The Xplore suspension is interesting and I agree that hydraulics are very reliable in general. The hydraulic pump and reservoir system is the same as used on dump trailers. Mine worked flawlessly and I used it often.
On the Xplore Trailer Community Facebook page, I deliberately discourage posting prices, other than the advertised manufacturer pricing. This is because as soon as somebody posts a low ball price, everyone will take that to their dealer and demand they beat it. It is a race to the bottom that does not account for other factors related to dealers. The dealers are our friends and provide a good service to the community. It is not good practice to use an on-line forum to pit one dealer against another, which is exactly what will happen. If the bottom line is the only consideration, service will suffer and dealers will not be able to have a more personal relationship with their customers. There will always be someone willing to cut the price lower and be a bigger disappointment in the end, while hurting the entire industry. We need quality dealers who stand behind the products and act as a liason between the public and the factory. We need them to be financially stable, understand the products and be available to help after the sale. Otherwise the public is left out in the cold with warrantee problems. Every business has to be profitable in order to thrive. Businesses have to thrive in order to build reputations and a solid customer base. Customers are the strongest form of advertising. Getting the absolute lowest price from a dealer who is only interested in quick sales, will lead to a disappointing result. There is much more to a free-market than short term price shopping or helping others find the lowest possible price. Encouraging people to go for the lowest price without realizing the problems, is only doing them a disservice. Black Series is a good example of what not to do in this area, but it happens in all industries.
I agree that we need good dealers, just like we need good, educated buyers. We can have all of that and have dealers compete at the same. Every individual needs to decide what kind of dealer they want to work with. A more inexperienced person might want a dealer that spends more time with them. They would value this and be willing to pay more for the service. An experienced buyer who is mechanically inclined might just need the best price and doesn't care about the after sale support because they never plan to see that dealer again. All of this can be accomplished and those of us on these forums can still share pricing information and specific dealer interactions. All online information is just a starting point for someone looking to make a purchase. As long as people aren't unfairly attacking a dealer, what's the big deal advertising pricing? It may be the only metric that is truly unbiased. Some dealers might pride themselves on their low pricing, others on their exceptional service. Regardless, I'll always vote in favor of more data over less data in all things!
I love the CM ATX on our Kingdom Camping trailer. We're not seeing any air leakage as we sit in camp, the compressor system is easy to use, and it's incredibly convenient to be able to air up things quickly and easily. We've only been using it for a month, but so far it's a homerun.
The problem with your logic is nobody thinks they are going to have warantee problems and everybody wants the lowest price. One dealer may spend two days on a pre-delivery inspection to make sure everything is right, at their own cost, and the next may deliberately send out a trailer with no PDI hoping to charge back warrantee work to the factory as profit on the sale. He has an incentive to send out a trailer with known problems (BTW, this does happen). Finding the lowest possible price that somebody posts on-line and taking that to the dealer with a demand to beat it, is a poor way to do business. It's insulting and short sighted. That is why posting the suggested retail is fine, but negotiations must be done at the dealer level to find the best deal. Buying a trailer is not the same as buying Ford truck, for instance. I've seen way too many trailers purchased at the lowest possible price form dealers that were either dishonest or knew nothing about the product. This has lead to serious frustration. Dealers cannot compete on price alone because the buyer can keep going around and around the circle getting a few dollars more off from dealer after dealer, until the cost is below the dealer cost. Dealers that sell below cost have to make it up somewhere or go out of business. This is not rocket science and it does not mean high prices are OK. It means fairness, honesty and stability in the industry are the best policies. Encouraging people to always go for the lowest possible initial price and pitting one dealer against another in the process is damaging to the whole industry. I'm sorry you can't see that, but it's true. Dealers are not our enemies, unless they are dishonest.
Same with my R1. It doesn't leak and it super easy to use.
You said: "The problem with your logic is nobody thinks they are going to have warantee (sic) problems and everybody wants the lowest price." That's where we disagree. I don't think you can put ALL of the millions of RV buyers into the same behavior category(ies). I'm sure you're not someone who thought he would never have a warranty problem or who just wanted the lowest price. I'm not someone who fits into either of those categories either. I'd be willing to bet there are other like minded consumers who read this site who also don't fit into either of those categories. In any event, that makes at least two people in the entire world who do not fall into your category of a "bad buyer".
Of course dealers are not the enemy. Of course dealers should expect to compete on price and/or service. Of course they should expect to have information on their prices and service be spread far and wide in the Internet-driven world in which we live. Even your beloved ROA has done You Tube videos about how some dealers aren't that great and and how they are so awesome. They aren't wrong! You are allowed to patrol your Facebook page however you see fit, but you shouldn't feel the need to protect the RV dealers from buyers or the buyers from themselves. Posting pricing is just one aspect of transparency. If price posting causes a dealer to go out of business, they probably deserve to go out of business. Post your best damn price and then convince the buyers why your total package is worth paying more (or less) for. I understand exactly what you're saying, I just disagree with some of your premises. It doesn't mean I don't like you.?
I guess you are referring to me. Maybe you are unfamiliar with the terrible reputation that some dealers have and that certain brands have. The Xplore Trailer Community site is dedicated to being an honest public forum that helps with all kinds of problems and does not show favoritism to any dealers. It's a site with a friendly community spirit. There is no hidden agenda. None. What it does do is try to promote a higher standard than the simple transactional nature so prevalent and damaging in the RV industry, that leads to many problems. Part of that is to prevent on-line keyboard jockeys from starting price wars that help nobody. I don't name dealers, I don't promote particular dealers and I don't allow low-ball pricing numbers to be used as levers against dealers. Anybody can pick up the phone and call dealers for pricing, it's not up to you, or me or anyone to tell everybody an imagined price and try to force dealers to a lower bottom line. I believe the dealers are an important part of the overall picture, not adversaries. I have a long history of successful business strategies based on fairness and personalized service. It sounds to me like you have an agenda against dealers who offer more than the most shortsighted view of their customers. Too bad. We all want the best price we can get, but there is so much more to the story. I'm not promoting high prices. Too bad you can't see that. Try studying actual warantee issues, who the modern buyers of higher end trailers are, what they want and expect, compared to what they so often get. And look at quality issues prevalent with so many brands. Overall customer satisfaction is the goal. I've long said that buying based only on the bottom line is a trap in many cases. It's time the whole industry met a higher standard of service. And there are dealers doing exactly that, in spite of attempts to drive them to do less.
Having a "public forum" does not mean having a free-for-all. The most successful forums have a set of strict rules that must be adhered to. Rules of decorum promote success. "Public" does not mean anything goes. And who said I delete posts? You said it, not me. Try reading the forum rules of some random successful sites and you'll begin to understand. Further, you have no inside information about any particular dealer that "needs to charge more to keep the lights on" because they "organize huge groups". There is an old saying that goes something like: if you have to exaggerate to make a point, perhaps you have no point. You keep sharing assumed or false information to support false conclusions. Why? Just do some research and let the chips fall where they may.
what other xplore FB administrator is in this discussion so yes i was referring to you. You have a great group and I have learned alot from you and your members and I thank you for posting such knowledgeable well written opinions and modifications on your trailers. You have to admit that you mention the Utah dealer more then any other as you have bought at least your last two rigs there and probably do more business with them the any other IO dealer. Nothing wrong with that. I believe IO does not like or let any of thier dealers sell the new xplores for much less then retail so we are only talking a few grand differences. I don't think any dealer is giving them away. I noticed the CO dealer started discounting the x145 below 100k and others out west here didn't. So do they have bad service? I believe the local dealer has the x195 listed a bit less then the CO dealer. So who knows what folks are really paying. Which is why folks like to ask around in FB groups
Maybe I was wrong. I saw a post from a lady about costs that you repremended then it seem to be gone but maybe it just got buried and not deleted. My point was certain dealers have a higher overhead and no I have no inside information. How is that exaggerating. (rhetorical question) what false information other then me assuming the lady's post was deleted. I think folks might be tired of this conversation so let's move on shall we