HI LIFT AS A WINCH?

[mhiscox]

I apparently have warmer feelings about the HiLift than most. I've used it as a winch. It is dreadfully tedious, but it works.

It is, no doubt, a dangerous tool to use if you're neither skilled nor attentive, but so is a winch, table saw or claw hammer. Each person should decide for him or herself whether they can use a Hi-Lift safely and follow the directions and live with the limitations.

I don't know that comparing a sub-$200 HiLift with attachments to an integrated winch system is relevant. The better approach would seem to be to compare it to an alternative of similar cost, and I'm not sure what else you can buy that for that kind of money that will do you as much good. There is certainly every reason to have a proper winch setup if it's worth the money to you, but you can do a lot of overlanding without getting routinely stuck. If your winching needs are not frequent (as it is with my Sprinter's winch setup), you can end up looking at an investment of several hundred dollars per use.

 

[REDROVER]

Read the prior posts. A HL is not a replacement for a winch. Nor can you use it safely without good lift points. You'll nee bumpers and sliders to use a HL even for what it is meant to be used for. Otherwise you are risking yourself and the vehicle.

If you need to go on the cheap wait for used ARB bumper (350-450), get the X9 and call it a day at about a grand.

But, even if you go 2k route. A broken arm is likely to cost that much, but if you are really not careful, knowledgable and expereinced a HL could really kick your *** if you got hit in the head with something or if something fell on you.

My advice is to stay safe. use the HL for its designed purpose, stay on trails and with company that you can do accomplish and save the tough stuff for when you are adequately geard up. A HL is never going to winch you off or over any serious obstacle without risking a lot.

I'll get off my soapbox now and of course take my opinion for what it is worth. My opinion is that using it for lifting and shoving is likely OK but as a winch and in unpredictable situations, you will yourself for getting a winch. I've seen near disaster with inexperienced people and HL.

i want to keep the original stock looks , it loooks like i can make it fit in bitween the frame rails

i have warn m 12000 on my Hummers , thats to much for the rover right? ( and it wont fit in there) 9 should be ok dont u think so? i can get used humvee hydrolic winch, should i get that or electric winch ,

ERIC

 

[Grim Reaper]

HiLift as a winch....Last thing I would want to use but I have done it. Make sure you have chain. If its stuck bad a recovery strap may well stretch as much as the jack is high. You want as little give in your rigging as possible. Chain you can quickly choke up and make the most of the 40-60 inches of pull. If you have no choice but to use a strap try to double it up so it will have as little stretch as possible.

HiLift demands respect. 2 of the most serious injuries I have seen off road both involved Hilifts. One was a handle to the head. They will ratchet and fling the handle up. Keep clear of that handle. The other was the truck fell off and the person operating the jack tried to hold it and got his hand pinched.

 

[JeremyT101]

Read the prior posts. A HL is not a replacement for a winch. Nor can you use it safely without good lift points. You'll nee bumpers and sliders to use a HL even for what it is meant to be used for. Otherwise you are risking yourself and the vehicle.

If you need to go on the cheap wait for used ARB bumper (350-450), get the X9 and call it a day at about a grand.

But, even if you go 2k route. A broken arm is likely to cost that much, but if you are really not careful, knowledgable and expereinced a HL could really kick your *** if you got hit in the head with something or if something fell on you.

My advice is to stay safe. use the HL for its designed purpose, stay on trails and with company that you can do accomplish and save the tough stuff for when you are adequately geard up. A HL is never going to winch you off or over any serious obstacle without risking a lot.

I'll get off my soapbox now and of course take my opinion for what it is worth. My opinion is that using it for lifting and shoving is likely OK but as a winch and in unpredictable situations, you will yourself for getting a winch. I've seen near disaster with inexperienced people and HL.

No man, I totally understand what you are saying. Thanks for the advice. I'm planning on getting one just incase I get a flat or need it out there somewhere. I'm betting most of the time it will stay tucked away in the truck, but it would be nice to have for situations it can handle. Right now I'm not going crazy offroad with it, but a bumper/winch, some armour like sliders, proper tires and suspension are in the future for the next couple years. Right now I'm just focusing on maintenance and getting my truck to the point where I trust it even for onroad trips. I am driving it like 6000km, halfway across the country at the end of summer. Don't have the faith for that yet haha.

 

[ipgregory]

I'm planning on getting one just incase I get a flat or need it out there somewhere. I'm betting most of the time it will stay tucked away in the truck, but it would be nice to have for situations it can handle. Right now I'm not going crazy offroad with it, but a bumper/winch, some armour like sliders, proper tires and suspension are in the future for the next couple years.

Ok this is a common mistake and you don't understand what he is saying at all. Not digging at you just want you to consider your options before you spend your cash or more importantly, seriously harm yourself or somebody else. You mention that you plan to get a hi-lift to use for changing flats amongst other stuff. That you plan to put off the purchase of sliders or bumpers into the future. So I presume you mean that the hi-lift will be used prior to those purchases?

Ask yourself this. Let's assume you have a flat. Pick a tire, doesn't matter which. You pull out your new shiny hi-lift. Where are you going to put it on the truck to lift your chosen tire? What part of the truck are you going to use as a jacking point to take the trucks weight as you lift it up? That's problem 1.

Problem 2. Let's say for arguments sake that you have found somewhere to jack on and it doesn't collapse, rip the side of your truck off and land the thing in your face. You are steadily lifting the truck. How high do you think you are going to need to lift the truck from the body or frame before the wheel comes off the ground? It's pretty high I assure you even with stock suspension.

Problem 3. You have it in the air. Are you REALLY going to put yourself or any part of you under that truck to remove that wheel while the truck is teetering on that jack with just some sheet metal and a prayer holding it up there?

THIS is precisely how people get hurt and how things like the hi-lift get a bad name. WHEN that truck lands on you it will not be the fault of the tool, it's the fault of the untrained and unprepared owner.

Again, not digging at you, just want you to understand the potential pitfalls in your reasoning BEFORE you get hurt.

A hi-lift jack is one of the most versatile and useful tools WHEN used properly and in conjunction with other necessary components that support its use. The most important of those being strong and secure jacking points. It is about as much use as a sponge leg in a thunderstorm however at changing tires on trucks with long travel suspension and no limiting straps. The factory bottle jack under the axle is the best tool you have for doing that. It's useless for any form of lifting on a truck that doesn't have somewhere to use it on. Modern trucks have nice curvy bumpers and plastic side sills. They don't lend themselves well as jacking points. You can use a wheel adaptor and an axle stand to change the tire, but its more work than just grabbing the bottle jack and using that to being with so why would you?

Rant off…

x2 on the mention of a chain and throw in a synthetic winch extension as well. As mentioned straps stretch and you spend more time taking up that stretch than you do actually pulling the truck with a strap. A chain and a winch extension have less stretch in them and you get more pull out of the limited amount of travel in the jack frame. Less re-rigging = less sweat.

 

[I Leak Oil]

I think the farm jack gets a bad wrap not because it is dangerous (much the same way a firearm in itself isn't dangerous) but because people put their body parts in places they don't belong while using it or just not being smart enough to learn to use it after unwrapping it at Christmas time. It's a tool and like any tool if you don't know how to use it or aren't using it correctly then you can get hurt. If you think you're going to winch your full size chevy which is stuck up to the doors in mud out then you are probably over taxing it, not using it correctly, putting yourself at risk. Don't blame the tool for that....

 

[bri]

I've used a highlift many times and have been "trained" in it's use. I've practiced with it when in controlled situations in attempts to determine exactly what is necessary under less predictable situations.

The HL will be about a last resort for me to do something like change a tire. I'd much rather winch to a point where I could get something safer on the truck. These days with near stock vehicles rather than a rigged out D1, I don't even have one. If I am at the point where I need a HL, I have exceeded the ability of my vehicle. IMO.

A HL might be first choice for something other than a tire change, but likely you will see me use a winch well before pulling out a HL unless for some reason the situation is that the highlift would result in safer extraction and less risk of damage to me and my vehicle. But, I am having a problem remembering an instance where this was the case.

I'm not scared of using one, just really cautious, maybe overly. With my old D1, it seemed like I had to lift the thing to near it limits to get a tire off the ground and I certainly would not feel very comfortable doing so -- even on pavement. Just for point of reference, my D1 was very well rigged, including 4" lift, crazy articulation and could do some of the hardest trails in Moab and CO.

The HL gets a bad rap because it IS dangerous. Of course so is a winch. But a winch is much easier to control. To operate a HL, you much touch it and to touch it you need to be close to the vehicle. With a winch you have a remote, can do it yourself while in the vehicle or have someone else remotely operate it. I've seen mistakes by people that do not have experience with them and also be people that are experienced with them and are to the point where they are too casual. Thus my apprehension using them. I must admit though. I am lucky. Never experienced anything horrific and plan to keep it that way.

 

[R-Overland]

Do What I did
I installed a HMMWV 10.500lbs hydraulic winch by mile marker. I have it between the frame rails at the land rover anchor points for a winch. plus I added
a third connection point to the lower frame cross bar. I run two power steering pumps, so I can winch and steer the same time. And spooling will be a bit faster that way as well. As long as the engine runs , I can winch all day. It can be submerged in water and it wouldn't matter. I love the low angle of attack which pulls the truck up rather than down,as normal winches do. There is a reason why the Army replaced all Warn winches with these Mile Marker hydraulic units. they are bullet proof.

 

[AndrewClarke]

I think the issue here its not just the 800 for the winch that is the issue. I have thought about this issue alot recently myself and putting a winch on your truck is more like a 1700-2k deal. The winch being 800+ shipping. Having a battery that can take that kind of load, and getting all the associated parts. Then, your either need a steel bumper which runs anywhere from 900-1500 bucks to your front door. And if no bumper you still gotta pay someone to fab something. So I see the point of a winch and would love to have one, but if one can hardly afford a new set of tires(like I can't), it's hard to drop that kind of money on a winch.

I bought a winch from www.titanwinches.com a few years ago. It seems to have held up well although I haven't used it as much as I'd have hoped. You can get the newest model of the one I have for $450, and you can pick it up in Burlington.

I also have a hi-lift, but as I don't really have any jacking points on my current vehicle, I'd say it's of limited use except in the sort of emergency that I try hard to avoid. Then it had better be mounted securely, as a piece of heavy metal could be a huge liability in an accident.

Slightly more OT, but I was off-roading once and a guy had a hi-lift attached to the brush guard of his D90. At the end of the day, he noticed it was missing. After asking him how he'd attached it, he said he'd used ... zip ties.

- Andrew.

 

[AndrewClarke]

HiLift as a winch....Last thing I would want to use but I have done it. Make sure you have chain. If its stuck bad a recovery strap may well stretch as much as the jack is high. You want as little give in your rigging as possible. Chain you can quickly choke up and make the most of the 40-60 inches of pull. If you have no choice but to use a strap try to double it up so it will have as little stretch as possible.

OK, now I'll chime in on the chain idea. Chains are great too, but very dangerous. The problem with chain is that it has a sudden and catastrophic failure mode. When I was about 19 I was helping someone with some logging. He was jerking on a chain with his Big American Truck. The chain snapped, and to this day I remember hearing one of those links whizzing by my head. If that link had hit me, there's a good chance I wouldn't have survived.

Personally, after that incident, I won't use chains in any situation where there's a chance it might snap and injur someone.

 

[ipgregory]

I also have a hi-lift, but as I don't really have any jacking points on my current vehicle.

If your current vehicle is the 110 listed in your sig then buy one of these (pic).

There are 4 factory installed jacking points that fit that adaptor on your truck. 2 on the rear cross member and 1 on the end of each front fame dumb iron (remove the rubber plugs if they are still there). You can buy sliders with the same holes in them as well for side lifts if you want.

On the chain front. There is a shear pin in the hi-lift that is designed to break well before the chain as long as you use the correct welded link chain that is made for this type of recovery. Most winch kits come with a section or you can buy it the same places you buy straps and stuff. It has a hook that is designed to fit over the links so you can use it to shorten the length easily and take up the slack in the rigging as is mentioned above.

As with anything else chain is not a 1 size fits all item. You need to make sure you use the correct type for what you are doing or it can break just like anything else.

 

[Rancho]

This! I remember when I was a young man, we had to use a Hi Lift to get a buddy's truck out of a water crossing, used my Jeep as the "anchor" and took about an hour to get him out. Bought a Warn after that. LOL

I apparently have warmer feelings about the HiLift than most. I've used it as a winch. It is dreadfully tedious, but it works.

It is, no doubt, a dangerous tool to use if you're neither skilled nor attentive, but so is a winch, table saw or claw hammer. Each person should decide for him or herself whether they can use a Hi-Lift safely and follow the directions and live with the limitations.

I don't know that comparing a sub-$200 HiLift with attachments to an integrated winch system is relevant. The better approach would seem to be to compare it to an alternative of similar cost, and I'm not sure what else you can buy that for that kind of money that will do you as much good. There is certainly every reason to have a proper winch setup if it's worth the money to you, but you can do a lot of overlanding without getting routinely stuck. If your winching needs are not frequent (as it is with my Sprinter's winch setup), you can end up looking at an investment of several hundred dollars per use.

 

[ipgregory]

Was on a training course a couple of years ago and we were 'practicing' using a hi-lift to winch. Broken up into teams in a form of semi-competition to see who could ‘winch' their ‘stuck' vehicle the furthest in a given amount of time. 3 to a team. Level ground, dirt lot. 1 vehicle as the anchor, the other as the ‘stuck' vehicle.

So we rigged up and started winching. My 90 as the anchor and a 91 RRC as the ‘stuck' truck. Now using a hi-lift as a winch is sweat forming at the best of times but this was murder. All 3 of us where taking turns on this thing and sweating like dogs. But the truck was moving (just).

We dragged it 10 feet or so before we noticed the wheels on the RRC where not turning as it was moving. We were all that focused on the jacking that was killing us.

Ended up that the bloody idiot team leader (me your honor) had overlooked one important little point in the prep. The RRC was still in park with the T-Case in High!

Surprisingly my little 90 didn't move. Had chocks on the wheels and it buried them but it dug its heels in and let that big ole' RRC get dragged. :victory:

 

[R-Overland]

Was on a training course a couple of years ago and we were 'practicing' using a hi-lift to winch. Broken up into teams in a form of semi-competition to see who could ‘winch' their ‘stuck' vehicle the furthest in a given amount of time. 3 to a team. Level ground, dirt lot. 1 vehicle as the anchor, the other as the ‘stuck' vehicle.

So we rigged up and started winching. My 90 as the anchor and a 91 RRC as the ‘stuck' truck. Now using a hi-lift as a winch is sweat forming at the best of times but this was murder. All 3 of us where taking turns on this thing and sweating like dogs. But the truck was moving (just).

We dragged it 10 feet or so before we noticed the wheels on the RRC where not turning as it was moving. We were all that focused on the jacking that was killing us.

Ended up that the bloody idiot team leader (me your honor) had overlooked one important little point in the prep. The RRC was still in park with the T-Case in High!

Surprisingly my little 90 didn't move. Had chocks on the wheels and it buried them but it dug its heels in and let that big ole' RRC get dragged. :victory:

:victory: nice story

 

[cgalpha08]

So much negativity in this thread! hehe

In my experience, as long as your not stupid, it works. It will winch, painfully slow, but it will winch, just don't exceed its weight capacity. Its not going to winch you up a hill but it will get you the few inches you need to get out /over whatever obstacle your dealing with.

For my rig, i have tow hooks that the HL will hook up to for trail repairs, changing tires, etc.

Let me put it this way....id rather have it than not have it. Its a great tool and has many useful functions.

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