How are you guys handling yourselves in strange circumstances off the grid?

[Mtpisgah]

So I had an interesting night back in December. I went to visit dad and stayed in his tiny house Friday but decided to camp Saturday. I went to Manchester State Forest about 20 min from his house. There are a bunch of mtb trails there and the adjacent Poinsett State Park which worked well for my morning plans. Around 130am I was sleeping well until I heard dogs barking. My first thought was coyotes and then wild dogs once I listened a bit more. Then I hear a truck coming down the dirt road to my secluded spot. I pulled my gun from the gun safe I have in my AluCab canopy camper and sat there. The truck pulled into the area and a couple of guys get out, one was obviously drunk.

They start talking about the truck and what is it doing there, and then realize I am camping. Then they start talking trash and saying don’t mess with their stuff, this is Sumter county, best be ready for them, they should just shoot me now, the guy has a .38 special, some random yelling, blah blah blah. Then they walk off into the woods in the direction of the barking. Then I figured it was probably dog fighting they were there for.

I had stayed quiet and still the entire time. I considering yelling that I grew up there, probably knew people they knew, I am a good guy. But I knew that would probably not matter and might open then up to wanting to really mess with me.

As soon as their head lamps were out of sight I packed up the camper and hit the road. I camped in my dad’s back yard because it was so nice out. Not nearly as cool of a campsite, but safer I suppose. I could have gone to the tiny house but did not feel like it.

Had I been in a beater truck instead of a Gladiator with ACCC they may not have said anything, but I think they saw an expensive vehicle compared to their ~20 year old Ram 1500 and figure I was not prepared.

I made the right decision by staying quiet and bugging out. I was ready if they escalated it had them outgunned with four 17 rounds mags to their claimed .38, but it only takes one lucky shot for me to loose. I had no shame in leaving the site when I felt I could do so safely.

Now I need to find a new place to camp when I am there.

 

[DaveInDenver]

As someone that lives in the UK and travelled widely throughout my country, Europe, Asia and beyond, some of the above posts appear quite alarming!

Do average Americans really believe it is necessary to carry a side arm for protection when they venture out into the countryside? Are the woods really awash with ne'er-do-well types that want to attack you in the middle of the night? Are there really meth heads, stoners & alcoholics at every campsite starring you out?

A mostly no with a caveat yes. The movies and TV are not exactly representative of the U.S. but we do have a high propensity to lock people in prison. We suck at math but we are #1 for incarceration due to draconian drug laws and mandatory sentencing, amongst other factors. The worst can happen though crime has been trending down for decades in reality.

Still, in the west anyway, it's not unusual if you wander far enough from the tourist trade routes to trip across illegal drug operations or closer to the border human trafficking. So while it's not exactly the "wild west" it's not the worst idea to be aware of telltale surroundings.

Personally, I've only ever tripped across marijuana growers. Haven't seen anyone or been confronted but it's happened enough that I have an M.O., which is to turn tail and not hang around to find out. My guess is if no one is actually around there will be game cameras.

Ironically, it seems to have gotten worse here in Colorado since legalization. Not sure why but I suspect demand grew significantly but regulation caused unintended consequences like making it no easier to get and probably more expensive (it's heavily taxed) so the "non-approved" supply fills a big void.

 

[calicamper]

A mostly no with a caveat yes. The movies and TV are not exactly representative of the U.S. but we do have a high propensity to lock people in prison. We suck at math but we are #1 for incarceration due to draconian drug laws and mandatory sentencing, amongst other factors. The worst can happen though crime has been trending down for decades in reality.

Still, in the west anyway, it's not unusual if you wander far enough from the tourist trade routes to trip across illegal drug operations or closer to the border human trafficking. So while it's not exactly the "wild west" it's not the worst idea to be aware of telltale surroundings.

Personally, I've only ever tripped across marijuana growers. Haven't seen anyone or been confronted but it's happened enough that I have an M.O., which is to turn tail and not hang around to find out. My guess is if no one is actually around there will be game cameras.

Ironically, it seems to have gotten worse here in Colorado since legalization. Not sure why but I suspect demand grew significantly but regulation caused unintended consequences like making it no easier to get and probably more expensive (it's heavily taxed) so the "non-approved" supply fills a big void.

Legal sales but untraceable sources created a fantastic high profit market for the illegal growers. Could get really interesting out west with our water situation being seriously bad. Hopefully the resources to go after the illegal stuff get a bump in funding due to water fights lol.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Legal sales but untraceable sources created a fantastic high profit market for the illegal growers. Could get really interesting out west with our water situation being seriously bad. Hopefully the resources to go after the illegal stuff get a bump in funding due to water fights lol.

Ha, they'll succeed in removing all the invasive tamarisk from the river banks and the levels still won't come back, eh?

 

[OllieChristopher]

This is 5 pages of paranoia!! It blows my mind the encounters that off grid travelers are unable to avoid. I have never once been in a sketchy situation in the woods or the desert because I set my camp up with a plan. All these YouTube videos of goofballs making camp on smooth areas and easy to approach access is mind blowing.

When I'm truly off grid I think stealth and invisible to others. I'm not one "advertise my location". I make clever use of brush, trees and terrain to keep hidden. I always set myself up with a way to know of intrusion way before it comes close to me.

The only time I ever have odd encounters are when I'm in a Yellow Post or pay campsite. Then it's just rude campers.

Bottom line is every single person posting here of strange encounters is not truly off grid and needs to learn basic evasion and concealment techniques. I remove any trace of entry to the point that only a good tracker could penetrate. I learned from the best. My best friend who recently passed away used to poach deer/elk/moose and never once came close to getting caught. I brought that skill he taught to me and glad to have it. It's really not all that difficult.

 

[calicamper]

Ha, they'll succeed in removing all the invasive tamarisk from the river banks and the levels still won't come back, eh?

No rivers out west where the illegal growers set up. The preferred is small creeks they dam up, pre mix illegal nasty fertilizer junk right into the creek and then gravity feed it down to the grow. We have this issue behind our home in water shed land. But due to the contamination threat to a major drinking water facility the black ops guys run regular “training” sessions back there. Most are former Marines who like to keep their skills sharp.

 

[Todd780]

This topic reminds me of this:

https://expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/scariest-freaky-moments-when-camping-or-offroad.10705/

 

[rruff]

Some circumstances for me:
- someone breaks into my house/car/camper while I am in it.
- someone approaches me brandishing (legal term) a weapon.

It seems to me that when someone already has a gun pointed at me, reaching for my gun would be an incredibly poor choice. When would it make sense to do that?

No one has tried to break into my vehicle while I was in it. I can't imagine why anyone would. But if they did, and they couldn't be deterred with verbal warnings (again hard to imagine), I'd find something in my truck to hurt them with, if they actually made it in.

I respectfully disagree. Having spent so much time in the wilds, one would think you would be in tune with what feels normal and what does not.

If you run when things feel sketchy, you never find out if you really needed to run or not. I think I'd miss a lot if I behaved that way. I don't run and I discovered that I don't need to... which is great because I don't need to worry or wonder, or be on edge... live in fear. Rather I get very alert and observant if it seems dangerous, and I meet the situation (people) calmly and openly. It's always turned out fine. YMMV.

If you've had guns pointed at you on numerous occasions, you are such a statistical outlier that you should really evaluate how you find yourself in those situations. The vast majority of people have never had a gun pointed at them once, much less twice.

Back when I was living in the boonies full time, there was hardly anyone else doing it (I actually can't think of one). And like someone else mentioned, some people believe they own the public land in the area and behave accordingly; they "greet" me with guns out and want to know what I'm doing there. That was probably most of the "incidents". Others were just encountering people who were in the wilds doing whatever, and they felt safer with a gun on me until they decided I was ok. They were always civil once they had a chance to talk to me. It was annoying, but not alarming... because I'd already realized that if you wanted to use your gun for protection, you needed to have it out! I also had plenty of experience with citizens doing their own armed policing in rural IL. We didn't have public land so it was always happening on private property, but for example... if grandma called and said she heard a noise in the barn, you grabbed a shotgun and checked it out rather than call the sheriff.

The first time I had a gun pointed at me was when I was 15; me and a couple guys were pranking their older brothers, who were home alone on New Years Eve with their girlfriends. One of the girls freaked out and called her dad... who was getting drunk at a party... and as we were getting ready to leave, three cars full of drunken farmers came flying down the icy road... sliding to a stop blocking our exit... and then they jumped out and pulled their guns on us. I was in awe at how well they executed that move, considering. It was impressive! Also pretty exciting until they realized who we were.

As for assessing potential threats in my vicinity, I use the exact same information that everyone else uses. It must work pretty well, because in 45 years of life, including work in private security, law enforcement and mental health work, I'm still on one piece. Only once did I actually have to directly address a potential assailant (not work related) and I handled it with deterrence and distraction. The only difference is I have one additional tool that has an extremely narrow application, but for that application, it is the absolute best tool. For that type of situation to arise, the threat will have to get through multiple layers of awareness and protection, and have to continue through all of the opportunities I give them to make a different choice. I don't carry the gun because I think I will need it. If I thought I needed it, I would not be in that location.

What I do must work pretty well also...

For those of you who think it's very weird for someone to "greet" another with a gun in their hands, I'd like to know how you believe your gun would be useful otherwise. I couldn't think of many plausible scenarios where it would help against an *actual* threat, unless I pulled it out preemptively... which is why I got rid of mine.

They start talking about the truck and what is it doing there, and then realize I am camping. Then they start talking trash and saying don’t mess with their stuff, this is Sumter county, best be ready for them, they should just shoot me now, the guy has a .38 special, some random yelling, blah blah blah. Then they walk off into the woods in the direction of the barking. Then I figured it was probably dog fighting they were there for.

I had stayed quiet and still the entire time. I considering yelling that I grew up there, probably knew people they knew, I am a good guy. But I knew that would probably not matter and might open then up to wanting to really mess with me.

I think you handled it well, but ...just as an example... my inclination would be to go up to them and say hi (without the gun). That would be the time to calmly mention that you grew up there, would never dream of messing with their stuff, etc. A lot of incidents and conflict escalate because people stay in their little bubbles and their imaginations run wild. I'd leave afterwards and find another spot regardless, because drunken idiots and fighting dogs are pretty much the opposite of what I look for when I go to the woods.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Who knows ? Maybe decrease in crime is somehow related to locking up criminals ?

Perhaps, although the majority are non-violent drug users that can't bail out or hit the ladder-climbing D.A. jackpot of 3rd strike or plea deal. Violent crime has gone down, which I'm sure is simply coincident with the rising adoption of CCW in almost every state.

 

[OllieChristopher]

And the drama continues. I wonder how many of these stories are even real. I find it very difficult to believe all this nonsense. I've been camping in the Western US since a child and never once encountered close to what EP members are describing.

 

[Todd780]

And the drama continues. I wonder how many of these stories are even real. I find it very difficult to believe all this nonsense. I've been camping in the Western US since a child and never once encountered close to what EP members are describing.

I've had a weird encounter once as well....

 

[rruff]

No rivers out west where the illegal growers set up. The preferred is small creeks they dam up, pre mix illegal nasty fertilizer junk right into the creek and then gravity feed it down to the grow.

I thought with legalization, the state would spend some of the regulation and licensing $$$ to shut down illegal operations. But I guess they are just operating as usual?

 

[rruff]

This is 5 pages of paranoia!!

Actually, what you wrote seems pretty paranoid to me... Behaving like you are poacher, trying to hide. Do you also have camouflage nets so you can't be spotted from drones?

 

[jaxyaks]

 

[BritKLR]

View attachment 707851

The truth.....