International 3800 adventure bus build

[Srpat]

Exciting start for your build. Some obvious weak points are size and budget. Very long, so turning around is a no-go on even the biggest forest roads. Not a problem, but certainly something that will take more planning when choosing a route. Lots of options for budgets to work in, as long as things go okay. If you are already talking about swapping a transmission, and you feel comfortable with that kind of work (I don't), then maybe you can come up with a realistic budget you can stay close to.

I like the idea of chopping off the first stair. The RV stairs are nice that fold out when the door opens. That definitely gets you some ground clearance and gets rid of a major hangup. That was a lot of work to raise it a foot, and a lot of work left, but I'm sure necessary if you have anybody over 5'10" or so. Lots of options for interior with something that big.

We are a family of 4 and have been converting a much smaller shuttle bus, about a 5 window-sized, for the last year. It has been a massive amount of work. Just about every thing we have done to it required something to figure out and plan for, and buy new tools for, and...etc.

Make sure you plan out your layout for big things like water tanks, gray water tanks, and maybe an extra gas tank? I have no idea what the gas tank is on yours, but my bus has 66 gallons at about 11ish mpg and I am very happy with the range that lets me have. We have 2 fresh water tanks at 20 and 25 gallons. It's enough, but more would certainly be better. I would be thinking with a family of 9, that you want something north of 100 gallons of water for 4 or 5 days, with some showers mixed in.

Our shuttle bus had a lot of room underneath the frame for storage compartments and water tanks. We are making use of a lot of it. Adventure bus for us meant the ability to go to remote camp spots, decent trail riding (when we fit), and the ability to carry with us bikes, inflatable boats, and backpacking gear.

 

[Srpat]

Forgot to say. You are right that your build is going to take years. Figure out a plan of what you need to do to start using it in the spring. Nobody wants to do work twice, but a project that big needs to be usable in a partially done state. Windows, paint to make it legal, and a few 2x4 countertops and bunk beds. My kids, 5 and 8 absolutely LOVE riding down the road in a bus. The memories are already starting for us.

 

[AdventureBus]

Thanks Srpat, it sounds like we are on the same paths with our builds. My kids got to ride on our bus once when I first got it home and they loved it too.

I’m going to follow your advice and build some temporary furniture and tables/countertops to get us moving. I don’t like doing things twice, but I can tell myself the temporary stuff is just practice

Our bus has something around a 66 gallon fuel tank that I am going to relocate rearward for better weight distribution and am considering adding another tank just like it on the other side.

I plan on adding (2) 100ish gallon water tanks behind the rear axle. I hope to avoid a black tank altogether and just have one or two large grey tanks. Probably going to install a Nature’s Head toilet.

We like to hike, mountain bike, canoe/kayak, and camp. The bus will be a base camp and we will likely tow our Nissan NV3500 passenger van for getting around places where the bus won’t fit.

Some may wonder why we don’t just use the NV for all if our travels. It has taken us to Florida, Colorado, Utah, and everywhere in-between. It has been very reliable, but we are only able to remove half the back row for camp stuff and it is packed like a sardine can and really cramped. Needless to say, it isn’t that comfortable on long trips. I have considered converting it to 4x4, which would be totally awesome, but it would cost as much as I anticipate the bus costing once it is moderately outfitted, and it wouldn’t be nearly as cool or as capable. I’d really like an EarthRoamer or huge ex-military rig as a platform to work from but the bus fits our budget better and just makes more sense.


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[Fatboyz]

I’m going to follow your advice and build some temporary furniture and tables/countertops to get us moving. I don’t like doing things twice, but I can tell myself the temporary stuff is just practice

We had temporary table dinette etc, and it actually really paid off as we completely changed what we wanted/needed based on our trials with folding chairs/temporary table etc. We actually got one season of use with the temporary before getting to the final permanent stuff. It was worth it!

 

[shortbus4x4]

Two hundred gallons of water behind the rear axle? That's 1600 pounds plus what ever the tanks weigh. I don't think you will like how your bus handles after that. I would try very hard to get them ahead of the rear axle.

 

[AdventureBus]

Here’s my thinking with the water tank placement:

The rear axle is rated for 17,500 lbs and the front is rated for 10,000. When I took it to the scales, the rear weighed 7,460 and the front weighed 7,260. If I place 1600 lbs with a central moment 8’ behind the rear axle, and the wheelbase is 20’, it will remove 640 lbs from the front axle. That would leave me with 6,620 on the front and 9,700 on the rear which is closer to being distributed proportionately to the axle ratings. The rest of the weight from the build will go between the front and rear axles, continuing the proportional distribution.

I will be weighing the bus several times throughout the build and planning battery and fuel tank placement accordingly. It will get a full air-ride suspension once the build is finished which will allow perfect spring rates for my desired ride height.

Also, the bus had seating for (14) 200 lb adults behind the rear axle originally. That’s 2,800 lbs, so I don’t think the water tanks will be an issue as far as frame strength goes.

I don’t want to get the front end too light, but I know one thing for sure, it is difficult to steer right now. I can tell it is a little bit nose heavy. I’m open to suggestions. I really want to balance the rig as best that I can. I’m also being mindful about keeping heavy things as low as I can without compromising ground clearance. The rooftop deck will be built as lightly as I can using light gauge steel and cedar wood as I have no way of welding aluminum.


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[shortbus4x4]

Carry on. You've done your homework and weighed it. Just keep doing your build with that attention to weight placement and you'll be fine.

 

[Pntyrmvr]

Well it won't be any fun to ride over railroad tracks in the back row of his bus...

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[Srpat]

Are you planning on keeping all of those windows? Good time to cover some of them up if you wanted. Floor plan sketches yet? I would be thinking bunk beds 3 high in a hallway in the middle, with some kind of master suite at the back. Or maybe a double dinette with some kind of bed conversion? On floor under seats, on the seats, and a fold down bed above?

Not sure the ages of your kids, but maybe you don't need a permanent bed for all of them. How soon before some of them want their own tent to sleep in? We have a full sized bed and a bunk bed for the 4 of us. Inflatable mattress across the front seats for a 4th bed. We bring cousins and we get out a tent. The older cousins like being on their own. Makes it a more comfortable build with fewer beds.

 

[AdventureBus]

I’m deleting (4) windows total, two on the passenger side for the wet-bath, and two on the driver’s side for the refrigerator and pantry. I ordered 26ga M-panel roofing metal yesterday that I will laminate together for covering the windows. It will be a little over 20ga in thickness after lamination a the 3/4” ribs will add strength and prevent oil-canning.

There won’t be any bunk beds, but rather a convertible couch and dinette for kid’s sleeping areas. I’m going to attempt a 2-passenger forward-facing bench with fold-down footrest at the passenger’s front side near the stairwell. This bench can also sleep one person. That leaves a need for two more beds which may mean the oldest two boys using a tent or possibly some removable/stow-able overhead cots to go above the couch and dinette. Or someone can just sleep on the floor. The back of the bus will have a queen-sized bed and I’m thinking about making it be able to convert into opposing 2-seat couches or a 6-person “U-shaped” couch.

My goal is to make the bus as modular and convertible as possible. I like options and understand that our needs will change as the kids grow up. I like the idea of bunk beds, but I can’t fit them into our plan and don’t want to dedicate that much space to an area for sleep only. Attached is a sketch of the proposed floor plan and a crude computer rendering of the exterior plan for the bus.

 

[Madoxen]

Did you consider putting some mounting points at an angle east to west for hammocs to be hung up . They take up no room are very comfortable and pack down into next to nothing . Might help add a few beds when needed.

 

[AdventureBus]

Did you consider putting some mounting points at an angle east to west for hammocs to be hung up . They take up no room are very comfortable and pack down into next to nothing . Might help add a few beds when needed.

That is a great idea! I like that better than trying to stow a cot-like contraption. Hammocks are versatile as well which fits my theme of space saving efforts and practicality. Thanks for the tip!


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[Srpat]

Nice drawing.

My opinion, that is still a lot of windows left. Colder and missed opportunity for floor to ceiling pantry storage. Hammock idea is fantastic. I like building it with the idea that it does not need to sleep your entire family. Kids on the floor or in a tent keeps lots of options open for where to put them at night. It's amazing how little space there is once you put in the basic things that you need -- beds, dinette, bath. The design really builds itself after you place the biggest things.

My full size bed is at the back of the bus as well. I have it hinged on the back wall to lift up to access the storage underneath. You can also open the back door, but it gives you another option. I'm not sure I would want the hassle of converting your Big U shaped couch to a bed. Maybe you can do it easily, but you are giving up storage for large items under the bed and it's one more thing to set up. I would just make it a comfortable bed with lots of pillows to lounge on in the day.

The forward facing seat is a must in your design. It sucks being the lone driver with nobody to talk to or help navigate. My shuttle bus is based on a truck F550. It had the holes for a passenger door, but the door itself was deleted for the main entrance door. I cut things up a bit and sourced a passenger seat. Very happy I did that. The adults sit up front when driving and between the distance and noise, the kids get to do whatever they want and not be heard much by me.

I've never really looked at a school bus. Is there anything for storage underneath the bus? As big as you are, I bet you are not going to be able to get enough storage space.

 

[AdventureBus]

My wife likes the idea of making the back a permanent bed with storage underneath as opposed to the U-shaped couch. I'm okay with leaving it as a bed as long as people can still ride on it comfortably, not sure why they couldn't I guess. Especially if it is memory-foam or something that isn't too bouncy.

I really don't know how much storage space we are going to need. I already bought metal to blank the (4) windows, so I would have to re-order if I were going to cover more of them. I really like the windows and didn't want to give up any of them, but it only makes sense to me to at least blank the four that I am. Hopefully, between the under-counter, under-seat, and under-bed storage I will have enough. We should really practice paring down our supplies to make sure it all fits, but we have traditionally brought more than we need when camping.

There is not any storage under the bus currently but there is room to weld in some underbody storage boxes for the things that you wouldn't necessarily want to pack inside the bus. These are all issues that will work themselves out as we begin to use the bus I reckon. I can already imagine a tool bag, portable welder, air tools, water hose, extension cords, etc. that I will want to put under there.

As far as the windows making the bus colder, I have a plan for most of that. I am going to build 1" rigid foam panels laminated with something thin and rigid that slide into tracks in the walls. They will be lifted out of the wall and placed over the windows with strong magnets or velcro or something when you want a window covered. It would work similarly to some of the insulated curtains I have seen, only they will provide more insulation value. Even when they are stored inside the walls, they will add to the R-value of the lower walls. I will probably do this to all of the passenger windows as well as the ones at the back corners of the bus.

I appreciate your feedback about the front bench idea. I know I will enjoy driving long distances better with a co-pilot. I may even try to re-purpose some seats out of a mini-van or something like that since they would recline, have armrests, and may even have the flip-out footrest already built-in. Time will tell, but I'm pretty excited about that part of the build. The stairwell is such a waste of space if I can't find a way to bridge it when not in use for entry and exit.

 

[baipin]

How far off-pavement are you planning on taking this bus? Have you considered a rear diff locker if you aren't doing a 4x4 conversion? They can be had for relatively cheap from the junkyard; from dump trucks and such. Reading about off-pavement builds on other forums, it sounds like a locker + Michelin XDE or XDY + 24k-30k lb hydraulic winch + snatch block would get you through plenty of muddy BLM roads and the like...