INEOS Grenadier

[Junx]

Like many, I put the money down to be in line, but I really doubt I’m going to to purchase anything with a BMW engine. I can’t even begin to express how unappealing the thought of that engine/tranny combo is to me. A light duty truck drivetrain from any other manufacturer would have been a vanilla choice, and perfect for the job. I just wonder who sits down to design a defender replacement, that fixes the defender reliability flaws, and picks what is essentially a car drivetrain. Weird.

Comically one of the most desirable defenders has a BMW 6 cylinder

https://www.bmwblog.com/2021/09/01/lets-all-remember-the-bmw-powered-land-rover-defender/

and the Rover v8 was used in, uh... Everything.

The Coolest Cars Powered By The Legendary Rover V8

The Rover V8 is one of the most legendary engines in the automotive industry and has been used in several cars over the years.

www.hotcars.com

The chevy 250 straight six was in everything from bread trucks and pickups to camaro's and chevelles.

The myth of "car engine vs truck engine" is nonsense.

 

[toddz69]

The myth of "car engine vs truck engine" is nonsense.

In most, but not all instances, I'd agree with that. I would put forth the Ford 240/300 sixes were always designed as, and run as truck engines - they never made it into cars. The same could be said of the light duty diesel engines (Ford 6.9/7.3, GM 6.2/6.5 and Dodge 5.9 Cummins).

Todd Z.

 

[zimm]

Comically one of the most desirable defenders has a BMW 6 cylinder

https://www.bmwblog.com/2021/09/01/lets-all-remember-the-bmw-powered-land-rover-defender/

and the Rover v8 was used in, uh... Everything.

The Coolest Cars Powered By The Legendary Rover V8

The Rover V8 is one of the most legendary engines in the automotive industry and has been used in several cars over the years.

www.hotcars.com

The chevy 250 straight six was in everything from bread trucks and pickups to camaro's and chevelles.

The myth of "car engine vs truck engine" is nonsense.

Telling me something is more desirable than a rover v8, isn't the same as telling me something is good.

if were gonna go all classic, keep in mind, the recipie for american pony cars was to take out the typical passenger car drivetrains, and replaced them with the high torque truck v8's, transmissions, and rear ends.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

Obviously for a timing chain the engine would have to be pulled or transmission dropped. I think a full timing chain replacement is somewhat unlikely, though who knows as there are not a ton of high mileage engines to glean data from at this point. The far more common concern is repairing or servicing the VANOS system which is what controls the variable valve timing and will require special tools to complete. From what I have gleaned from the BMW community, expect a VANOS expedition in the 100-120k mile range and it can be done without pulling the engine. It's not cheap, and is complicated by the fact that the VANOS components will be located under the cowl, which is certainly disappointing, but not necessarily a deal breaker for me anyway.

Do I wish it had a simple naturally aspirated motor produced by someone other than BMW? Of course. I also wish I were better looking and more charismatic, but I deal with what reality gives me.

Bide your time, a LS swap kit will be coming out shortly I am sure lol.

 

[Grassland]

Yep, 4.8l GM V8 with a 4l60e and call er good. Haha.

As far as engine pull to do timing chain, plenty of Ford's get cab lifts or engine drops for major repairs on the 3.5 EB. I don't know what the Rams or GMs are like for major engine break downs. Weren't Hemis dropping valves?
Can't get the amazing HP and Torque in a broad power band without huge displacement or VVT systems anyways.

 

[NoDak]

When I win the lottery I'll be swapping a Chevy L31 350/4L80E into a Grenadier.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

Yep, 4.8l GM V8 with a 4l60e and call er good. Haha.

As far as engine pull to do timing chain, plenty of Ford's get cab lifts or engine drops for major repairs on the 3.5 EB. I don't know what the Rams or GMs are like for major engine break downs. Weren't Hemis dropping valves?
Can't get the amazing HP and Torque in a broad power band without huge displacement or VVT systems anyways.

Hemis like to eat cams, radiator support removes to allow beautiful access. Not super super common but not unheard of.

Had a newer Cummins get a timing cover gasket a couple weeks ago, cab pull.

 

[plainjaneFJC]

They've made a deal with Bosch to have dealers, parts, service and warranty all over the world.

My take is they probably have one of the most global parts/service network after the 70 series LC and old Defender.

They're also doing really cool stuff like officially allowing you to do your own oil changes and maintenance while still maintaining the warranty.

Servicing Your Grenadier

We’re developing a network to service and repair your Grenadier 4X4 – in all four corners of the world. Learn more about servicing your Grenadier.

ineosgrenadier.com

-Dan

You mean I can do my own oil change and maintain the warranty?…

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

You mean I can do my own oil change and maintain the warranty?…

The best route for engine replacement under warranty is dealer records. The dealer can tell the warranty center "we changed the oil and air filters at this many miles and on this date" and it is all cut and dry.

The farther you get away from that the harder it is to prove anything. Come in with a box of parts store receipts and the dealer has no clue when exactly the oil was changed or at what miles or if it was all just returned a half hour later.

Most independent shops will will keep records and the dealer will generally accept them. If you are going to have an independent shop change oil on something with a warranty confirm they keep records and are using the correct oil/filters OR better yet provide your own and make sure they note it on the ticket.

I always change my own oil. Heck I built my truck myself. Dealer is changing the oil in the Bronco until it is out of warranty tho.

And yet a Corvette that came with a 350 is worthless at auction with a pickup 350. You might be correct on the 250 CHEVY straight six..... but that was for a price point, not performance. On a budget a manufacturer will use whatever is in over supply in anything they want to move. In a heavy truck vs a sports car there is no myth, the engine internals are different even if the block castings start out the same.

Once you get past "numbers matching" thing there isn't really drastic differences between them mechanically. Cam, intake/carb and exhaust will change a lot on their own before you even think about playing with compression/heads.

Not like they are going to have super exotic stuff in a 1978 Corvette engine.

Basically just playing with intake/exhaust and cam/lifters got the Mustang 5.0 40hp over a F-150 5.0 (and 75hp over a Crown Vic 5.0 which unlike the truck also had a roller cam)... but the truck had a better intake that wouldn't fit under a car hood.

 

[Dan Grec]

You mean I can do my own oil change and maintain the warranty?…

Yes, they have VERY clearly said that is 100% correct.

-Dan

 

[nickw]

Comically one of the most desirable defenders has a BMW 6 cylinder

https://www.bmwblog.com/2021/09/01/lets-all-remember-the-bmw-powered-land-rover-defender/

and the Rover v8 was used in, uh... Everything.

The Coolest Cars Powered By The Legendary Rover V8

The Rover V8 is one of the most legendary engines in the automotive industry and has been used in several cars over the years.

www.hotcars.com

The chevy 250 straight six was in everything from bread trucks and pickups to camaro's and chevelles.

The myth of "car engine vs truck engine" is nonsense.

It's not a myth - there are car and truck engines, specifically designed as such....like some of the obscure 'big block's' like the Chevy 366, long stroke, heavy 4 ring pistons, etc.

Car engines are designed to a very aggressive price point and for fuel savings these days....those ones you list are basically overbuilt truck engines put into cars, which does not happen in today's world for a number of reasons.

The Dodge Ram 6.4 truck engine is different than the 6.4 in the cars.

Ford 7.3 is not put into cars.

Chevy 6.0 is trucks is very different than cars.

Some of the Chevy 350 V8's used for industrial applications had some tweaks vs the ones you saw in passenger vehicles.

I'm sure the manuf. that use the same engines across platforms test them to the most extreme use case (say using in heavier truck for testing). I think the Toyota V6 3.5L probably falls into this category, it's used in minivans, sedans and also the Tacoma.....but I am sure it passed durability tests associated with the Tacomas life cycle.

The BMW B58as far as I know was only used in lightweight passenger cars....doesn't mean it couldn't work well in the IG, but it's original design intent was never an offroad SUV or industrial type durability in mind. The biggest issue I see is it was never designed with maintenance in mind like you'd find on most rigs, even modern ones like domestic HD pickups / Toyotas let alone old school Rovers / Landcruisers.

The notorious example are the Mercedes Gwagon & sedans....they used the same diesel 4/6 cylinders. They were industrial engines WAY overbuilt for cars which is why the cars last 500k miles and are easy to rebuild. That concept of over-building and ease of maintenance of vehicles doesn't exist outside of the HD Truck market and some select SUV's like the Landcruiser/Patrols these days....IG has potential, but not from a engine perspective (IMO)

 

[nickw]

Hemis like to eat cams, radiator support removes to allow beautiful access. Not super super common but not unheard of.

Had a newer Cummins get a timing cover gasket a couple weeks ago, cab pull.

Cab pulls seems extreme but doesn't seem like it's that bad in practice - particularly for a shop that is set up and whom have a good workflow around it.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

Cab pulls seems extreme but doesn't seem like it's that bad in practice - particularly for a shop that is set up and whom have a good workflow around it.

They are kinda designed for it too.

 

[XJLI]

The 3.5 V6 in the Tacoma is a Camry motor but hundreds of thousands of people don’t seem to mind.

 

[zimm]

The 3.5 V6 in the Tacoma is a Camry motor but hundreds of thousands of people don’t seem to mind.

And an sr5 is 30g.

toyota also had 2 different 4.7 blocks. one for the sequoia plaform and one for the landcruiser. the trd supercharger was only supposed to be used on a landcruiser.