I believe technology has made a huge impact.....GPS, social media, google earth, etc. Many of the fairly remote places in the UP of Michigan that we have camped at have really increased in popularity over the last 30+ years. Especially in the last 5-10 yrs. Places you had to either find by exploring, learn about by word of mouth, etc. now are tweeted, instagrammed, geo-marked on google earth, pictures with coords attached, etc. So now people that may not normally put the effort in to seek out these places of solitude can easily find and go to them with some level of confidence. Unfortunately, some of these people believe there is a garbage pick-up service at these remote areas too!
Interesting how this forum and overlanding has changed over the years...
- Thread starter jays0n
- Start date
Doc Foster
Adventurer
Unfortunately America is changing with more people “enjoying “ the outdoors while more and more of them do Not respect the outdoors. America is also aging. I grew up in the Boy Scouts with cotton gear , tarp and no sleeping pad under my cotton Sears sleeping bag. I backpacked all over the USA for many years, graduated to sleeping in the back of my Jeep or truck, and now have a travel trailer with A/C, hot shower, comfortable Queen bed, refrigerator, TV, etc. BUT, I still use my 4x4 truck to get on those backroads to access remote trailheads. Often, my wife and I will rarely encounter anyone on the trails we select. You just have to be more selective on where you go. Even still, practicing Leave No Trace, I still come back with a bunch of trash left behind by others. Yes, camping/over landing has changed and we just have to adapt. Yeah, I use a GPS and digital camera, but I still ALWAYS carry a map and compass, first aid kit, etc.
WU7X
Snow on the Roof
Threads like this always amuse me. I'm 70 y.o. When I was born in 1948 the U.S. population was ~150 million and the world population was 2.5 billion. In 2017, the U.S. population was 325 million and the world is up to 7.76 BILLION. I just read a report that says in the period from roughly 1950 to the present the wild animal population on the planet has been cut in half. I don't begrudge anyone from enjoying the great, but diminishing out of doors as much as I have. I do begrudge humans for over populating the planet and destroying it in the process. Be gentle to one another folks. I doubt if it will get any better in your lifetimes.
Regcabguy
Oil eater.
San Diego's loaded with tricked out Tundras and Tacomas. RTT's,snorkels(10" of rain here.) I rarely see dirt or mud on them.
Now it's a few keystrokes away.
Same with surfing. Information used to flow around the campfire under the influence.
Now it's a few keystrokes away.
Regcabguy
Oil eater.
Responsible reproduction is the answer. Way too many folks now.
Todd780
OverCamper
That's okay. If there's no mud or dirt on them that means they aren't clogging up the back country.
And when the fad wears out maybe some deals to be had on kitted out low mileage never off roaded used trucks, lol...
Brianj5600
Member
Y'all sound like a bunch of little old ladies. Condemning littering, vandalism, not "treading lightly" are all things that should be addressed in the right way. Educating, not scolding or shaming, will have a better chance at changing behavior.
I was taught at a young age to leave an area better than you found it. I have passed it down to not only my kids, but friends over the years I introduced to camping.
Why do you care about people going to Rei or Overland Expos. That just opens up more places to camp.
I was taught at a young age to leave an area better than you found it. I have passed it down to not only my kids, but friends over the years I introduced to camping.
Why do you care about people going to Rei or Overland Expos. That just opens up more places to camp.
jacobconroy
Hillbilly of Leisure
While I agree that it would have been better to raise the people in question with a little more outdoor education (and general manners)...I imagine that these people are "grownups" now. A little late for responsible parenting.
Why do people accept education? Because they are scolded and shamed if they do not (and beaten in previous generations). People change their behavior when confronted with the possibility of loss (such as money, status, freedom) or pain (emotional or physical), otherwise they do pretty much whatever they want and have an amazing ability to rationalize any destructive or rude behavior that suits their needs for any given moment. If you want people to stop littering and otherwise behaving like teenagers at a woods party there has to be strictly enforced legal consequences and they will need to sting a bit.
But really, how on earth would you catch them? Perhaps some Gov't agents that record license plates in camping grounds on Friday, Saturdays, and Sundays would do the trick? If there is a mess at those campgrounds the next day...ticket the vehicle owner up the wazoo. Works for speed cameras. The law doesn't care about who's driving.
Do we now need a "Trail Nanny" to roam the FS roads and politely educate those with poor manners and a penchant for littering? Who is going to do that job? You? Good luck. Have you ever tried to correct a millennial about anything?
And yes, there are too many people. Way to many. No solution for that either unless we "educate" the little ones to stop pooping out children when they grow up.
Dances with Wolves
aka jk240sx
Quoted for truth.
I remember my first trip to Moab. Not for off roading but to mountain bike Slickrock. That was '92. Moab was nothing then. I flew into SLC, my brother lived in Magna at the time. SLC was a bunch of small towns connected by fields then. We spent 2 weeks driving towards Moab down 189 through Escalante and Canyonlands. We didn't see anyone except for locals. Fast forward to 2007 when I moved here from Florida. Drove up and through Moab. Town is built up and trucks & bikes everywhere! It was still cool but the wave was growing. Fast fast forward to 2016. Went down for Jeep Easter fest. Ugh! Idiots everywhere. I won't go again. Trash & ********************. The internet has ruined the outdoors and I only see it getting worse in the near future. More people & trails closures are happening everywhere. I hope the fad passes and it will get back to people who really enjoy being there and have respect for the land. Tread Lightly.
pside
New member
This is a great thread, I know it shows that i'm a new member but I'm actually a returning member that joined originally in 2014. I remember in 2015 a guy complementing me on my truck at a gas station outside of Death Valley and he added "and you actually use it" I kept thinking what the hell does that mean? Then I started seeing swarms of perfectly detailed vehicles with light bars, mud tires and swing out tire carriers and figured out what he meant. I fortunately own a vehicle with limited aftermarket support, that combined with common sense and gasps when I see the price tags of some of these "overlanding" products keeps me on the DIY path for the majority of my truck. Fortunately there are still members here that back in 2014 impressed upon me its about using your vehicle and enjoying the solitude we find in remote areas we travel to more than its about the coolest setup.
pside
New member
You forgot about stopping for their oat milk lattes and acai bowls.
Dances with Wolves
aka jk240sx
“Thank God men cannot fly, and lay waste the sky as well as the earth.” Henry David Thoreau
Trikebubble
Adventurer
So now "we" are crapping on folks who are actually out there full time, doing this "overland" thing for reals? I don't know this couple (though I've taken interest in their new build as I have a Tundra and Hawk combo as well), but by all accounts they've put down over 80000 miles, traveling over 1000 days in 3 different trucks. So who gives a crap if they an Instagram account and post pictures of their travels on it. I do the same while I'm traveling and out exploring and stuff. Maybe one day we will be blessed enough to travel to wherever you may go to breathe that rarified air and look down on all the regular traveling folks.
You want to know what's wrong with this whole "overland:" thing? Folks sitting on their high horses, balancing their laptop and spouting better than thou attitude all over forums like this.
Peace out.