Point Five Ambo Build
- Thread starter patoz
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patoz
Expedition Leader
patoz
Expedition Leader
Alex, I hadn't thought about turn signals for that light. However the new ambulances have a strobe located there or centered over the rear wheel well. The new standards for all emergency vehicles require 'eye level' warning lights. In other words, a second lower level of visual warning devices in line with a drivers eyes as he/she is sitting in an automobile. Since the Type I (PU's) and Type III (vans) have a light on the side of the front fenders, I figured that light would be the rear equivalent. You would think after driving fire trucks for 35 years and ambulances for 10 of that, I would know all of this right?
As far as test equipment goes, I have a mirror, a 20' test lead made up, a volt/ohm meter with continuity tone, a tone generator and tracer, and a Power Probe III. The problem is, nothing will read through that converter properly (if it's even working right). Also, when I cut the vehicle in half, I disconnected and removed the batteries. The cables and grounds have been removed also, so the electrical panels are dead. All of the emergency systems wiring from the cab has been pulled back into the module into the attendant's seat box.
Plus my tail light sockets were all corroded up, so I just bought new assemblies since I wanted to switch to LEDs anyway. However, they are not hooked up yet because I need to relocate the wiring once I identify it.
So, what I did this afternoon is look at what I need to do to put 12VDC power back on the panels temporarily, without setting the whole unit on fire.
Even though power for the tail, brake, turn and clearance lights would normally come directly from the stock vehicle wiring, in this case it looks like at least the clearance lights are run through a relay, because I heard it and then found a breaker for it.
It looks like at least some of the lights are using a type of 'Isolation Relay' type system to handle the increased load of all of the extra lighting that an E350 van does not normally have.
This is a diagram for a motorcycle pulling a trailer, but just think of ST1300 as the E350 stock system, and 'To Trailer' as the ambulance module lighting.
If all else fails, I'll just run a separate harness to the rear like Alex did, because I would like for the brake, turn, and running lights to be independent of the 'house' system. However, I will add a switch to connect the house battery(s) to the running lights in an emergency, such as any situation where I might need to leave the trailer at night and want the lights on. Or maybe just camping at Christmas time!
As far as test equipment goes, I have a mirror, a 20' test lead made up, a volt/ohm meter with continuity tone, a tone generator and tracer, and a Power Probe III. The problem is, nothing will read through that converter properly (if it's even working right). Also, when I cut the vehicle in half, I disconnected and removed the batteries. The cables and grounds have been removed also, so the electrical panels are dead. All of the emergency systems wiring from the cab has been pulled back into the module into the attendant's seat box.
Plus my tail light sockets were all corroded up, so I just bought new assemblies since I wanted to switch to LEDs anyway. However, they are not hooked up yet because I need to relocate the wiring once I identify it.
So, what I did this afternoon is look at what I need to do to put 12VDC power back on the panels temporarily, without setting the whole unit on fire.
Even though power for the tail, brake, turn and clearance lights would normally come directly from the stock vehicle wiring, in this case it looks like at least the clearance lights are run through a relay, because I heard it and then found a breaker for it.It looks like at least some of the lights are using a type of 'Isolation Relay' type system to handle the increased load of all of the extra lighting that an E350 van does not normally have.
This is a diagram for a motorcycle pulling a trailer, but just think of ST1300 as the E350 stock system, and 'To Trailer' as the ambulance module lighting.
If all else fails, I'll just run a separate harness to the rear like Alex did, because I would like for the brake, turn, and running lights to be independent of the 'house' system. However, I will add a switch to connect the house battery(s) to the running lights in an emergency, such as any situation where I might need to leave the trailer at night and want the lights on. Or maybe just camping at Christmas time!
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flightcancled
Explorer
Yeah my first order of business would be sorting out house battery power and then working backwards. My experience is that the boards have a short section of welding cable that goes straight down to the frame for an efficient ground. Assuming you have the same all you need to do is get power to the positive bus terminal and ground the battery to the frame and you are back in business. Shouldn't be a hazard... Right?
Have you seen those little things that let you charge an RV while towing? Connects like the 5 pin and acts as an ACR off the truck.
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Have you seen those little things that let you charge an RV while towing? Connects like the 5 pin and acts as an ACR off the truck.
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patoz
Expedition Leader
Alex,
Mine has the large + and - cables you're talking about, but I took them loose and removed them completely when I removed the cab. My battery compartment is in the right front lower corner of the module (box) and the - was grounded to the frame below it and the +went forward into the engine compartment to the starter, then looped around and back to the battery switch under the driver's seat. I just need to reground the - side and run a + cable directly from the battery bank across and under the front of the module to a battery switch and then to the main buss of the panel.
The hazard I'm worried about is all of the downstream wiring I have taken loose from everything in the cab I disconnected and pulled back. It's all in a coil (bare ends and all) in the base of the attendant's seat. This box is about 14" deep, so you're only seeing the top layer of it. We have some rain moving in right now, but when it clears I'll get it all stretched out and tape everything up so it's safe.
My F250 Super Duty has the OEM 7 Pin harness and connector already on it, so that's what I bought for the trailer side also. The 7 Pin setup has a 10 ga. wire that comes directly from the tow vehicle's battery and charging system, and is for supplying power to the trailer for charging its battery(s) and running 12VDC items. When I design my permanent electrical panel, I'm planning on using this as on of the input sources for 12VDC. I like the idea of an ACR though, if Ford doesn't already have something built in. I guess I'll have to do a little research on that.
If you have a link for anything in particular, I'd like to take a look at it.
Mine has the large + and - cables you're talking about, but I took them loose and removed them completely when I removed the cab. My battery compartment is in the right front lower corner of the module (box) and the - was grounded to the frame below it and the +went forward into the engine compartment to the starter, then looped around and back to the battery switch under the driver's seat. I just need to reground the - side and run a + cable directly from the battery bank across and under the front of the module to a battery switch and then to the main buss of the panel.
The hazard I'm worried about is all of the downstream wiring I have taken loose from everything in the cab I disconnected and pulled back. It's all in a coil (bare ends and all) in the base of the attendant's seat. This box is about 14" deep, so you're only seeing the top layer of it. We have some rain moving in right now, but when it clears I'll get it all stretched out and tape everything up so it's safe.
My F250 Super Duty has the OEM 7 Pin harness and connector already on it, so that's what I bought for the trailer side also. The 7 Pin setup has a 10 ga. wire that comes directly from the tow vehicle's battery and charging system, and is for supplying power to the trailer for charging its battery(s) and running 12VDC items. When I design my permanent electrical panel, I'm planning on using this as on of the input sources for 12VDC. I like the idea of an ACR though, if Ford doesn't already have something built in. I guess I'll have to do a little research on that.
If you have a link for anything in particular, I'd like to take a look at it.
flightcancled
Explorer
Oh man I figured you would be miles ahead of me on this. Finally have something to share with you.
Basically a cheap ACR. Personally I think that if I'm dropping $60 and then going through the pain of the install to get a wimpy trickle charger I would rather spend 100 for a blue seas ACR and then run some heavy gauge cable for it. The idea is really what's interesting. An ACR can be hooked to a switch on the dash of your truck and only told to send power when you want it.
http://www.lslproducts.net/ToadChargePage.html
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Basically a cheap ACR. Personally I think that if I'm dropping $60 and then going through the pain of the install to get a wimpy trickle charger I would rather spend 100 for a blue seas ACR and then run some heavy gauge cable for it. The idea is really what's interesting. An ACR can be hooked to a switch on the dash of your truck and only told to send power when you want it.
http://www.lslproducts.net/ToadChargePage.html
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patoz
Expedition Leader
Actually, I had thought about using a Blue Sea ARC for this purpose. I just didn't realize there was a dedicated product already on the market.
Since I already have the whole truck side of the 'Toad Charge' system factory installed, all I really need is the 'Charge Regulator' part for the trailer side. It looks like I can buy just that part separately.
I'm like you though, I'd rather use a Blue Sea ACR because of it's quality, warranty, and tech support, but in my case that would make for some very long heavy gauge cable runs, so I don't know. However, I did find this Blue Sea BatteryLink™ Automatic Charging Relay - 12V/24V DC 120A that looks like it would do the job. It requires #6 wire for 60 Amps.
http://www.amazon.com/Blue-Sea-Syst...harging+Relay+with+Auxiliary+Battery+Priority
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patoz
Expedition Leader
Not much significant to report, but just to show a certain individual I haven't been slacking...
I've spent the last two days tracing wiring and have identified the brake, tail, and backup light circuits, but still can't get the turn signals to work. I can hear relays clicking in the electrical panel, but that's it. The turn signals run through a converter, which may need power in order for it to work, or it may be bad.
Based on all of these assumptions, I decided to put power back on the main buses and relay boards in hopes some of this stuff will work. I don't know what # they are, but my main battery cables are the size of my thumbs, and I'm talking about just the copper conductors, not the insulation. Working with those things is like wrestling a python, and since I'm not ready for any permanent installation yet, I installed a temporary battery and battery switch inside at the base of the electrical panels using some #2 cables that I removed from under the hood. You can see them in the center of the picture below.
I flipped the switch, although everything is still dead. I'm not surprised, and as you can see I have a lot of stuff disconnected, including the entire front panel and everything that was in the cab or under the hood. The front panel had a 'Master' switch which controlled a large solenoid that acted as a 'Master Switch' for the module. So, tomorrow I'll try to find that circuit and power it up manually. Maybe, I can hook the front panel back up and get a few sparks to fly. Now, where did I put those pictures I took as I was taking it all apart?
I've spent the last two days tracing wiring and have identified the brake, tail, and backup light circuits, but still can't get the turn signals to work. I can hear relays clicking in the electrical panel, but that's it. The turn signals run through a converter, which may need power in order for it to work, or it may be bad.
Based on all of these assumptions, I decided to put power back on the main buses and relay boards in hopes some of this stuff will work. I don't know what # they are, but my main battery cables are the size of my thumbs, and I'm talking about just the copper conductors, not the insulation. Working with those things is like wrestling a python, and since I'm not ready for any permanent installation yet, I installed a temporary battery and battery switch inside at the base of the electrical panels using some #2 cables that I removed from under the hood. You can see them in the center of the picture below.
I flipped the switch, although everything is still dead. I'm not surprised, and as you can see I have a lot of stuff disconnected, including the entire front panel and everything that was in the cab or under the hood. The front panel had a 'Master' switch which controlled a large solenoid that acted as a 'Master Switch' for the module. So, tomorrow I'll try to find that circuit and power it up manually. Maybe, I can hook the front panel back up and get a few sparks to fly. Now, where did I put those pictures I took as I was taking it all apart?
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flightcancled
Explorer
Slacker!
Personally I would take a minute to make sure that the block heater and inverter wires can't short and then plug in the shore power. Makes everything so much easier and more pleasant in there.
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Personally I would take a minute to make sure that the block heater and inverter wires can't short and then plug in the shore power. Makes everything so much easier and more pleasant in there.
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patoz
Expedition Leader
The block heater and all it's wiring was removed when I removed the cab, and the inverter was stolen way before I bought the vehicle. One of the first things I did was rewire the remaining 120VAC system, which consist of nothing more than the Shore Power inlet which goes to a 4 outlet box. Each outlet and the overhead florescent lights have their own cords, which are plugged into that 4 outlet box. The cord that is unplugged goes to the lights, but since I have removed them also (no bulbs or parts available) I don't want power going to them. This box has been removed, which is why you now see that huge pile of wire all over the floor.
Yes, having working outlets does make it nice for plugging in lights, tools, vacuum cleaners, heaters, etc. Eventually, that jury rig will be replaced with a real breaker box or a Blue Sea A/C Power Distribution Panel.
Well, the sun is shinning and it just hit 70*, so I better go get to work. Can't be no slacker, you know!
java
Expedition Leader
The block heater and all it's wiring was removed when I removed the cab, and the inverter was stolen way before I bought the vehicle. One of the first things I did was rewire the remaining 120VAC system, which consist of nothing more than the Shore Power inlet which goes to a 4 outlet box. Each outlet and the overhead florescent lights have their own cords, which are plugged into that 4 outlet box. The cord that is unplugged goes to the lights, but since I have removed them also (no bulbs or parts available) I don't want power going to them. This box has been removed, which is why you now see that huge pile of wire all over the floor.
View attachment 258232
Yes, having working outlets does make it nice for plugging in lights, tools, vacuum cleaners, heaters, etc. Eventually, that jury rig will be replaced with a real breaker box or a Blue Sea A/C Power Distribution Panel.
Well, the sun is shinning and it just hit 70*, so I better go get to work. Can't be no slacker, you know!
120V plugs are so nice! I use the exterior plugs on my truck all the time since its already half way across the driveway and has hot plugs right there, short cords are way nicer to get out and put away.
patoz
Expedition Leader
I agree, and I'm also planning on adding external duplex outlets with weather proof covers to all four sides of the camper. Not only good for powering up camping items, but for maintenance tools such as drills, buffers, portable work lights, etc. Since I'll also have a 3KW generator on board, this will be real handy.
patoz
Expedition Leader
I have a two battery bank now and may add a second one, so I'll have either an inverter with charger; an inverter with charger/12VDC converter; an inverter with charger/12VDC converter/automatic transfer switch; or at the very least just a charger, so I will need a place to plug it in inside.
I'm a firefighter (retired now) by trade, but did electrical work on the side. Plus, electronics has been a hobby all of my life, so this this thing will be so overbuilt it's ridiculous!
I'm a firefighter (retired now) by trade, but did electrical work on the side. Plus, electronics has been a hobby all of my life, so this this thing will be so overbuilt it's ridiculous!