Overland Expo West, 2014

[Jonathan Hanson]

Second that—what a pretty little girl. Sorry I didn't get a chance to meet her!

 

[BurbanAZ]

I've seen your puppy quite a few times - soooooo cute.

Yea she was really loving all the attention and socialization, which was great for her

Second that—what a pretty little girl. Sorry I didn't get a chance to meet her!

Hopefully you will at some point side we're going to get out a lot more for trips and stuff now that we have the 4runner, plus it looks like you might be close to us

 

[James86004]

In ten years of living in Flagstaff and thousands of miles riding my bike on Lake Mary road and around Mormon Lake I can count on one hand the times I have been truly buzzed by a truck or RV...usually a tourist's rental RV or the random big rig.

The bike lane/shoulder is wide and I rarely fear for my life as locals almost universally move over to provide plenty of room. Boat and water hauling pickups, forest service fire trucks, even the stereotypical beat down pickup with the dogs in the back, the rifle in the window, and the quads on the trailer that I expect from years of riding to shout an expletive to me as they pass....almost always move into the other lane and give a wave.

This was not the case last weekend.

I have never been so disgusted by drivers that were obviously heading out to Mormon Lake. My girlfriend an I were forced off the shoulder close to a dozen times by trucks and motos.

I am really surprised by this. I commuted on Lake Mary Road every day for almost 10 years, up until 2004. The road used to be a lot narrower between the Lower Lake Mary and the Forest Service office, there was barely any shoulder at all. Even with that tiny shoulder, I never had a problem while riding my bicycle. I would think now that it is so much wider it would be better.

 

[Jeremy P.]

My family and I had a great time; we met a lot of great people and the kids got plenty dirty. With the dust and wind, it was a lifesaver being able to put the kids down for a nap in the trailer (the big one not the little one):


We luckily ordered our pizza just before the pizzeria ran out of cheese one night. The Sunday morning walk around breakfast by the vendors was nice, especially mimosas and bloody marys!

The dirtbike zipline setup was interesting:


We found free camping at Navajo National Monument and went up the Moki Dugway on the way home:


We are looking forward to next year!

 

[James86004]

Here was the best meal we had all weekend:

The older gentleman grew up in Spain and cooked a Paella feast. He invited us over and offered the meal to us on condition that we have some wine.

 

[Gooseberry]

I agree with this 100% but with that said I did not cook all weekend thanks to all the I consider my friends I ate very well.

Sorry to stir the pot... (no pun intended) I can't believe that people are whining about lack of food vendors...?
Isn't one of the tennets of overlanding something like-um, being self sufficient? You know? like procuring, storing, transporting and cooking your own food?
Hell they even offer classes on it at theExPo for crying out loud!!!

 

[photo_i]

He invited us over and offered the meal to us on condition that we have some wine.

 

[Jonathan Hanson]

I'm glad most people had a good time, but I have a distinctly different experience. This was my second Expo and it will be my last. I was DISAPPOINTED!!!

We arrived early Thursday afternoon in order to get a good camp spot. The spot we choose was against the outermost "boundaries" of the camping area. It was crowded, but I would expect that for an event like this. What I figured out later was that arriving later in the weekend and at night got you better locations because no one was there to direct you away from where you wanted to camp.

There was NO water for the campers. I get that it is a "dry" camp, but in the material online it refers to the fact that there is "...water for filling up." There was none except for the sink in the bathroom 3/4 of a mile away. Personally, I don't really want to use water out of a bathroom sink.

Most of the "classes" were not educational as much as hour long, in person, infomercials. Most of the "classes" I went to were put on by vendors who spent the entire hour hawking their wares. What I thought might be a good class on kitchen organization was just an hour of the advantages of using the company's chuck box. There was nothing about organizing an overland kitchen. I thought the class about choosing a medium truck for overlanding was Tacoma/Four Wheel Camper centric. While I think that the combination of truck and camper is excellent, I would like to hear other options in a class about choosing a medium sized vehicle.

To be honest, I did learn high-lift technique and recovery skills.

I'm not sure why anyone should buy a weekend pass when NO ONE ever checked credentials or weither you were registered for the class you were in. Basically, anyone could go to any class they wanted to go to. Why pay for the "special" classes when anyone who wants to go can?

The low point of the weekend occurred when I returned to my site Friday afternoon to find that the boundary was just a suggestion and the camp had expanded to three or four rows behind my rig in the previously "out of bounds" area and another group had set up camp five feet in front of me. I was camped in.

Saturday morning, I went to one infomercial class and the medium truck class and made the decision that I wasn't learning anything, I wasn't having fun, and I didn't want to be a part of the experience. I visited the Oasis and while talking to the others there they all shared the same thoughts.

Finally, around noon on Saturday, I packed up and left. We paid $485 and took three days off of work to attend. It was a waste of both time and money.

As I said, I'm glad lots of people had a good time and benefited from it and that's good, but I think it's important that others know that it may not be what they are looking for and the experience won't be positive for everyone. I won't be going again and I wouldn't recommend it to anyone asking about it. At least not without being VERY clear about what to expect in both experience and value.

While I'm disappointed you were disappointed, I should clear up a few things regarding your comments.

There was water for campers; it was in a large water buffalo near the entrance. I talked to several people who filled from it. We also had five showers available there, even though, as you admit, we're careful to describe it as dry camping. There's also a fill on the road in front of the lodge.

The "class" you described as an infomercial for a company's chuck box was a demo, not a class. As such it's open to everyone, and obviously can be expected to concentrate on the company's product, right?

The class you described as "choosing a medium truck" was not about choosing. It was intended to be a walk-around and discussion of one person's idea of the perfect medium-sized truck, which was how it was described.

The initial camp boundary was needed to keep the first campers in from simply spreading out all over the lake bed, as has happened in the past to complaints from nearby residents. We make very sure to tell everyone who comes to the Expo to camp that it is not Jellystone Park with neatly separated boundaries. It's a weekend of community camping. Most people take advantage of that to socialize. There are numerous opportunities in the nearby national forest for dispersed camping, as we make clear.

Regarding the people you met at the Oasis who "all" shared the same thoughts: Given the responses we've had so far to this year's event, I can only surmise you must have picked out a very odd and rare group. But we're aware that no matter what we do we cannot please everyone. I suspect you would not be any happier with next year's event, as the overwhelming majority of comments I've read here and in emails (274 in one day) have, with a few and much appreciated constructive suggestions, encouraged us to keep doing things the way we have been.

 

[F5driver]

I had day passes and it was great to meet new people and see old friends. One suggestion I have Johnathan is please put a few porta-potties dispersed throughout the camp area. It's a long walk from the rear of the camp to the few John's at the entrance. Things can happen pretty quickly after that first, morning cup of joe.

 

[photo_i]

And things can happen pretty quickly after that first, morning cup of joe.

Didn't you get some of those carry on toilet bags as your welcome package?

 

[Camping_Cookie]

While I'm disappointed you were disappointed, I should clear up a few things regarding your comments.

There was water for campers; it was in a large water buffalo near the entrance. I talked to several people who filled from it. We also had five showers available there, even though, as you admit, we're careful to describe it as dry camping. There's also a fill on the road in front of the lodge.

The "class" you described as an infomercial for a company's chuck box was a demo, not a class. As such it's open to everyone, and obviously can be expected to concentrate on the company's product, right?

The class you described as "choosing a medium truck" was not about choosing. It was intended to be a walk-around and discussion of one person's idea of the perfect medium-sized truck, which was how it was described.

The initial camp boundary was needed to keep the first campers in from simply spreading out all over the lake bed, as has happened in the past to complaints from nearby residents. We make very sure to tell everyone who comes to the Expo to camp that it is not Jellystone Park with neatly separated boundaries. It's a weekend of community camping. Most people take advantage of that to socialize. There are numerous opportunities in the nearby national forest for dispersed camping, as we make clear.

Regarding the people you met at the Oasis who "all" shared the same thoughts: Given the responses we've had so far to this year's event, I can only surmise you must have picked out a very odd and rare group. But we're aware that no matter what we do we cannot please everyone. I suspect you would not be any happier with next year's event, as the overwhelming majority of comments I've read here and in emails (274 in one day) have, with a few and much appreciated constructive suggestions, encouraged us to keep doing things the way we have been.

I hate to break it to you, Johnathan, but I would tend to agree with OP.

At a couple different times during the OExpo, I was in the Oasis and found similar comments. Like the OP, I too got camped in, as did others I spoke with (I guess another rare group of folks!). While most might think that cramming as many people as possible into a small space is setup as a "social thing", someone at the "Oasis" (great name btw) described it best, "uncomfortable". I spoke to my neighbors. I made my friends, but frankly, it was uncomfortable. Next time, take off your uniform and see what people are saying.

As for the classes, don't call "Demos" classes. Don't call them "How to Outfit Your Kitchen" (or whatever the original name was) when it's really "X Company's Chuck Box". It's misleading and a waste of time.

My biggest issue was that everywhere I went, it was unorganized. I showed up early (Thursday) between the hours suggested (1-7:30PM) and NOBODY was around to direct me and help me find where I was suppose to go. Thanks to another camper, I found my way back to HQ, checked in, and went on my own to find a camping spot (which was WAY too far from a restroom IMO). And no, before people think that I'm complaining about "dry camping", I'm not. If I REALLY camped, I'd find a nearby bush or dig a hole, but I don't think the surrounding people would appreciate that. You say there was available water, but where was that (clearly) indicated? Thankfully, I came prepared with water. Also, better signs directing people to classes would be a huge help. For any classes I had in Seminar I or II, I found people lost in the restaurant.

I've learned what I've needed to from OExpo, but I don't see myself coming back anytime soon. My overall experience could be best described as "uncomfortable". You can surmise that there is a "very odd and rare group" of people who were dissatisfied, but you're only fooling yourself.

One other suggestion, maybe learn the term "SOLD OUT". Rumor had it that you expected roughly 6,000 attendees, but it was about 7500+. Really? Even Disneyland will sell out. But I get it, you're making money.

 

[justcuz]

This was my first Expo, my expectations were not predisposed to anything in particular.
I brought two friends over from Prescott and we walked around for several hours on a day pass.
We walked through the vendor area, I bought a cookbook, Stan bought a hat. I was looking for a copy of the Overland Journal, but I guess they may have been sold out by Staurday afternoon.
We saw lots of interesting product displays, looked at some cool vehicles and spent most of our time watching the various vehicles on the driving course. It was fun watching the various vehicles and comparing the differences of their capabilities based on articulation, traction control, wheelbase, etc.
Before we left, we drove around the parking lot and part of the camping area to view various vehicles and their set ups.
I got to meet Nick and Larry and just missed Lance.
Phil, just a couple months out from a scheduled hip replacement surgery was understandably tuckered, (that's why we drove the parking lot and camping area).
My only regrets were I could not convince Phil or Stan to sign up for a driving experience, and I forgot to bring chairs. We could have spent all day watching the vehicles drive the course and the parade of different vehicles coming in and out of the parking area.
We did get a kick out of the Dodge Power Wagon demo and their description of the new 3 link front suspension that increases articulation. This is basically a 2 link, with a panhard rod or track bar, curiously similar to a 1965 Ford F-100 4x4 Mono-Beam front axle setup. I wish that product presenters knew the product better, I found the hype disappointing compared to the reality of what I saw, when I crawled under the vehicle. Technically there is a difference between a link/radius arm and a rod (either panhard or tie) in my view and presenters need to speak to the listener. This crowd is much more educated than the normal consumer when it comes to suspension.
In closing, we had a good day, saw some cool stuff and I may have made a convert out of Stan, since he is now looking for a reasonable camping, fishing, getaway SUV type vehicle.
We drove to and from the Expo via the route past Stoneman Lake. Each time I visit my friends in Prescott I find a dirt road to travel on. I love the off roading opportunities that are all over Arizona!

 

[crawler#976]

That's one of the things I don't get. Most of the folks in attendance would rather chew off their left arm if that facilitated getting away from a group camp, yet they do so willingly at the Expo, then complain about it. We've been to every Expo at Mormon Lake, and have camped off premise with no one around us, yet are only 4 miles away. We see a few moto's go by practicing their new skills, a few rigs go by exploring, but never have had anyone else closer than a half mile. So, why do you do it? Why complain about it?

My ***** is posted above about the ingress/egress congestion, and that should be simple to fix if the property owner is willing to do so.

Mark

I hate to break it to you, Johnathan, but I would tend to agree with OP.

At a couple different times during the OExpo, I was in the Oasis and found similar comments. Like the OP, I too got camped in, as did others I spoke with (I guess another rare group of folks!). While most might think that cramming as many people as possible into a small space is setup as a "social thing", someone at the "Oasis" (great name btw) described it best, "uncomfortable". I spoke to my neighbors. I made my friends, but frankly, it was uncomfortable. Next time, take off your uniform and see what people are saying.

 

[justcuz]

When we first arrived we drove into the wrong entrance. It would have made a nice exit, but would have required the food vendors to be relocated since the roadway went right in front of their places of business. A circular arrangement whereby the one way in and out would have facilitated a smoother traffic flow. We stayed late enough that most of the day pass folks were leaving before we piled in our ride. I would have loved to stay and watched some movies, but our wives in Prescott had dinner planned, so we had to leave.
Most overland vehicles spend a lot of time on the road. Monday we were heading west on I40 and saw a blue FJ60 that had either badly balanced tires, or worn spring bushings so bad that the entire bumper and grille guard were shaking. Although well kitted out, that vehicle was a real bone shaker and I hope the owner if your reading this has the issue fixed. That kind of vibration can ruin a good day real fast and is hard as hell on a vehicle. Lug nuts can come loose, and the nasty harmonic setup through the vehicle, can cause all kinds of havoc.
Maybe a class on seat of the pants diagnostics is appropriate in the future!:Wow1:

 

[James86004]

Someone asked for more photos:

Not going to Phoenix:

An eclectic mix:

The view from the RV park:

Folks evidently like their Kermit chairs. Too bad we could not find a vendor selling any.

Jim West spotting an air-suspended EarthRoamer:

The newest flying carpet: