Maxtrax vs TRED vs Tracmats vs X-Trax vs X-Jack

[texascrane]

If you look at my previous posts you'll see I don't use Maxtrax so I am just wondering about all of the discontent polluting this good thread..

This is going to be a bit of a long post. FWIW, I simply read a few of these posts and just thought they came across like a bit of a **************. It's probably not enough to keep me from doing business with them, but it might be enough to push me another direction if I'm looking at two relatively equivalent products.

We're made from fiber-reinforced engineering-grade nylon that's designed to be able to wrap completely around a tire without breaking. TREDs are made from the same thing as milk bottles.

View attachment 308965

That strikes me as a bit of a juvenile dig at tred and hdpe (I'm not even 100% sure that's what they're made from anyways), but whatever. You could just as easily refer to maxtrax as being made out of the same stuff as cheap knife handles (glass filled nylon).

From this thread on some traction mats being sold at Costco.
http://www.expeditionportal.com/for...mergency-Traction-Track?p=1942206#post1942206

Sigh...

So somebody posts asking about some inexpensive traction aids they saw at costco, somebody else responds that they had a positive experience with the product, and maxtrax comes back with a post that's pure snark. Obviously a $20 product is different than a $300 product. A) Do you really need to be jumping in threads about (more or less) competitive products? And B) if you're going to do so, why don't you offer something that's substantive rather than acting like you can't believe how anybody could ever possibly believe that something other than your awesome product is worth their money?

Of course they got immediately called out on it and followed up with an actual substantive post. But why not just do that in the first place if you're so inclined to get involved? This is a discussion board and "sigh..." doesn't add much to the discussion. Don't act like a 15 year old that just got asked to take out the trash.

And from this thread about Crux Offroad bridging ladders (posted by expo staff): http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/144360-Crux-Offroad-bridging-ladder-saves-big-rig

We get a post consisting of 4 progressively zoomed in photos showing maxtrax being used in the recovery:



Again, this is a post that is about a completely different product and company. Maxtrax were used in the recovery? No kidding, it was mentioned very specifically in the article that a bunch of maxtrax were pulled out, but they didn't have enough to get the job done, which is the whole point of why the crux offroad ladders were brought in (to do something they weren't ever designed for). There's no substance to the post. It just looks like a "big guy" shoving his way into the middle of a thread providing some positive coverage for a small vendor.

The bottom line is that while it's not like maxtrax is running around pulling some of the stuff that certain folks around here are known for, these posts aren't exactly examples of professional behavior, IMO. There are plenty of vendors on here who are competitors with each other but manage to not shoehorn their way into each others' threads, treat each other with respect in their posts, and just generally come across as professionals, rather teenagers given access to the company's social media accounts.

It's one thing to be a bit snarky or combative when you just represent yourself (I've certainly done my fair share of that) but it's another thing when you're posting a representative of a company. Even the "apology" in this thread, was a non-apology. If you say "I'm sorry you were offended" and then justify your behavior in the next sentence, why even bother?

 

[carbon60]

Again, this is a post that is about a completely different product and company. Maxtrax were used in the recovery? No kidding, it was mentioned very specifically in the article that a bunch of maxtrax were pulled out, but they didn't have enough to get the job done, which is the whole point of why the crux offroad ladders were brought in (to do something they weren't ever designed for). There's no substance to the post. It just looks like a "big guy" shoving his way into the middle of a thread providing some positive coverage for a small vendor.

The bottom line is that while it's not like maxtrax is running around pulling some of the stuff that certain folks around here are known for, these posts aren't exactly examples of professional behavior, IMO. There are plenty of vendors on here who are competitors with each other but manage to not shoehorn their way into each others' threads, treat each other with respect in their posts, and just generally come across as professionals, rather teenagers given access to the company's social media accounts.

It's one thing to be a bit snarky or combative when you just represent yourself (I've certainly done my fair share of that) but it's another thing when you're posting a representative of a company. Even the "apology" in this thread, was a non-apology. If you say "I'm sorry you were offended" and then justify your behavior in the next sentence, why even bother?

Very well explained and written, kudos. I'm of the same opinion.

 

[fireball]

Texas - well said. We can all choose where to spend our hard earned money. If this is how they want to act on a forum, I'm going to spend my dollars elsewhere. I like buying good gear, but I like giving my money to companies or individuals whom I like. Call me crazy!

For me, I think the Maxtrax is likely a better product than the TRED, but I cannot justify the cost difference. And after reading this thread, I would choose not to support Maxtraxx given that he comes off as a bit of a twat.

 

[Box Rocket]

I won't tell anyone how they should spend their money so whether or not you choose one company's product is your choice for whatever your reasons might be. "Professional" behavior is a bit subjective. I can understand how some of the comments being complained about could be interpreted as being a bit flippant. Poor choice of response from the vendor? Probably. But the same could be said of the jabs taken back at Maxtrax being called a "twat" etc. Seems a bit of the pot calling the kettle black perhaps. Regardless, I'm in favor of respectful interactions between vendors as well as forum members even though I know I've been guilty of the same mistake at times. Live and learn I guess.
.
Back on the topic, yes the Maxtrax cost more than some of the other competitive products. But like I said in an earlier post, I am not going to shoot myself in the foot by not using a superior product for my own recovery just because I may not like an individual associated with it. With a piece of equipment like this, I want it to work, work effectively and not fail when I need it. From my experience, other brands do not work as well, are more prone to failure and are not as well designed. So while you may spend less for another brand, you'll have areas with that product that will fall short of what you might need from it. Are those risks and drawbacks worth the cost savings or the "principle" of "I won't buy product X because I don't like their forum posts"? That's all a personal decision of what you're worth giving up.
.
Just one guys view on it. Having used a few different types, I've always been impressed more by the effectiveness of the Maxtrax and they've proven their value. There is a reason they cost more than competitive products. They work better and are made better.

 

[teotwaki]

It is way too long and exceedingly off topic but I will parse it out and add my responses, especially with the excessive rant about an unrelated thread that points to Jonathan Hanson's article in Exploring Overland, not Expo.

I simply read a few of these posts and just thought they came across like a bit of a **************.

I thought the claims were about numerous offensive posts all over the forum and that he was unprofessional? Now it is a "few posts" and copiously calling names as a means of calling out MaxTrax?

That strikes me as a bit of a juvenile dig at tred and hdpe (I'm not even 100% sure that's what they're made from anyways), but whatever. You could just as easily refer to maxtrax as being made out of the same stuff as cheap knife handles (glass filled nylon).

Treds are made of HDPE and so are milk bottles. So a more "professional" attack might have been to pose a question

Which material should be trusted for recovering your truck? HDPE or engineering grade reinforced nylon?

OR

"Pure snark" is evident in these statements too.....

So somebody posts asking about some inexpensive traction aids they saw at costco, somebody else responds that they had a positive experience with the product, and maxtrax comes back with a post that's pure snark. Obviously a $20 product is different than a $300 product. A) Do you really need to be jumping in threads about (more or less) competitive products? And B) if you're going to do so, why don't you offer something that's substantive rather than acting like you can't believe how anybody could ever possibly believe that something other than your awesome product is worth their money?

Starts out with constructive criticism but descends into snark. Why descend into name calling and griping when castigating someone for being unprofessional?

Of course they got immediately called out on it and followed up with an actual substantive post. But why not just do that in the first place if you're so inclined to get involved? This is a discussion board and "sigh..." doesn't add much to the discussion. Don't act like a 15 year old that just got asked to take out the trash.

Now this next rant is just plain wrong, grossly misleading and purely a biased attack on MaxTrax and I will point out why.

And from this thread about Crux Offroad bridging ladders (posted by expo staff): http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/144360-Crux-Offroad-bridging-ladder-saves-big-rig

We get a post consisting of 4 progressively zoomed in photos showing maxtrax being used in the recovery:

Again, this is a post that is about a completely different product and company. Maxtrax were used in the recovery? No kidding, it was mentioned very specifically in the article that a bunch of maxtrax were pulled out, but they didn't have enough to get the job done, which is the whole point of why the crux offroad ladders were brought in (to do something they weren't ever designed for). There's no substance to the post. It just looks like a "big guy" shoving his way into the middle of a thread providing some positive coverage for a small vendor.

The bottom line is that while it's not like maxtrax is running around pulling some of the stuff that certain folks around here are known for, these posts aren't exactly examples of professional behavior, IMO. There are plenty of vendors on here who are competitors with each other but manage to not shoehorn their way into each others' threads, treat each other with respect in their posts, and just generally come across as professionals, rather teenagers given access to the company's social media accounts.

It's one thing to be a bit snarky or combative when you just represent yourself (I've certainly done my fair share of that) but it's another thing when you're posting a representative of a company. Even the "apology" in this thread, was a non-apology. If you say "I'm sorry you were offended" and then justify your behavior in the next sentence, why even bother?

First, go actually read the thread in the link that you provided. Haven searches out useful articles in other venues and posts info and links to them. Haven even pimps the website link for Crux. This thread is not an official "expo staff" test or anything of the sort that was only about Crux. That claim is pure hogwash.

Second, "Jeremy P./Adventurer" who is not listed as an official Expo sponsor gets in and pimps his products yet he is not slammed by TexasCrane as guilty of being "...shoving his way into the middle of a thread".

Third, the progressively zoomed photos posted by Maxtrax were based on the one photo in the original article. They illustrate that the Crux ladders were not all that were under the tires but they did provide the additional traction that allowed the recovery. What the article actually stated was this: "A bunch of MaxTrax appeared (as they always seem to do in these situations), but not quite enough to fully float all the tires necessary on an 18-wheeler". The pictures clearly show that both the MaxTrax and the Crux ladders were needed and that the Crux and MaxTrax were severely overloaded too.

Fourth, in that entire thread of Haven's consisting of only 7 posts total there was this statement from the author of the article that Haven cited:

The MaxTrax worked great as well in that situation; they were able to deform under the weight of the semi and then regain shape.

This discussion that we are in is a thread about comparing recovery aids for use in sand. Did you read the first post before going emotionally nuclear?
"Maxtrax vs TRED vs Tracmats vs X-Trax vs X-Jack? Which one is the best? Looking for mainly sand use and light to mild recovery. Thoughts on each and pros and cons?"

The real bottom line is that you and the other MaxTrax haters need to stop crapping in this technical thread. If you hate MaxTrax so much go start your own "I want to rant against MaxTrax" thread in the Fireside Chat area. You seem to have a vendetta against just one company yet offer no actual recovery examples of the Treds that you recently bought and have never used. Yes it is a discussion board but you to be considerate of the community here and stay on topic.

 

[texascrane]

Wow. Somehow I went from:

Also, to be completely honest, I've been a little bit turned off by the "attitude" that maxtrax has displayed when posting here.

FWIW, I simply read a few of these posts and just thought they came across like a bit of a **************. It's probably not enough to keep me from doing business with them

to a Maxtrax "hater".

I thought the claims were about numerous offensive posts all over the forum and that he was unprofessional? Now it is a "few posts" and copiously calling names as a means of calling out MaxTrax?

I don't know where you got that from, but you're welcome to go back and re-read my previous posts.

Treds are made of HDPE and so are milk bottles.

And so are the Scepter fuel/water cans that everybody loves. Stating that something is made from the same stuff as milk bottles as a way to imply that it's cheap and or not suited for use as a traction aid, doesn't actually mean that it's either of those things. I would expect a vendor that's attacking a competitor for using HDPE, to explain why it's not suited to the task.

Second, "Jeremy P./Adventurer" who is not listed as an official Expo sponsor gets in and pimps his products yet he is not slammed by TexasCrane as guilty of being "...shoving his way into the middle of a thread".

This discussion isn't about Jeremy P.

This discussion that we are in is a thread about comparing recovery aids for use in sand. Did you read the first post before going emotionally nuclear?
"Maxtrax vs TRED vs Tracmats vs X-Trax vs X-Jack? Which one is the best? Looking for mainly sand use and light to mild recovery. Thoughts on each and pros and cons?"

The real bottom line is that you and the other MaxTrax haters need to stop crapping in this technical thread. If you hate MaxTrax so much go start your own "I want to rant against MaxTrax" thread in the Fireside Chat area. You seem to have a vendetta against just one company yet offer no actual recovery examples of the Treds that you recently bought and have never used. Yes it is a discussion board but you to be considerate of the community here and stay on topic.

I think somebody has gone emotionally nuclear here. I'm not sure that it's me, but YMMV. That said, I have used my TREDs once as I previously stated in this thread. The recovery was quick, uneventful, and they worked as advertised. All of the reports of failures that I've seen have been about cracking (especially in colder attempts). None of the failures seem to have rendered the TREDs non-functional for the immediate task at hand. I don't spend much time in cold weather, so it's not something that I'm particularly concerned with. If I break them, I'll either warranty them or maybe buy some maxtrax.:friday:

 

[Box Rocket]

Drop the interweb flexing attitude and let's just keep the topic "on topic". If you don't like the attitude from Maxtrax (or anyone else), fine, ignore it and don't buy their product.

 

[fireball]

Box -
Haven is posting well articulated, thought out responses. How is that Internet web flexing???

 

[Box Rocket]

The point is none of that has been relevant to the topic of the thread. The thread is for comparing the different products not for debating how someone on the internet made you cry, regardless of how thoughtfully you word your reason for being upset.

 

[landsharkman]

I agree, everybody here can write a post that may feel insensitive to someone, but none of this has anything to do with evaluating the best product available. When I need something as important as the device that will get me unstuck from a bad situation I can not imagine not buying the best option I can afford.

The point is none of that has been relevant to the topic of the thread. The thread is for comparing the different products not for debating how someone on the internet made you cry, regardless of how thoughtfully you word your reason for being upset.

 

[teotwaki]

Box -
Haven is posting well articulated, thought out responses. How is that Internet web flexing???

Haven was the author of the other thread and has not posted in this derailed thread. Box Rocket was referring to the MaxTrax haters who persist in off-topic attacks.

So back on topic with some videos

Verbal review of both Tred & MaxTrax

Crux ladders in sand

Another interesting comparison with some interesting DIY devices and illustration of the importance of proper placement


use of bridging ladders as opposed to sand traction devices

Strap=on traction

X-Jack

 

[MattScott]

I run the MAXTRAX account here on Expedition Portal, and I'm switching to my personal account to reply so the responsibility for the response lies on me.

I could see how some of our posts would come off as snarky—but if it means anything, I'm just trying to interact with people on Expedition Portal as an actual person, as I have done for the last five+ years of being a member on this forum and helping to build this community. I'd rather not be another company on here that provides you with a sterile, pre-approved response from a massive marketing department. We are four-wheel drivers that live for adventure and we hate corporate crap.

I made a comment (well, actually, I posted a photo from the original story) on the CRUX post because it's a bit odd to say how well a product works when you're basing it off of a combined effort that was made with a competitor—not exactly fair in my opinion, and Jonathan then went back and stated that. If you're allowed to call me a **************—why can't I defend our product?

Until then, I think this thread has gotten a bit out of hand. Please go back and read all of the posts I've made, use your brain, and then judge our company. I've had several people message me wondering what all the drama is about and if we deleted something, because they didn't see any cause for concern. Nothing has been deleted, and I think things have been unfairly blown out of proportion. Haters are going to hate.

If anyone has a question about MAXTRAX and how they're different, please post a question here, or send me a PM or an email: matt@maxtrax.com.au. We're real people, with real experience, and real opinions—talk to us. If you need more details on why MAXTRAX, you can even call me—we're here for our customers.

This is the last time I, or MAXTRAX will comment on this, because I/we are not getting dragged into an internet debate. Let's get this thread back to what it was meant to be. If you want to complain, send me an email or a PM and we'll resolve it.

 

[I Leak Oil]

I became a believer of Maxtrax a couple years ago when I saw them used in some soupy muddy mess. Really worked as advertised, simply awesome. No opinion on the others as I've never seen them in action.
However, I don't own a set and probably never will due to the price. If Maxtrax really wants to completely own the market share, they need to bring the price down. That is by far the biggest criticism I have of them and seems to be the largest complaint in general about them. Step on your competitors necks and make them more affordable.

 

[Mountainhound]

Respect!

I run the MAXTRAX account here on Expedition Portal, and I'm switching to my personal account to reply so the responsibility for the response lies on me.

I could see how some of our posts would come off as snarky—but if it means anything, I'm just trying to interact with people on Expedition Portal as an actual person, as I have done for the last five+ years of being a member on this forum and helping to build this community. I'd rather not be another company on here that provides you with a sterile, pre-approved response from a massive marketing department. We are four-wheel drivers that live for adventure and we hate corporate crap.

I made a comment (well, actually, I posted a photo from the original story) on the CRUX post because it's a bit odd to say how well a product works when you're basing it off of a combined effort that was made with a competitor—not exactly fair in my opinion, and Jonathan then went back and stated that. If you're allowed to call me a **************—why can't I defend our product?

Until then, I think this thread has gotten a bit out of hand. Please go back and read all of the posts I've made, use your brain, and then judge our company. I've had several people message me wondering what all the drama is about and if we deleted something, because they didn't see any cause for concern. Nothing has been deleted, and I think things have been unfairly blown out of proportion. Haters are going to hate.

If anyone has a question about MAXTRAX and how they're different, please post a question here, or send me a PM or an email: matt@maxtrax.com.au. We're real people, with real experience, and real opinions—talk to us. If you need more details on why MAXTRAX, you can even call me—we're here for our customers.

This is the last time I, or MAXTRAX will comment on this, because I/we are not getting dragged into an internet debate. Let's get this thread back to what it was meant to be. If you want to complain, send me an email or a PM and we'll resolve it.

 

[WMDunkin]

Well to try and help get back on topic. I have always thought about the pros and cons of a board/ladder type recovery vs the xjack/air bag recovery. What scenarios would each on perform best or better at? Which ones are they lacking?