How are you guys handling yourselves in strange circumstances off the grid?

[ITTOG]

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I like that approach. Sometimes I fantasize about the last part.

About ten years ago a group of about eight, all family, were out exploring on our ATV's. Something we do a few times a year. We crossed a creek and followed the trail to the left. After the turn we rounded a bend and was met with death stares from at least four guys and a couple women. All of the men had pistols and/or shotguns. It only took a single glance to know to get out of there as fast as possible. This was miles from any roads and they were very shocked to see us. We all turned our bikes as fast as possible and got out of there. We went several miles before stopping and discussed what we saw over a couple beers. Everyone was pretty confident they were growing weed and making cocaine.

Almost all of us carry pistols and could have used them if needed (half the crew are veterans) but we were very happy they let us turnaround without shooting at us. Curiosity made us want to go back the next day to see if they were still there but it wasn't worth the risk. We have not been within a mile of that area since.

 

[calicamper]

I thought with legalization, the state would spend some of the regulation and licensing $$$ to shut down illegal operations. But I guess they are just operating as usual?

They have only you need to understand that even prior to legalizing it the Game Wardens (primary enforcement/bust leaders) literally had lists of targets that outnumbered their ability to go in and address them during the preferred time to make the busts. They literally have grows they slate to bust next season given they don’t have enough days and people to do them all. That was prior to legalization.

 

[Todd780]

I like that approach. Sometimes I fantasize about the last part.

About ten years ago a group of about eight, all family, were out exploring on our ATV's. Something we do a few times a year. We crossed a creek and followed the trail to the left. After the turn we rounded a bend and was met with death stares from at least four guys and a couple women. All of the men had pistols and/or shotguns. It only took a single glance to know to get out of there as fast as possible. This was miles from any roads and they were very shocked to see us. We all turned our bikes as fast as possible and got out of there. We went several miles before stopping and discussed what we saw over a couple beers. Everyone was pretty confident they were growing weed and making cocaine.

Almost all of us carry pistols and could have used them if needed (half the crew are veterans) but we were very happy they let us turnaround without shooting at us. Curiosity made us want to go back the next day to see if they were still there but it wasn't worth the risk. We have not been within a mile of that area since.

orrrr....

 

[Hegear]

I carry a gun but have never had to use it.

I also always carry a few extra beers. I’ve found regardless of situation offering a drink breaks down barriers and makes people smile!

 

[OllieChristopher]

Actually, what you wrote seems pretty paranoid to me... Behaving like you are poacher, trying to hide. Do you also have camouflage nets so you can't be spotted from drones?

Not at all. I’m all about leaving no trace and enjoying my privacy. Nobody I have seen flys drones where I go. I’m using my friends poacher mentality as an extreme example of how to behave in the “Leave no trace” line of thinking.

Talk of pulling firearms and loaded shotguns when hearing wildlife is over the top paranoia.

So many just make a bunch of noise and dust and park in random easy to access campsites. It’s no wonder they are magnets to the undesirable dregs.

 

[gkieser92]

For those of you who think it's very weird for someone to "greet" another with a gun in their hands, I'd like to know how you believe your gun would be useful otherwise. I couldn't think of many plausible scenarios where it would help against an *actual* threat, unless I pulled it out preemptively... which is why I got rid of mine.

It is very weird for a civilian "greet" someone at gunpoint unless a specific threat is detected. I've never really seen that in my neck of the woods, even when the majority of people in the woods are armed (hunting season). As for how preemptive one has to be with a defensive tactic (gun or otherwise) depends of the totality of the circumstances. If you need more perspective than that, maybe seek out some training.

 

[Mtpisgah]

For those of you who think it's very weird for someone to "greet" another with a gun in their hands, I'd like to know how you believe your gun would be useful otherwise. I couldn't think of many plausible scenarios where it would help against an *actual* threat, unless I pulled it out preemptively... which is why I got rid of mine.



I think you handled it well, but ...just as an example... my inclination would be to go up to them and say hi (without the gun). That would be the time to calmly mention that you grew up there, would never dream of messing with their stuff, etc. A lot of incidents and conflict escalate because people stay in their little bubbles and their imaginations run wild. I'd leave afterwards and find another spot regardless, because drunken idiots and fighting dogs are pretty much the opposite of what I look for when I go to the woods.

Out of curiosity, how tall are you and how much do you weigh? I am 5’-4”, 140lbs, and fit. I am not a threat, but I can be an easy target.

I am situationally aware and my whole life I have had to worry about bigger guys. The solution for me was not to get out and great them because if it went south it might be too late to pull a gun. So the sensible solution was to stay in the camper, be ready if they took a random shot (unlikely I know) or approached the Jeep (also unlikely).

Even talking to them from the Jeep would not have served a better purpose than waiting until they left and then I could leave. If they had escalated the situation to more than just running their mouths, everything would have changed quickly.

Trying to hide my truck in the woods around here would not work. If the trees and shrubs are few enough to drive through then they are few enough to see through. And then there is the topo. And then there is the impact to the environment to consider. One vehicle may not matter, but the more people who do it the more damage occurs.

 

[BritKLR]

They have only you need to understand that even prior to legalizing it the Game Wardens (primary enforcement/bust leaders) literally had lists of targets that outnumbered their ability to go in and address them during the preferred time to make the busts. They literally have grows they slate to bust next season given they don’t have enough days and people to do them all. That was prior to legalization.

Generally speaking there are a number of reasons Cash Crop operations are not prioritized. Staffing, lack of investigative resources, lack of tactical resources, prosecution support/interest, other investigative priorities, etc.....funding is usually not an issue.
As for back country risk of running across clandestine grows/drug ops....it happens. The last one I worked was found by two deer hunters. They were the size of two football fields, irrigation systems, booby traps and escape routes.......all done on the airport property and at the end of the Runway "A" at the Kansas City International Airport! A tactical nightmare.....
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[calicamper]

Generally speaking there are a number of reasons Cash Crop operations are not prioritized. Staffing, lack of investigative resources, lack of tactical resources, prosecution support/interest, other investigative priorities, etc.....funding is usually not an issue.
As for back country risk of running across clandestine grows/drug ops....it happens. The last one I worked was found by two deer hunters. They were the size of two football fields, irrigation systems, booby traps and escape routes.......all done on the private property and at the end of the Runway "A" at the Kansas City International Airport! A tactical nightmare.....
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Yeah most case priority get driven by public risk/proximity also. Not by size.

 

[stevo_pct]

Out of curiosity, how tall are you and how much do you weigh? I am 5’-4”, 140lbs, and fit. I am not a threat, but I can be an easy target.

I am situationally aware and my whole life I have had to worry about bigger guys. The solution for me was not to get out and great them because if it went south it might be too late to pull a gun. So the sensible solution was to stay in the camper, be ready if they took a random shot (unlikely I know) or approached the Jeep (also unlikely).

Even talking to them from the Jeep would not have served a better purpose than waiting until they left and then I could leave. If they had escalated the situation to more than just running their mouths, everything would have changed quickly.

Trying to hide my truck in the woods around here would not work. If the trees and shrubs are few enough to drive through then they are few enough to see through. And then there is the topo. And then there is the impact to the environment to consider. One vehicle may not matter, but the more people who do it the more damage occurs.

I would have done exactly as you did - and I'm 6'2" and 200 pounds. No way I would get out of my camper in that situation in the middle of the night. I would have stayed inside and stayed quiet. If they tried to get in, I would let them know I was in there at that point. If they still tried to get in, only then would I bring a firearm into the equation. That is highly unlikely - but I'd rather have it and not need it...

Also, the reason I primarily carry a firearm (and when I say carry, I don't mean open carry - I mean there is one in my truck/camper) is for bear protection. It just happens to work for two-legged threats as well.

A lot of camping places out west are very much in the open no matter how far off the beaten path you get. So hidden campsites are often not possible.

A dog is about the best protection you can have. They are way more attentive with more acute senses than we have. Most people and most wild animals are deterred by barking dogs.

I have never had a problem camping anywhere in the western US in 25 years of exploring - two legged or four legged. I think the US is a very safe place to travel and camp outdoors.

 

[rruff]

It is very weird for a civilian "greet" someone at gunpoint unless a specific threat is detected. I've never really seen that in my neck of the woods, even when the majority of people in the woods are armed (hunting season). As for how preemptive one has to be with a defensive tactic (gun or otherwise) depends of the totality of the circumstances. If you need more perspective than that, maybe seek out some training.

Guns were not generally pointed at me directly, but in their hands and ready. A little internet research indicates that it is illegal most places... but plenty of people do it. I think it's pretty obvious from this thread that people would tend to be wary and suspicious of a lone male they encounter in the middle of nowhere, and they feel safer with a gun in their hands.

I'm interested in some examples of situations that you believe would be likely, where a hidden gun would be useful against an actual threat. I don't consider someone being an ************** verbally (trying to pick a fight, act tough, be scary) an actual threat, because I haven't had any trouble defusing those situations. I assume that someone who'd want to harm/kill me (for fun?) or steal my stuff, would brandish a weapon prior to making demands or otherwise making their intentions obvious, so it would then be too late for me to pull out a gun. I wouldn't want to get in a gunfight over my stuff anyway, especially if they had the upper hand.

Out of curiosity, how tall are you and how much do you weigh? I am 5’-4”, 140lbs, and fit. I am not a threat, but I can be an easy target.
I am situationally aware and my whole life I have had to worry about bigger guys. The solution for me was not to get out and great them because if it went south it might be too late to pull a gun.

6' 170. Very normal sized. I don't think being small would be a problem, because you don't want to be intimidating at all. My idea is that things were kinda headed south in their minds without your input... and IME being friendly, non-threatening, and unafraid works wonders, even with people who are the biggest **************** in the world and looking for a fight.

 

[Highlander]

There are areas where the risk is high.
I run into some creepy people but no incidents.

I didn’t used to see them 10 years ago as much but now I do.

 

[Mtpisgah]

6' 170. Very normal sized. I don't think being small would be a problem, because you don't want to be intimidating at all. My idea is that things were kinda headed south in their minds without your input... and IME being friendly, non-threatening, and unafraid works wonders, even with people who are the biggest **************** in the world and looking for a fight.

Maybe normal sized, but 8“ taller than me. Go find a guy 8” taller than you and tell me how you feel.

Things were going south without my input so I kept my input to myself. Not being afraid and friendly can work wonders, but 130am with intoxicated people is not the time for a social experiment. Not being intimidating is great, but it also allows them to try to intimidate me. I will pass and stay quiet until the time comes to be loud.

 

[JaSAn]

JaSAn said:
For those of you who think it's very weird for someone to "greet" another with a gun in their hands, I'd like to know how you believe your gun would be useful otherwise. I couldn't think of many plausible scenarios where it would help against an *actual* threat, unless I pulled it out preemptively... which is why I got rid of mine.

It is very weird for a civilian "greet" someone at gunpoint unless a specific threat is detected . . .

Please don't attribute to me words that I didn't write!
That is not my quote.

 

[rruff]

...130am with intoxicated people is not the time for a social experiment.

Oh, I didn't realize it was that late! No, I wouldn't have bothered then...