Hydronic vs. Non-Hydronic Heating. (Air & Water)

[mezmochill]

Do these rigs have showers? If not why do you need hot water? Boil it on a stove??

 

[waveslider]

Showers = Yes

 

[waveslider]

Plug into what? Nearby bush? Assume you mean your own campers battery system. I've not done the math .. but yea sounds like too much draw and wear on the system. Now if you have a genny...... hmmmm..... good point. Course getting genny started in cold weather is another issue too.

Has no one considered this previously or just no experience with attempting such a move? Given the cold-hardiness of modern diesel engines and the state of battery technology, for the person that only occasionally needs that little extra warmth to start it up this might be a decent option. Plug in yourself to yourself.

 

[Coachgeo]

Do these rigs have showers? If not why do you need hot water? Boil it on a stove??

this hot water is used to heat the camper. AKA radiant heat. Especially appealing for those who want to cary just one fuel type or want to scavenge engine heat for camper heat as well.

 

[dwh]

I suspect most draw around 1100wats or what would that be? 10 amps? Obviously, that a serious draw. But wouldn't an induction cooktop be in the same neighborhood?

10a @ 110v. Around 100a @ 12v.

Engine pre-heat can be done with less watts:

https://wolverineheater.com/collections


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Reduced cooling system pressure due to rubber hose expansion is probably not an issue. Factory optional rear heat/air in vans runs hoses to the back.

 

[Hillbilly Heaven]

10a @ 110v. Around 100a @ 12v.

Engine pre-heat can be done with less watts:

https://wolverineheater.com/collections

Wished they had magnetic backing.

 

[waveslider]

As I looked at the website its seems like their's are only recommended to be plugged in and left overnight, vs the higher rate factory options that need plugged in for an hour or so prior to starting. Seems like the power draw would overall be greater with the Wolverine option?

 

[grizzlyj]

Hi
I

Another thing worth mentioning is the need for another pump to circulate coolant if you have the two systems separated by a heat exchanger. Not sure that hose expansion is as big of an issue as you think it is considering installs have been done like this for years without issue. I've never seen a heat exchanger recommended by the manufacturer anyway. Do you have a link to that info?

Hi
No link sorry. As I said it's just what I was told. But, by a friend I trust who has built an in use camper truck and had a lot of help and input from Eberspacher.

I do have some fitting guidance they sent me directly for my install but I have yet to go through all that. But mine won't be plumbed into the truck engine water cooling system cos there isn't one If I find info in that bumf regarding heat exchanger fitting for system separation I'll post up if and when I find it.

 

[thebigblue]

Keep in mind as well.... some engine heaters are said to NOT be run when the engine is running unless they are a separate circuit. Mine is NOS military it is does say to NOT operate when engine is running.

Most modern diesel engines is so efficient today that there is not enough heat from the engine coolant to heat the cabin in the car during winter - so these are fitted with a supplement diesel heater (ie Webasto) and these will certainly only run at the same time s the engine...

 

[Joe917]

Never heard of a diesel that did not make heat when running, that's what diesels do.

 

[grizzlyj]

Our Mog temp guage would sometimes head south on a long down hill run when it was cold out, especially using the exhaust brake for some reason. Substantially dipped immediately with that on.

 

[Joe917]

Sure temps drop on descent with engine brake on, fuel is cut off the only heat is from air compression, but it made a hell of alot of heat on the climb up to the descent! My point is all diesels make excess heat, it only makes sens to use it.

 

[thebigblue]

Never heard of a diesel that did not make heat when running, that's what diesels do.

Jep - but as I said modern (common rail) diesels do not make a lot of excess heat - hence they are fitted with a supplement heater to cope in cold weather running (winter in EU ie.) - trust me, or do a bit of research pls

 

[dwh]

As I looked at the website its seems like their's are only recommended to be plugged in and left overnight, vs the higher rate factory options that need plugged in for an hour or so prior to starting. Seems like the power draw would overall be greater with the Wolverine option?

Depends. I doubt you actually have to leave it plugged in all night. Those heat pads are usually to preheat the oil in the pan and/or the fuel filter. A couple of hours pre-heat is probably enough.

What's less? 1100w for one hour or 350w for two hours? (250w oilpan, 100w fuel filter)

 

[nathane]

The way our system runs:
We have a shut off valve between the engine side and the Webasto living space side, the valve is only on one side of the loop.
engine on, Webasto off, valve open: engine heat heats calorifier and cabin(radiators controlled by individual valves(in summer you can heat domestic water only)
engine off, Webasto on,valve open: engine preheat, calirofier heat, cabin heat
engine off, Webasto on, valve closed, engine is out of loop, Webasto heating calorifier and cabin only. Cabin temperature controlled by a thermostat.

In summer the valve is just left open. In winter, closed when parked, open for preheat and driving.

This set up is also used on boats.

Joe (or anyone else with similar calorifier set ups), your set up sounds very similar to my plans so I wonder if I can sense check my "thought experiment" with your real life experience.

Hab unit is 16 cubic meters around 35% of which is storage so not an enormous volume. We will have 60mm foam sandwich walls with high insulation properties.

I'm planning a hydronic system:

Engine circuit / cut off valve to isolate engine when parked / webasto st90 circuit into coil 1 of dual coil 40 litre calorifier. Allows circuits to be combined or run independently.

Coil 2 of calorifier into hab unit heating circuit incorporating c2.5m underfloor heat and 3 linear m of radiators behind the seat backs in the u shaped dining area.

Allows separation of the two circuits because the calorifier will be chassis mounted.

I will be fitting a hab unit aircon (webasto freshwell 3000) that has heating to give me a short air heat capability so the slow start of the hydronic is manageable.

Does this sound workable?