New Defender Rage/Hate Thread

C

Carson G

Well-known member
mpinco said:
Considering that the auto industry is worldwide with supplier networks in support of multiple manufacturers, there are few degrees of component level reliability differences. Now one vehicle may be more complex and use more components but that is product differentiation. Land Rover is no different.
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Exactly. Toyota has even made parts for Land Rover before. I know on the LR3/4 they had all Denso engine electrical systems as well as several sub systems. I assume the new ones are the same. You can bypass a lot of systems on a modern Land Rover. The only things I can think of electrically that would completely disable a modern LR would be some kind of engine management issue. Every other system has a work around. Or you would have the same issue on another vehicle.
 
soflorovers

soflorovers

Well-known member
Genuinely curious:

You can only get the 18' steel wheels on models below the P400; the P400 has much larger brakes and thus requires the 19' wheel. That got me thinking, are there other driveline differences between the P300 and P400? For example, does the P400 have thicker axles like an HD pack LR3? Personally, I love speed and acknowledge that the P400 is likely the superior powertrain, but is it worth the extra $12,000? For me at least, the P300 is sufficient. However, if that $12,000 comes with a beefed up drivetrain (axles, diffs, CVs, etc...), then it may just be worth it to upgrade. Ultimately, if I wind up getting a new Defender, I doubt it'd be stock for very long.
 
JackW

JackW

Explorer
The 4 cylinders have 4.11 differential gears while the six has 3.55 gearing so top speed is affected but off road ability should be enhanced. Plus the MHEV system on the six adds a lot of complication. That's why I decided to order a P300. It's still rated to go over 110 mph.
 
nickw

nickw

Adventurer
JeepColorado said:
I agree, you can't really just look at individual posts; you have to look at the reports- all of which @T-Willy cites are incredibly clear- LR as a brand is horrible and clearly worse than Jeep and Toyota and basically anyone else.

Regarding numbers of posts about Jeeps- sure there will be some- I'm surprised there's not more- LR sold roughly 95,000 vehicles in the US last year, not bad, up actually, Jeep sold over 923,000. @DieselRanger please do take a fair look at jlwranglerforums.com what you'll find are people who are modifying and actually using their vehicle as it was intended. Much of the LR cites are discussing how to fit 20" rims and asking whether they should trade out their air bag system for coils.
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That's been on-going for YEARS on the Lexus / Toyota GX's.....
 
Blaise

Blaise

Well-known member
soflorovers said:
Genuinely curious:

You can only get the 18' steel wheels on models below the P400; the P400 has much larger brakes and thus requires the 19' wheel. That got me thinking, are there other driveline differences between the P300 and P400? For example, does the P400 have thicker axles like an HD pack LR3? Personally, I love speed and acknowledge that the P400 is likely the superior powertrain, but is it worth the extra $12,000? For me at least, the P300 is sufficient. However, if that $12,000 comes with a beefed up drivetrain (axles, diffs, CVs, etc...), then it may just be worth it to upgrade. Ultimately, if I wind up getting a new Defender, I doubt it'd be stock for very long.
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Is this for sure? I only see one brake rotor size listed anywhere I've looked. I assumed the 18" wheel option was purely due to options (no "lower end" wheel on a higher option car)

Also, does the HD LR3 have thicker axles? I do not see a difference when shopping axles for HD package vs not. My truck is an HD pack and can measure the shaft diameter - I'd guess it's identical.
 
nickw

nickw

Adventurer
Blaise said:
Is this for sure? I only see one brake rotor size listed anywhere I've looked. I assumed the 18" wheel option was purely due to options (no "lower end" wheel on a higher option car)

Also, does the HD LR3 have thicker axles? I do not see a difference when shopping axles for HD package vs not. My truck is an HD pack and can measure the shaft diameter - I'd guess it's identical.
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It's a good question - they all have the same towing capacity per the website, which is typically the determining factor for brake size unless they are aiming for better braking performance....
 
Blaise

Blaise

Well-known member
I'd suspect (suspect only, I work in aerospace test not trucks) that the SAE J2807 test is typically limited by engine cooling, not brake capacity. That being said, the P400 could very well have larger brakes, but I haven't seen any proof of this. I certainly hope you can run an 18" wheel in the P400 and would surprised if LR didn't allow this on their flagship offroader.

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SAE J2807 Tow Tests - The Standard

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U

umbertob

Adventurer
Brakes are different, per the brochure the fronts are 349 mm (twin piston) on the P300 and 363 mm dia. (4 piston) on the P400, while the rears are 325 and 350 mm dia. single piston, respectively. That's over 1/2" larger out front and a whole inch in the back, which makes me think the factory 18s are definitely too small for the larger engine. Hoping and praying the Compomotive PD1880 18" off my LR4 might work on the P400... But I am not too hopeful. I checked and the fronts of the LR4 are a few mm. smaller.
 
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