Grenadier Pricing Announced

[ChasingOurTrunks]

Which is why I referred to us Cdns as the poorer cousins.

Note that link states median after tax household income of $66,800 CAD. Thats why the Gren wont be even on the radar for 99.99% of Cdns.

That said, I expect to see a number of Grens driven around Vancouver by folks who've never done an honest days work in their lives.

My sincere hope is that when the next trendy thing comes along and those people get bored with their Gren’s, there will be a few Trialmasters sitting around used. And if I’m really optimistic, because of the niche nature of the vehicle, they will be cheap.

I have more thoughts, but I have to prep the road in front of my house with paint and lights so the pigs have somewhere to land after flight.

 

[ChasingOurTrunks]

Busting in a bit late on this one, but median income in the USA and Canada are not almost identical. The median income in the USA is significantly higher than in Canada.

The most recent numbers I can find are USA median income $93,547 CAD, and Canada median income $67,521 CAD.

Cost Of Living in Canada vs The US (2024)

In this cost of living in Canada vs the US comparison, we'll compare the two countries side-by-side based on the following criteria:

wealthawesome.com

Thanks @GetOutThere, I didn’t realize how big the gap was. That’s what makes it hard to do a simple conversion on US to CAD, as Ineos appears to have done.

I think about it from “how many hours do I need to work to afford it?” - we all have the same hours in the day to earn cash, no matter where we are (ie an office worker in the US and Canada will both have a similar 8-ish hour day). That’s where the Big Mac comparison is handy as that is priced for the typical McDonald’s in a given market.

I think that’s why this feels like such a sticker shock for Canadians - it’s because it is. But I think, after crunching the numbers, we just get really good deals on our other cars.

A Jeep Wrangler in the US and Canada, in terms of opportunity cost, is the exact same number of Big Macs in each country. I could get 9700 Big Macs in the USA for the price of a twin locked wrangler, and I could get almost the exact same number of Big Macs here in Canada for the price of a twin locked Canadian wrangler. The Gladiator is a bit more pricey in Canada - but only 500 Big Macs, and that 500-Big Mac gap is the same when comparing the Mew Defender. But the Grenadier in Canada vs the Grenadier in the USA is a difference of just shy of 2,000 Big Macs — that’s a huge jump.

A “fair” and “proportionate” Canadian price would, if I use that 500-Big Max differentiator that is seen on the Gladiator and the New Defender, would be about $92,900 for a twin locked, safari roofed, tow packages Grenadier. That would mean the base price coming in at between $80k and $85k for the base.

At $80k-$85k, I’m 100% in here in Canada. Instead, we are sitting at $92k base, and $113k for twin locked — so between $10k and $23k more expensive that the napkin math on the market suggests is a “fair” price.

 

[GetOutThere]

My sincere hope is that when the next trendy thing comes along and those people get bored with their Gren’s, there will be a few Trialmasters sitting around used. And if I’m really optimistic, because of the niche nature of the vehicle, they will be cheap.

I have more thoughts, but I have to prep the road in front of my house with paint and lights so the pigs have somewhere to land after flight.

I can get behind the sentiment here, but if the limited volume of the NA classic Defender is any indication, the prices will only move in the opposite direction. Seems to often be the case for limited run enthusiast vehicles.

 

[ChasingOurTrunks]

One more bit of fun math based on those previously quoted F-150 numbers:

In the USA, the F-150 would be 9,861 Big Macs.

If it was on a straight currency conversion, in Canada that would mean $77k, or about 11,492 Big Macs — that’s 2500 Big Macs more “opportunity cost” that our American friends, and that’s what Ineos has done with their pricing.

In reality, the F-150 costs $65k Canadian, which is only 9701 Big Macs - so it’s actually relatively cheaper for us than our American friends.

I’m getting hungry.

 

[ChasingOurTrunks]

I can get behind the sentiment here, but if the limited volume of the NA classic Defender is any indication, the prices will only move in the opposite direction. Seems to often be the case for limited run enthusiast vehicles.

You are right but c’mon can’t I live off the hopium for a few hours before it’s dashed away?

 

[GetOutThere]

One more bit of fun math based on those previously quoted F-150 numbers:

In the USA, the F-150 would be 9,861 Big Macs.

If it was on a straight currency conversion, in Canada that would mean $77k, or about 11,492 Big Macs — that’s 2500 Big Macs more “opportunity cost” that our American friends, and that’s what Ineos has done with their pricing.

In reality, the F-150 costs $65k Canadian, which is only 9701 Big Macs - so it’s actually relatively cheaper for us than our American friends.

I’m getting hungry.

I see what you're doing here by relating price to purchasing power ALA Big Macs, but is that the best comparison to be making? What about the proportion of wage represented by cost, for example?

In the USA, the F150 price I quoted earlier represents 0.84 years of wages at median. In Canada it represents 0.97 years of wages at median.

I would argue that it is not relatively cheaper here, and we are not getting the better deal by this metric.

The ridiculous Grenadier gap, for those curious (and so that we at least stay relatively on topic) is 1.06 years of wages in USA, or 1.38 years in Canada.

Edit: P.S. Now I want a Big Mac, dammit.

 

[Todd n Natalie]

Just went and built one out of curiosity. Tried to keep it fairly cheap.
Kept the 'free' white paint instead of a $700 color change, lol
Added seat heaters with seat covers to the cloth seats.
Front / rear lockers and the snorkel. Think that was it.
Came out to 102K. Yikes.



Orrrrr..... I could save myself 20G's and get the base trim 'Offroady' model (Tremor, Power wagon / AT4)of ANY of the Domestic 3/4 tons....

 

[Christian P.]

Repairs will be at crazy prices for the first few years. See that Rivian with the minor fender-bender that has spread across the internet at $30k repair bill. My BIL experienced something similar on his new Volvo a few years ago - first release year for the model, bumped a curb, broke a wheel and damaged / bent? some suspension parts. $17k damage. No sheet metal was effected. 6 months out of action waiting for parts. I saw the damage and was in shock that it cost that much.

My van door stop barely dented a rear fender on my friend's white Tesla. About 6 inch long and barely visible, it took us weeks to notice. Because it's aluminum, they have to replace the entire quarter panel. Estimate is $7800 at one shop (SF) and between $8k to $10k at another (Reno).

This is getting out of control. Insurance is going to be through the roof very soon, and no one is going to be taking any of the $100k vehicle off-road. Better buy these older Suzuki Samurai now...

 

[zimm]

I’m actually surprised it’s priced as low as it is, I don’t see how they’ll make money at the low volumes this will be produced. My guess the second year prices raise substantially or production numbers ramp way up, they have to be losing money for now.

i came in at 93000.

this was originally marketed as a farm implement to replace the Defender because the new defender went upscale. It's 13% more than the defender and its no farm implement.

I may still buy it becaue it is a cool truck, and there isn't one like it, but it's also not the original goal.

heres my setup https://my.ineosgrenadier.com/3GIZ1S9ZFS

 

[ABBB]

i came in at 93000.

this was originally marketed as a farm implement to replace the Defender because the new defender went upscale. It's 13% more than the defender and its no farm implement.

I may still buy it becaue it is a cool truck, and there isn't one like it, but it's also not the original goal.

heres my setup https://my.ineosgrenadier.com/3GIZ1S9ZFS

IF the IG price is reflective of build quality and not just about what they expect enough individuals are willing to pay - IF being operative here - I wonder what went into the new Defender that it is that much cheaper…


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[ChasingOurTrunks]

I see what you're doing here by relating price to purchasing power ALA Big Macs, but is that the best comparison to be making? What about the proportion of wage represented by cost, for example?

In the USA, the F150 price I quoted earlier represents 0.84 years of wages at median. In Canada it represents 0.97 years of wages at median.

I would argue that it is not relatively cheaper here, and we are not getting the better deal by this metric.

The ridiculous Grenadier gap, for those curious (and so that we at least stay relatively on topic) is 1.06 years of wages in USA, or 1.38 years in Canada.

Edit: P.S. Now I want a Big Mac, dammit.

This is a great addition, GetOutThere -- hours worked for wages is another metric that tells this story really well; I'd argue that the story is more or less the same. Canadians got really pushed out on this pricing; Americans got a bit of sticker shock, but it's not too far out of line of Australia (though I didn't do the years of wages calc there).

I would have done my analysis on minimum wage, but candidly that would have been way more work as it would be state-by-state, province by province, and country by country, and I wanted to capture multiple countries. I might have even needed to bust out SPSS which I've not touched in years! I think I could probably do it based on wages, but I would expect a PhD at the end (Or at least a grad degree of some kind) and I don't think Expedition Portal is an accredited degree granting organization (Yet? Scott and Christian, put that on the next staff meeting agenda!)(kidding).

I greatly appreciate you bringing those years of wages numbers into this discussion though because it's another common denominator - we all only get so many hours in the day to earn money. Those hours translate into a Grenadier, and you need to work a lot more of them in Canada to get one than you do elsewhere!

 

[plainjaneFJC]

i came in at 93000.

this was originally marketed as a farm implement to replace the Defender because the new defender went upscale. It's 13% more than the defender and its no farm implement.

I may still buy it becaue it is a cool truck, and there isn't one like it, but it's also not the original goal.

heres my setup https://my.ineosgrenadier.com/3GIZ1S9ZFS

Beautiful truck, can’t wait to see these getting used.

 

[SkiWill]

IF the IG price is reflective of build quality and not just about what they expect enough individuals are willing to pay - IF being operative here - I wonder what went into the new Defender that it is that much cheaper…


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It's reflective of economies of scale and platform sharing across multiple models delivered by a company with the infrastructure developed over 7 decades of manufacturing and delivering automobiles. That's the reason why nearly any "comparable" vehicle is cheaper than the one off Grenadier.

 

[Jurfie]

Orrrrr..... I could save myself 20G's and get the base trim 'Offroady' model (Tremor, Power wagon / AT4)of ANY of the Domestic 3/4 tons....

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My thoughts exactly. Power Wagon (for ultimate offroad chops) or a gasser 2500 Rebel (for max towing and payload) has moved back up the list for me.

 

[Highlander]

This is getting out of control. Insurance is going to be through the roof very soon, and no one is going to be taking any of the $100k vehicle off-road. Better buy these older Suzuki Samurai now...

We have entered in the phase of complex complexity. Everything is getting too complicated and every solution we come up with to solve a problem caused but the said complexity makes it even more complicated. It’s a paradox.

There is a guy down on the road where I live. He buys old tractors. Some of them are quite old. He restores them and then sells them. He told the modern equipment is so complicated that no farmer can fix it by himself.