Gas vs Diesel Shootout in the Dunes & Sand

[Peter_n_Margaret]

What are the rules for driving out there? Can you make your own tracks? I see videos of folks crossing desert in Aus making own tracks to explore.

Depends where you are. In many places it is prohibited due to being in National Parks, in some it is considered "bad form" from a "Tread Lightly" perspective, on some beaches and unvegetated dune areas it is OK.
Personally, I don't feel the need to "play in the sand" any more.

Cheers,
Peter
OKA196 motorhome

 

[billiebob]

Personally, I don't feel the need to "play in the sand" any more.

This defines the discussion,,,, the original postie obviously LOVES to "play in the sand"....
Me, I am closer to Peter n Margaret, way too old to play like an adolescent yet fully in love with being a kid again.

This is not an I am right, you are wrong discussion.... if you LOVE to "play in the sand"...... the high revving gas V8 in pickup will beat a diesel in the same pickup..... PERIOD.

Reading cpmprehension 101. Read Post Number One and quit reacting. Absorb what the OP said and move on......

 

[NevadaLover]

This defines the discussion,,,, the original postie obviously LOVES to "play in the sand"....
Me, I am closer to Peter n Margaret, way too old to play like an adolescent yet fully in love with being a kid again.

This is not an I am right, you are wrong discussion.... if you LOVE to "play in the sand"...... the high revving gas V8 in pickup will beat a diesel in the same pickup..... PERIOD.

Reading cpmprehension 101. Read Post Number One and quit reacting. Absorb what the OP said and move on......

Talk about needing "reading comprehension"!!

The OP asked at the bottom of post #1 for "Thoughts / experiences?", therefore the posts here regarding other users "Thoughts / experiences" are what the OP asked for, if you don't like the replies then just move on and ignore this thread! Pretty simple.

 

[Betarocker]

I do a fair amount of driving in the sand....fair amount of dune driving also. The majority of my time has been spent in gas rigs with the rights setup, and have had good luck with all my rigs; FJ40's, Tacomas, 19' Ranger, 22' Ram 2500. One thing I did notice the other day when I was out wheeling was the diesel rigs do struggle a bit more with some of the softer areas where *wheel speed* is required....like coming up to a soft dune or a section of soft wind-blown sand, being able to rev from 2k to 5k+ in a gasser can get you out of trouble, the diesels seem to suffer a bit in these conditions since the RPM range is closer to say 1k to 3k....a gas rig has close to 2x the potential wheel speed.

Another area I've noticed in run-ins to steeper dunes from a stop, gas engines 'seem' (to me) to be better able to use that RPM advantage without having to shift...which in many cases, is not possible,

Thoughts / experiences?

No where in that initial post did it mention playing in the sand. It was all about driving in the sand, which in my interpretation due to this being an Overlanding Forum, meant traversing sand with a vehicle that suits this website.

 

[billiebob]

No where in that initial post did it mention playing in the sand. It was all about driving in the sand, which in my interpretation due to this being an Overlanding Forum, meant traversing sand with a vehicle that suits this website.

This says "playing in the sand". From Post # 1

coming up to a soft dune or a section of soft wind-blown sand, being able to rev from 2k to 5k+ in a gasser can get you out of trouble

The theme of the original post does not seem to fit "overlanding" the theme seems to be....
from the original post....

I was out wheeling

 

[NevadaLover]

No where in that initial post did it mention playing in the sand. It was all about driving in the sand, which in my interpretation due to this being an Overlanding Forum, meant traversing sand with a vehicle that suits this website.

The theme of the original post does not seem to fit "overlanding" the theme seems to be....
from the original post....

I was out wheeling

So in your opinions, if a post doesn't exclusively mean "overlanding" then it doesn't belong here?

Hmm..... better tell Dendy and Christian to get busy then, if your interpretations are the rule here then the MOD's have a LOT of material to delete here!??

 

[Betarocker]

So in your opinions, if a post doesn't exclusively mean "overlanding" then it doesn't belong here?

Hmm..... better tell Dendy and Christian to get busy then, if your interpretations are the rule here then the MOD's have a LOT of material to delete here!??

Where the #@*? did I even imply that? "Driving in the sand" does not necessarily mean running a supercharged big block sandrail, and comparing it to a 1994 F250 with a 7.3L IDI

 

[NevadaLover]

That's why the original post ended in a question about other users "thoughts/experiences"!

Why is that so hard to comprehend?

 

[Betarocker]

And when one expressed their thoughts/experiences and wasn't what the original poster want, it was rebutted. Maybe you don't know what comprehend means.

 

[NevadaLover]

I wasn't the one who couldn't understand the OP saying that his experience is that gassers are better than diesels in the sand and decided he was talking about "running a supercharged big block sandrail"!

Peace out dude, not going to argue anymore about a simple gas vs diesel thread.

 

[nickw]

Thread got massively derailed but was just interested, from a *performance* perspective in folks opinions of how gas and diesel rigs face off in the sand, pretty simple. I get diesels have a different powerband which (depending on the vehicle class) can be an advantage, they can be much better on fuel, driving style is important, the evironment rocks.....etc.

 

[javajoe79]

discussions like this never go anywhere because there is almost never a direct comparison. Show me the same vehicles, same weights, diesel vs gas. Diesels do just fine in sand of all types and so do gassers. Gearing, preference, etc

 

[nickw]

discussions like this never go anywhere because there is almost never a direct comparison. Show me the same vehicles, same weights, diesel vs gas. Diesels do just fine in sand of all types and so do gassers. Gearing, preference, etc

I know it's hard (to your point), but many folks have owned fullsize gas and diesel rigs which are pretty darn comparable.

Modern diesels do make it harder, they have big HP numbers....but I bet if we asked this question even 10 years we'd have more universal support for gassers. it's only been relatively recently that diesel rigs are making the kind of HP gas rigs are capable of, so it can be a generational thing too.

With Toyotas it's complicated since they have several engine options across their 70 series line, "Diesel" could mean a 130 hp 1HZ or it could mean a 1VD with 2x the power. So can a fully loaded 70 series with a n/a 1HZ do well in the dunes, maybe adequately, is it going to perform as well as a V8 petrol cruiser, no way......is that a fair comparison, who knows

 

[nickw]

I should have just googled this before posting, there is an 11 page on this thread from a SA 4x4 site:

Diesel vs petrol dune chargers - Page 4

So, with 7 of the top ten finishers in this years Dakar using turbo- diesels, are the big petrols still the ultimate choice to play in the dunes?e

www.4x4community.co.za

Surprise surprise, same controversy, same arguments but does seem like general sentiment is the petrol LC's are considered better platform in the dunes relative to their diesel counterparts....

"If you really do trouble to compare gear ratio`s you will find diesel to run only fractionally lower ratios most of them only the top gears. Turbo lag ask for higher gears lower down to get things going.
On all my trips in the dunes I yet have to come across an ******** kicking diesel. The Waterford challenge dune at Boegoeberg NC has a clear record for no diesel making it to the top. The only conquerors to be high powered petrol engines.
Unfortunately dune climbing is not all about torque but getting out of the block`s as quick as possible and sustaining full power in a wide rev band. Do not choke the petrol engines like in the Dakar and we will talk again.."

" In dunes wide rev range and lots of kW beats high torque without revs. The only place where I admit a petrol is better is the sand dunes. "

+ a bunch of Afrikaans

There ya have it!....but in all seriousness, robust conversation there (if anybody is interested)....

 

[javajoe79]

You win. Diesels can't climb some dune somewhere that doesn't need to be climbed anyway.