Lightweight Cabinet Materials - Plywood/Coosa Alternatives

[Littleredridinghood]

I have been experimenting with a lot of lightweight alternative sheet goods for cabinet construction. The problem with all of them is the density to retain screws and other hardware. Think about screws that need to hold drawer guides in place. Yes, you could use rivnuts but that requires extra precision , cost and detailed planing. If you need to adjust your design during the build, it can become a headache to use anything else than wood screws.

On a side note: Baltic birch is VERY hard to get after the issues with Russia started. The "new" baltic birch plywood is coming from China now. I went through a bunch of sheets lately and actually find it better in quality! They also come in 4x8 and 5x5 (impossible to handle)

You're right about that! There's a lot of other factors with the various types of hardware to consider as well. Do you have any experience with the lightweight Poplar ply that was mentioned above? https://www.garnica.one/en-us/plywood-boards/range/efficiency/efficiency-poplar.html
It seems very intriguing.

 

[1000arms]

I'm definitely the most comfortable working with plywood for building cabinets. So it will certainly save me time. Birch ply might be the way to go!

Some Baltic Birch uses "interior glue". Some uses "exterior glue". Some places would order the Baltic Birch, with the glue the customer wanted, before Baltic Birch recently became hard to get.

I haven't yet researched the glue(s) used in "Baltic Birch" from China that other posters have mentioned.

 

[Victorian]

Some Baltic Birch uses "interior glue". Some uses "exterior glue". Some places would order the Baltic Birch, with the glue the customer wanted, before Baltic Birch recently became hard to get.

I haven't yet researched the glue(s) used in "Baltic Birch" from China that other posters have mentioned.

I wouldn’t worry too much about the glues used in plywood. You would get more toxins through your finishes, flooring and upholstery.
Many moons ago I was heavily involved in the green building movement that analyzed pretty much everything considered “green” in building materials. We found that even though 99% of all plywood was manufactured with “ no formaldehyde” added glue, the actual wood still emitted it’s naturally accruing Formaldehyde In way higher concentration than what any of the other “toxic” glues emitted. Without mentioning a brand name, the US market leader is still advertising its plywood without added formaldehyde. Looking closer into it it’s almost false advertising…. They are getting the core plywood from China and only applying different types of veneers with a water based glue. It’s very hard as a consumer to know who to believe and trust.

 

[Ozarker]

Duraplast sign board material, light, tough stuff, they use it for outdoor signs, available in 4 x 8 sheets or small sizes for yard signs, cheap!

Glue it and screw it or just glue it. Takes paint well.

You could build a camper out of this stuff.

 

[1000arms]

Some Baltic Birch uses "interior glue". Some uses "exterior glue". Some places would order the Baltic Birch, with the glue the customer wanted, before Baltic Birch recently became hard to get.

I haven't yet researched the glue(s) used in "Baltic Birch" from China that other posters have mentioned.

I wouldn’t worry too much about the glues used in plywood. You would get more toxins through your finishes, flooring and upholstery. ...

I was thinking about camper construction and longevity.

Regarding the off-gassing, I hope anyone planning a camper designs the camper with lots of airflow to remove moisture from breathing, cooking, cleaning, drying clothes, as well as fumes from cooking, waste elimination, and off-gassing of materials.

 

[karlfunk]

Duraplast sign board material, light, tough stuff, they use it for outdoor signs, available in 4 x 8 sheets or small sizes for yard signs, cheap!

Glue it and screw it or just glue it. Takes paint well.

You could build a camper out of this stuff.

We are building a trailer at the moment to tow behind our Subaru Outback - so need to keep it as light as possible.

Because we have framed the interior structures with 8020-type extrusions (in the smallest 20mm profile) we ended up having sign material as an option. The edges are tricky to solve for finishing details. We did not really want to route out all the panel edges and glue in wood strips that could then be routed for a nice finish. With the aluminum extrusions the 6mm (actually 5.5mm) panels we are using just slot in the channels. No need for an edge detail.

We used Alumalite Standard panels:

Alumalite® Standard - Laminators Inc.

Laminators Inc.'s Alumalite® Standard is a strong, durable panel with a high-density corrugated polypropylene core. Click to learn more!

www.laminatorsinc.com

The 4x8 panel in 6mm weighs 22lb.

It was available at several local sign shops in big sheets. We ended up finding two panels (one at 4x8 and one at 4x10) that were "damaged" and paid $220 total. It can easily be cut with a table saw and drop saw. Hole saws work well. A deburr or file knocks down any edges that may be exposed. It also seems to take an M5 fastener pretty well (let's see how that holds up once we start towing, but only using for non-structural applications).

Just another low-cost light-weight option.

- Karl

 

[rruff]

I was starting to wonder how much I would actually save in time/money/weight by going with one of these less common but lightweight materials.

If stiffness and strength are included, they are not "lightweight" compared to ply... unless you use sandwich panels... which will need special care in fabrication. See if Carbon Core has the PP core panels available. You'll be able to use them in some applications without too much trouble.

The main advantage of the ply substitutes for marine use is the ability to not be affected by water saturation. The interior of a camper should be dry enough to make that a non-issue.

 

[rruff]

Duraplast sign board material, light, tough stuff, they use it for outdoor signs, available in 4 x 8 sheets or small sizes for yard signs, cheap!

Glue it and screw it or just glue it. Takes paint well.

You could build a camper out of this stuff.

Plastics are weak, flexible, creep, and change dimensions a lot when temperature changes.

I've made composite panels (hand layup) using foamed PVC signboard as a core. Fiberglass works well and takes care of all the issues above, but it's not all that stiff either. Carbon is very stiff, but takes impact less well than fiberglass.

 

[Ozarker]

Plastics are weak, flexible, creep, and change dimensions a lot when temperature changes.

I've made composite panels (hand layup) using foamed PVC signboard as a core. Fiberglass works well and takes care of all the issues above, but it's not all that stiff either. Carbon is very stiff, but takes impact less well than fiberglass.

as "plastics" go, that may be, but I believe the sign boards have PVC, I have 2 4x8 sheets and some smaller pieces and mounted to a wood frame I've not found those issues with it.

A place here uses a 4x8 sheet in a metal frame, I know it's been there for just over 9 years now and it looks the same as it did when it was put up. I would have thought that the UV would have turned the white board into dingy tan by now, but it has held up well and kept the white color, it faces to the West.

There's a guy on Youtube that made cabinets out of insulation board, blue board, then covered with glue and cloth, poor man's fiberglass, after paint they looked pretty good, but can't tell from the video.

I believe on TT&T a guy built a teardrop out of the duraplast and covered it in vinal, looked good. I've found that this stuff is pretty tuff, but framing should be about 12 inches, much closer than 16/18/24 inches on wall construction. For a camper I don't know if the additional framing would exceed the weight savings from foam core but the price would be much less.

Same with a cabinet, depending what goes in it, framing at 12 inches would be fine for most stuff, clothes, shoes/boots/ food and light cooking ware, but I don't think it would work well holding a few cases of full cases of beer.

If I ever put a bathroom in the front of my cargo trailer that D-P will make a good interior wall and shower enclosure, it would just be a screen.

Don't know what you have in mind for cabinets, I thought about cabinets and trying to save weight, what ever they are usually made is too heavy for my needs. Which made me decide to go with wire shelves that are in my walk-in closet, then use bags.

I don't know the brand of off road trailer, but I noticed a bag system was used on the walls instead of cabinets or cubby holes and that trailer was one of the expensive ones.

Bags don't weigh hardly anything, can hold a lot and carry weight, when not in use they save space, unlike box cabinets.

Post up your solution for cabinets.

 

[rruff]

Absolutely, you can build out of just about anything, but the specs and reality of plastics make it a poor structural material. If you have 12" framing, then that is your main structure; the plastic panel is mostly filling the gaps.

I'm mostly using wood interior; ply is only for the top of the "couch" and the table. Plus plastic drawers and crates; they are light and cheap for that.

I haven't gotten around to making them yet, but my plan for external storage boxes is PVC foamboard core with fiberglass. You can buy similar panels with aluminum skins.

If you want a panel with good strength and stiffness and light weight, it would be hard to beat this... 4x8 sheets are $150 (6mm) to $300 (50mm). When I ordered foam from them, there was a $350 flat shipping charge unless you ordered >$3k worth and then it was free. Bonding would be the best way to join them; aluminum angle would be easy for square edges.

Composite Panels - Sheets - Carbon-Core Corporation

SANDED: ADD $ 0.45 per square foot per side GELCOAT: Fiberglass panels have a T102 pigment mixed in the skins. For regular Gelcoat add $.43 per SqFt. per side, for both sides $.86 SqFt. 40 gelcoat colors available, consult your sales representative for details. OTHER THICKNESSES (UP TO 18″) ARE...

www.carbon-core.com

 

[danneskjold]

Has anyone looked at using Dibond/Epanel/aluminum composite material panels? Pretty lightweight (30lbs for a 3mm 4x8 sheet), strong, synethic, etc.

 

[rruff]

I've never played with one, but being pretty thin with a plastic core and only .008" face sheets, I don't think they'd be that stiff.

 

[danneskjold]

I've never played with one, but being pretty thin with a plastic core and only .008" face sheets, I don't think they'd be that stiff.

I only have some small sample pieces in front of me but I think they would be plenty strong to make cabinet and drawer faces out of. I don't think I would put up an entire 4x8 sheet without a thicker backer, but for what they are they seem pretty strong.

 

[ITTOG]

Size definitely matters... when dealing with ACM. If it is less than 2' x 4' you could probably make some cabinets that are pretty strong as long there is at least one cross brace near the middle. Otherwise it would have to be pretty small pieces.

 

[danneskjold]

Size definitely matters... when dealing with ACM. If it is less than 2' x 4' you could probably make some cabinets that are pretty strong as long there is at least one cross brace near the middle. Otherwise it would have to be pretty small pieces.

2x4 is a big cabinet!