Our Dual-Sport GMC Sierra
- Thread starter chaos616
- Start date
chaos616
Adventurer
Hey Larry, thanks, yeah its a cool axle and yes it hangs low, but the little testing i've been able to do it doesn't seem to be a problem, i'm also pleased as i didn't know if the normal cut gears running forward on the coast side would be noisy, but they don't seem to be at all. i'm guessing when i air down there will be a little dragging, but at least its got thick diff covers so shouldn't be too bad. I will get a photo of the shift levers, there are some finishing touches to do to them, finish work really, but well get there in time, already replaced the shift knob with a drilled and tapped cue ball. The idea will be to print out a glob in the correct projection so we can cut it and it will be a mini globe, might be kinda cool.
Speaking of NV4500, i looked at your swap a lot for information about it, I think it will be a pretty stout transmission, gets a bit warm, but no issues yet with a good couple hunderd miles on it.
locrwln, thanks, yeah its finally drivable and i feel like i can now start adjustments and start enjoying it.
Will post more when i get the pictures off my phone.
Cheers,
Speaking of NV4500, i looked at your swap a lot for information about it, I think it will be a pretty stout transmission, gets a bit warm, but no issues yet with a good couple hunderd miles on it.
locrwln, thanks, yeah its finally drivable and i feel like i can now start adjustments and start enjoying it.
Will post more when i get the pictures off my phone.
Cheers,
amgvr4
Adventurer
Looks good. How were the BFGs in that slick mud? I was really debating between them and the goodyears when I got my military take offs. It also looks like your upper coils are almost fully compressed at normal ride height. Did you ever go with softer coils or are those the same ones you started with?
chaos616
Adventurer
hey amgvr4, yeah, the bfg's in the mud were not so great, although the truck is pretty heavy for mud too, i think if i were to have aired down (if i was at that point of desperation) i would have faired a bit better, time will still tell. Yeah, the upper coils are 450 and lowers are 650, I have not switched out, unfortunately other things got in the way, so I will be switching the bottoms for 550 or 600, still not sure, when we get back from texas and try to tune the suspension better, its fine on the road as of now, a bit harsh off road. How are the MTR's in the mud or other terrains, it was a serious debate for me as well. I can say the BFG's are a pretty hard tire with tough sidewalls, i had the rears at 60 psi and to get the pattern to sit flat on the road surface i will have to drop them to 50 or 55 psi.
Cheers,
Cheers,
amgvr4
Adventurer
Looks like it flexes well even with the stiff springs. Mine will not max out the shock travel when I drive the front up on a ramp, only when I back up. I'm only 4x2 right now so the rear looses traction when the font tire is 24" in the air. I love the MTRs in pretty much every situation. They have tons of grip in the mud and clean really well. I haven't had them in the slick clay/mud that you were dealing with yet though, that stuff is murder no matter what tire you have. I am also really surprised at how quiet they are on the freeway. On my coilovers I have 450 over 400 and they are compressed pretty evenly. It looks like your 450s are fully compressed at normal ride height, I wonder if that is due to the overly stiff 600s. I also haven't adjusted my single rate stops low enough to do anything yet so I'm in dual rate the whole time. I have toyed with the idea of adjusting them so that I am in single rate all the time when on the road to try and tame some of the body roll. It is pretty easy to do without taking anything apart.
chaos616
Adventurer
98dango, thanks, and yeah, so far so good on the bfg's although a tiny bit loud, but no louder than my bfg km2 255/85 r 16 tires and these are quite a lot larger.
amgvr4, yeah, i might switch to 550 to start and see where i'm at, i'm pretty sure the 450's are compressed because of the 650's. Although i do have to say the 650's do help with body roll too, hence the reason they are staying on for the trip to tx and back, then i'll swap them out and start tuning. good to hear about MTR's, may have to try them next time around. Are you experiencing that much bind on your radius are sytem. I did the 3 link to combat that, but i'll eventually have to run a sway bar because body roll is really really bad. I know 4x2 messes up the tests for sure. I havn't officially tested mine out yet, going to find a forklift to test with soon and see what it can do. My suspension hits my single rate stops about 2" of compression on the upper springs, then it gets kinda stiff. I think this is a big factor that attributes to the fact that i cannot hit the bump stops with 2 of the tires almost off the ground.
So no extra pictures as of yet, however I put in my car chemistry exhaust inserts to try to make it a bit quieter on the highway, it was dronning pretty bad. It is definitly quieter for road work, but sounds like a ****ty dirtbike now. I'll adjust and try to get it a little better for now but eventually i will switch from having the deal after my muffler to before, i think ultimately that will make it much more desirable sounding and quieter. at least i won't get a headache going to tx and back.
Cheers,
amgvr4, yeah, i might switch to 550 to start and see where i'm at, i'm pretty sure the 450's are compressed because of the 650's. Although i do have to say the 650's do help with body roll too, hence the reason they are staying on for the trip to tx and back, then i'll swap them out and start tuning. good to hear about MTR's, may have to try them next time around. Are you experiencing that much bind on your radius are sytem. I did the 3 link to combat that, but i'll eventually have to run a sway bar because body roll is really really bad. I know 4x2 messes up the tests for sure. I havn't officially tested mine out yet, going to find a forklift to test with soon and see what it can do. My suspension hits my single rate stops about 2" of compression on the upper springs, then it gets kinda stiff. I think this is a big factor that attributes to the fact that i cannot hit the bump stops with 2 of the tires almost off the ground.
So no extra pictures as of yet, however I put in my car chemistry exhaust inserts to try to make it a bit quieter on the highway, it was dronning pretty bad. It is definitly quieter for road work, but sounds like a ****ty dirtbike now. I'll adjust and try to get it a little better for now but eventually i will switch from having the deal after my muffler to before, i think ultimately that will make it much more desirable sounding and quieter. at least i won't get a headache going to tx and back.
Cheers,
amgvr4
Adventurer
Do you have your 650s on the top or bottom? The best setup is to run the short firm rate up top and the long soft rate on bottom. The reason for this is because in dual rate your actual spring rate is 265lbs. By R unning your 650s on the bottom you are changing from a 265 rate to 650 rate once you hit the single rate stops. If your firm springs are on top you have a much smoother transition into single rate. If you change your 650s to 550s your dual rate is 247 and then run your 450 on bottom to help that transition be a little less harsh. That should also help a ton with maximizing your travel.
My radius arms only start to bind toward the end of my travel, but I would have to disconnect one of my top links to know how much of a difference it makes. I doubt it is providing much of a anti sway effect for me. I'm running a 211 dual rate only at the moment since I haven't adjusted my single rate stops down yet. Your rear setup is also flexing a lot more than mine. My rear leafs are pretty stiff and worn out. I will probably three link the rear in the future since it would be less money than some nice springs.
My radius arms only start to bind toward the end of my travel, but I would have to disconnect one of my top links to know how much of a difference it makes. I doubt it is providing much of a anti sway effect for me. I'm running a 211 dual rate only at the moment since I haven't adjusted my single rate stops down yet. Your rear setup is also flexing a lot more than mine. My rear leafs are pretty stiff and worn out. I will probably three link the rear in the future since it would be less money than some nice springs.
chaos616
Adventurer
amgvr4, interesting, no i have, if i can remember, 12" 450 on top and 16" 650 on bottom, makes sense though about the softs on bottom so there is a smoother transision, but of course i would have to get longer softs for the bottom before i can flip, i think the 12" will be a little short on the bottom now. Now i need to re-think, although i think the 550's on the bottom will still help the harshness. If i do the flip, then i need 4 new springs, for length in this case. Weight difference to yours i'm thinking that i'm pretty close to you on the truck or sprung side, you have the diesel and i have tons of steel junk on it. I guess i'll have to just start experimenting and see what works. maybe, as you suggested earlier, i need to go even softer.
Another question for you, do you have issues with your spring sliders/seperators rubbing really badly on your shock bodies, mine seem to rub pretty good and make a nice joyful squeaky noise. Its something i need to adress soon before i wear my shock body or sliders out.
Yeah my rear end flexes pretty good, but could be a bit better, right now i have stock springs minus the over load with a helper spring, but its a very temporary set up. Unless i move the gas tank, or use my spare blazer tank as the main tank and get rid of the main tank, i don't think i will be fitting a crossed 4 link in the rear. That would be the most desirable, otherwise i could stock fit a 3 link or parallel 4 link. I will be interested to see what you do with yours and how you tackle it. Luckly i have already provisioned for this modification for mine by using coilover shocks without coils on in the rear of the truck, so all i need are links mounts and dom tubing to complete (most i would fab myself). The other option is an aftermarket leaf pack, good but yeah its spendy, maybe more than a linked suspension at this point.
ohh boy, decisions decisions...
Cheers,
Another question for you, do you have issues with your spring sliders/seperators rubbing really badly on your shock bodies, mine seem to rub pretty good and make a nice joyful squeaky noise. Its something i need to adress soon before i wear my shock body or sliders out.
Yeah my rear end flexes pretty good, but could be a bit better, right now i have stock springs minus the over load with a helper spring, but its a very temporary set up. Unless i move the gas tank, or use my spare blazer tank as the main tank and get rid of the main tank, i don't think i will be fitting a crossed 4 link in the rear. That would be the most desirable, otherwise i could stock fit a 3 link or parallel 4 link. I will be interested to see what you do with yours and how you tackle it. Luckly i have already provisioned for this modification for mine by using coilover shocks without coils on in the rear of the truck, so all i need are links mounts and dom tubing to complete (most i would fab myself). The other option is an aftermarket leaf pack, good but yeah its spendy, maybe more than a linked suspension at this point.
ohh boy, decisions decisions...
Cheers,
amgvr4
Adventurer
Depending on where you got the springs from you might be able to exchange them for different rates as long as they look close to new. Most places have a spring exchange program since it is basically an educated guess in the first place. I am running 14" 400s and 12"450s on mine. It would help to balance out your rate to switch your lengths to be more equal as well. With your bumper and winch hanging off the front I bet you are correct about our front axle weight being pretty close. If I were you I would start with 14" 450s and keep your 12" 450s for the top. If you need to go stiffer you can change out your 12" 450 for a 500 or 550 later on. The single rate is only really a bonus if you are doing more medium to high speed fire road stuff where bottom out control is crucial. I don't have mine set up to even use the firmer single rate and I have yet to have any bottoming issues. It helps when you have 5" of travel to soak up the bumps!
So far I have no noise or rubbing from my spring spacer. Did you use any grease or lube on them? If you did that could be the problem. Grease or oil will only serve to attract dirt and gunk without providing any real benefit. The plastic it is made from is designed to be slick enough to work without any lube.
In the rear I am limited to a three link with panhard bar due to the front fuel tank positioning. There is no space for a triangulated four link, which is what I would prefer. I checked and there is plenty of space for a set of 5" coil springs on the axle where the leaf spring pads are. I might even be able to use the front bronco lift springs I was going to use in the front. That means I would only need links and brackets to do a linked setup and that is much less than a set of Deavers leafs.
So far I have no noise or rubbing from my spring spacer. Did you use any grease or lube on them? If you did that could be the problem. Grease or oil will only serve to attract dirt and gunk without providing any real benefit. The plastic it is made from is designed to be slick enough to work without any lube.
In the rear I am limited to a three link with panhard bar due to the front fuel tank positioning. There is no space for a triangulated four link, which is what I would prefer. I checked and there is plenty of space for a set of 5" coil springs on the axle where the leaf spring pads are. I might even be able to use the front bronco lift springs I was going to use in the front. That means I would only need links and brackets to do a linked setup and that is much less than a set of Deavers leafs.
chaos616
Adventurer
amgvr4. Yeah, i don't know if i'll be able to exchange these springs. but when i do new ones i will check on that so i can hone it in better. I didn't really use anything, only some WD40 at first but i have since washed them many times, not sure what it is, but it must be the fact that the springs must just be sagging to one side or something. Sounds about right on the rear. Those deavers are probably sweet but yeah they are really really pricy.
Kmehr, thanks, i'm pretty happy with it, glad you enjoyed.
k9lestat, thanks a bunch k9, appreciate the comments.
We are in TX right now, truck made it fine, we had the nv4500 shift tower fall off, but we didn't loose any bolts so we re attached and all was well. Only other issue was some misfire detects, P0300, multiple misfires, when i got the box of spark plugs i dropped them not far but on to the ground, maybe 1.5', but shoulda just got new ones right there, so i swapped them out for ac-delco's and it seems to have worked a bit better so far, well see how it goes on the way back, as there was some stuttering on the way down.
When i get back, well update with some cool trip pictures, although South Padre Island is hardly off-roading, we did go up 33 miles up the beach and that was a lot of fun, we got to about 70mph on the beach with the big bumps/sand bar things and it handled fairly well. I can tell i need some spring adjustment in front and some serious re-work on the rear end. Maybe work on the linked rear or just get some better springs, and work on remounting and valving the fox shocks to get more throw out of them on the bump and droop travel as well as lightening it up for the lighter rear end.
Ok, cheers!!!
Kmehr, thanks, i'm pretty happy with it, glad you enjoyed.
k9lestat, thanks a bunch k9, appreciate the comments.
We are in TX right now, truck made it fine, we had the nv4500 shift tower fall off, but we didn't loose any bolts so we re attached and all was well. Only other issue was some misfire detects, P0300, multiple misfires, when i got the box of spark plugs i dropped them not far but on to the ground, maybe 1.5', but shoulda just got new ones right there, so i swapped them out for ac-delco's and it seems to have worked a bit better so far, well see how it goes on the way back, as there was some stuttering on the way down.
When i get back, well update with some cool trip pictures, although South Padre Island is hardly off-roading, we did go up 33 miles up the beach and that was a lot of fun, we got to about 70mph on the beach with the big bumps/sand bar things and it handled fairly well. I can tell i need some spring adjustment in front and some serious re-work on the rear end. Maybe work on the linked rear or just get some better springs, and work on remounting and valving the fox shocks to get more throw out of them on the bump and droop travel as well as lightening it up for the lighter rear end.
Ok, cheers!!!
GJStringert
Observer
GREAT Build!
This is just a wicked build, and that front axle is killer! Also digging the rack and especially the halo lights, I feel like they're one of the stand out features of the truck in all these pictures, especially in the snow haha!
Great minds must think alike. Back when I had my Titan I had an ARB bumper on it and built a hitch receiver for it very similar to yours. Only my winch wasn't the legendary 8274...
Anyway keep up the great work! I'll be watching!
This is just a wicked build, and that front axle is killer! Also digging the rack and especially the halo lights, I feel like they're one of the stand out features of the truck in all these pictures, especially in the snow haha!
Great minds must think alike. Back when I had my Titan I had an ARB bumper on it and built a hitch receiver for it very similar to yours. Only my winch wasn't the legendary 8274...
Anyway keep up the great work! I'll be watching!
chaos616
Adventurer
GJ, Thanks for the comments, i really appreciate it. I keep thinking two things, why did i do that front axle... followed by ...that front axle is pretty cool. Honestly though, it works as well as any other and i haven't yet had hangup issues on it, well see how it does in death vally. I keep having a halo go half out on the passenger side, sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't, ohh well, still looks neat. That is funny you did a hitch receiver too, they are handy things to have on a bumper for sure. When i mount the 8274 permanently in the arb I will look at welding on a permanent receiver tube somehow, I think it would be nice to have. Thanks again and if you ever get sick of that 12V engine of yours just let me know and i'll take it off your hands...haha!!!
Ok, Finally an update.
I have been messing with adjustments, so nothing too new. I have ordered two things. My brake bias front to rear was way way off, so I ordered and now have a summit proportioning valve to place inline in the rear. That should help tone down the rear tire smoking stops when braking somewhat hard.
Also I have ordered jks sway bar disconnects for a jeep (oops), actually jks seems to make a good product and although i usually tend to make my own stuff if even for the sake of making my own stuff, i thought i would give these a try. So I will adapt them to my sway bar, will post pictures when my fabrication comes along a bit further. Hopefully they work well though.
So I do have a few pictures. A few shots of the truck flexing a bit. It still wasn't completely flexed out. Although having changed my springs to 14" 450 and i have the 10" 400 on top. Eventually i will change out to I think 12" 450 on top and set the progressive rate stop so that it will go from around 240 something to 450, Its pretty smooth as it is. My holdups are still a little on the front suspension, but now mostly the droop on the rear isn't so good, compression is fine, but i also need to move the shock mounts out just a tad, for 1, better stability with the shocks, and 2 so they are set more correctly for correct droop and bump with the front (it was a calculation error on my part during the build...durf).
This first image was to check full bump on the passenger side as well as the corrected bumpstop mount (it was hitting the track bar mount just a tad), it all came out pretty good.
I didn't get one of the driver side, but its also pretty good, couldn't get it to bump as far, but could have been how i drove up the hill. Either way, on both side the tire, at full bump, comes up to within 4" of the fender at center, and the only tire contact is on the front fender liner a little bit, its awesome how it all pretty much misses everything, so i must have calculated something right...yay me!!! Pretty happy with the front so far, need to figure out my plan of attack to really tidy up the rear, i want to use my coilover shocks as just that, so that means linking and cross members, a lot of work again, but may pay off, when i adjust the front mounts and tuck everything a little better i will do the rear then...maybe along with a cummins, anyone have a 12V available???
For those who asked about my fender heights, they ended up on both ends at just above 49 1/4". Can't remember what stock is.
Proof photos:
Front:
Rear:
Cheers, and I will try to update a bit more this weekend with my sway bar modifications and brake adjuster!
Ok, Finally an update.
I have been messing with adjustments, so nothing too new. I have ordered two things. My brake bias front to rear was way way off, so I ordered and now have a summit proportioning valve to place inline in the rear. That should help tone down the rear tire smoking stops when braking somewhat hard.
Also I have ordered jks sway bar disconnects for a jeep (oops), actually jks seems to make a good product and although i usually tend to make my own stuff if even for the sake of making my own stuff, i thought i would give these a try. So I will adapt them to my sway bar, will post pictures when my fabrication comes along a bit further. Hopefully they work well though.
So I do have a few pictures. A few shots of the truck flexing a bit. It still wasn't completely flexed out. Although having changed my springs to 14" 450 and i have the 10" 400 on top. Eventually i will change out to I think 12" 450 on top and set the progressive rate stop so that it will go from around 240 something to 450, Its pretty smooth as it is. My holdups are still a little on the front suspension, but now mostly the droop on the rear isn't so good, compression is fine, but i also need to move the shock mounts out just a tad, for 1, better stability with the shocks, and 2 so they are set more correctly for correct droop and bump with the front (it was a calculation error on my part during the build...durf).
This first image was to check full bump on the passenger side as well as the corrected bumpstop mount (it was hitting the track bar mount just a tad), it all came out pretty good.
I didn't get one of the driver side, but its also pretty good, couldn't get it to bump as far, but could have been how i drove up the hill. Either way, on both side the tire, at full bump, comes up to within 4" of the fender at center, and the only tire contact is on the front fender liner a little bit, its awesome how it all pretty much misses everything, so i must have calculated something right...yay me!!! Pretty happy with the front so far, need to figure out my plan of attack to really tidy up the rear, i want to use my coilover shocks as just that, so that means linking and cross members, a lot of work again, but may pay off, when i adjust the front mounts and tuck everything a little better i will do the rear then...maybe along with a cummins, anyone have a 12V available???
For those who asked about my fender heights, they ended up on both ends at just above 49 1/4". Can't remember what stock is.
Proof photos:
Front:
Rear:
Cheers, and I will try to update a bit more this weekend with my sway bar modifications and brake adjuster!