And sealing a fuel tank with a static compression o-ring is just a bad idea, I used cork gaskets and plenty of aviation gasket sealer on my Proven tank (again thanks to Shane). And don't use the Proven clear plastic hose, replace with standard black fuel hose and tighten the crap out of hose clamp at charcoal canister end with loop up to fuel cap and back. PM w questions best.
Thanks for the detail first hand experience update!! The 2nd gen Tacoma has a complicated emission check setup on the gas tank, for us in California a check engine light can be a lot of hassle at smog check time. So I would take the Outback Proven tank is not a plug and play with some enhancement? (Replace gasket, fuel line etc)
Thanks for the detail first hand experience update!! The 2nd gen Tacoma has a complicated emission check setup on the gas tank, for us in California a check engine light can be a lot of hassle at smog check time. So I would take the Outback Proven tank is not a plug and play with some enhancement? (Replace gasket, fuel line etc)
Good inquiry.
Both tanks, the CES and the Proven, have solved any emission engine light issues. Both are quite vacuum tight. The CES tank uses a cork gasket under compression to seal the fuel pump assy into place (I had to add aviation gasket sealer to ensure no CEL issues). The Proven tank uses a THICKER THAN OEM o-ring under compression to seal the fuel assy into place (I used my old, thinner OEM o-ring at first and immediately got CEL failures at first pressurization attempt, at which time I tried the Proven-supplied thicker o-ring with no problems, then said screw it and made my own super thick cork gasket with tons of aviation gasket sealer, over-kill OCD but I know it will work). Remember the space shuttle explosion? O-rings under static compression are a bad idea, they are designed for dynamic pressurization and constant lubrication in order to deform and seal correctly under changing pressures. Just my opinion, cork works better. Either tank, with supplied sealants out of the box, will seal the fuel pump assembly just fine. Enhance with aviation gasket sealer and / or cork gasket if OCD.
Both tanks have adequate vent tubing straight from the box, they've done their homework here also. CES has difficult to install, but awesome venting, far superior to Proven tank. CES has vents in uppermost extents of highest points (3) on tank, while Proven has single vent (1) somewhat below highest point on tank. Yeah, so why doesn't incoming gas trap air at that highest point in Proven tank? I took my Proven tank apart to look at it from the inside, and noticed that fuel actually pumps in, swirls down, and upwells into that highest point. Problem solved, clever those Aussies. That said, with Proven tank, I flooded my charcoal canister with first fill-up at the gas pump. CES runs their vent hose from tank (3 points into one hose), up inside driver rear tire well to fuel cap filler neck at highest point, back down, over inboard direction, and up to charcoal canister located above rear differential. Proven runs their vent hose in a specially molded clear plastic vent hose directly from their single vent point, directly about 10" to charcoal canister, just ever so slightly upward (elevation change about, oh, 2" maximum). Easy for fuel on Proven tank to flow into charcoal canister. My modification was to run standard fuel hose from single vent point on Proven tank, looped up to fuel cap filler neck area like CES, down, over, and up to charcoal canister. Problem solved, and does not trip fuel filler nozzle during fillup before tank is full (Ben will provide a unicoil spring to prevent his vent hose from kinking, did not work for me on two separate Tacoma installs, but fuel vent line following CES works fantastic). On Proven tank, vent connection is different size from charcoal canister connection, that's why they need their provided special molded clear plastic tubing. I went with larger size standard fuel line that fits over tank vent side, which then fits loose over charcoal vent fitting, but simply compressing fuel line with hose clamp provided dynamite vacuum tight seal.
Both tanks are plug and play, and both suppliers provide everything you need. I suggest these mods. For the CES: use aviation gasket sealer everywhere, gaskets, hoses, everywhere; it's like black rubber cement, made specifically for the purpose, and watch your clearances. For the Proven: use their thicker o-ring with aviation sealer, or, make your own cork gasket; and replace 10" clear vent tubing with 96" standard fuel line looped up to filler neck (you don't need that much, I used about 6ft).
If I were the manufacturer: CES, I would make the tank smaller front to back by about 2" on the rear end, and side to side take off about 1" on each side, to provide greater suspension clearance on some installations. Proven, I would modify their compression plate to use a cork compression gasket for the fuel pump, and provide 8ft of vent hose to run the filler neck loop route.
TscotR214,
This info is priceless!
It's very rare to have such detail 1st hand experience with the in depth understanding on how the modification should work. Kudo, :ylsmoke:
I like the idea of aluminum tank which should be lighter and naturally resist the rust. I feel the change to the vent for Proven is a must for the reliability and usability of the tank. Is it ok to share the price on Proven's tank?
Thanks again for the great info,
This info is priceless!
It's very rare to have such detail 1st hand experience with the in depth understanding on how the modification should work. Kudo, :ylsmoke:
I like the idea of aluminum tank which should be lighter and naturally resist the rust. I feel the change to the vent for Proven is a must for the reliability and usability of the tank. Is it ok to share the price on Proven's tank?
Thanks again for the great info,
TscotR214,
This info is priceless!
It's very rare to have such detail 1st hand experience with the in depth understanding on how the modification should work. Kudo, :ylsmoke:
I like the idea of aluminum tank which should be lighter and naturally resist the rust. I feel the change to the vent for Proven is a must for the reliability and usability of the tank. Is it ok to share the price on Proven's tank?
Thanks again for the great info,
Both tanks are steel construction. CES is steel tank, featuring internal "radiator type" coating to prevent rust, and external powder coating paint. Proven tank is also steel, featuring aluminized coating inside and out (similar to galvanized steel coatings which typically use zinc, aluminized is similar process using aluminum instead of zinc to coat steel). Proven tank comes with small magnet that you stick inside tank right next to fuel intake, just in case small bits of metal do float around somehow.
I don't wish to hijack this thread for either a CES or a Proven promo, so prefer that you contact each supplier for pricing. Both suppliers provide quality products for varying needs.