RAM Promaster / Van Advice

[JMyerz]

Hey everyone,

I've been looking into vans for the last couple weeks and I keep coming back to the 118" Promaster. I know they are pretty new, but am curious if anyone has any experiences with them at all? Dealer has one for $26k new which seems like a pretty decent deal.

Maybe someone has some other suggestions? Here is what I need it to do:

1. Good Daily Driver
2. I'm a photographer, has to haul lights / stands / etc
3. Light overland use (gravel roads)
4. Fit 10+ ft surfboards inside while I'm on a hike
5. Sleep a young family of 3
6. Decent gas mileage (realistic but also not wanting 13mpg).
7. Last about ten years
8. Haul Mountain Bikes easily

The eurovan would be a perfect fit, but I'm not wanting to spend $10k + on a vehicle that age with over 100k on the clock.

Thanks for helping out.

Best,

J

 

[haven]

I like the Promaster, too. The front drive layout means a lower floor and easier step-in. It's based on the Fiat Ducato, which is the best selling van in Europe. The majority of Euro motor homes use the Ducato cutaway chassis.

I believe the first Promasters will use the 3.6l gas V6 found in the Wrangler, attached to a six speed automatic.

A four cylinder 3.0l diesel is also planned. It's a $4000 option. The transmission changes to a six speed automated manual trans that has lower low and higher high gears. This truck engine was co-developed in Europe by Mitsubishi Fuso and Fiat. It's currently used in USA in the Fuso Canter 140 FG and 160 cab over engine trucks, both of which are rear wheel drive.

The smallest Promaster is pretty maneuverable. It's only an inch longer than a 2014 Toyota Land Cruiser, and has a tighter turning circle.

 

[mhiscox]

There is a fair amount of interest in the Promaster from many of us Sprinter owners, as the Promaster is likely to offer many of the strengths of the Sprinter, but it has an engine that can be expected to be less expensive to maintain, a more extensive and less expensive dealer network, and a considerably lower purchase price. Also, the Promaster sizes are perhaps a better mix for an individual than the Sprinter, which starts big and goes to gigantic.

Fit and finish is, given the price, deservedly better on the Sprinter, and the Sprinter is all-around the more sophisticated vehicle. And the front end of the Promaster--a rebadged Fiat Ducato, as you probably know--is, to many, aesthetically-challenged. On the other hand, the Promaster's front-drive arrangement allows a usefully lower load floor, and the curvature of the side walls isn't as severe as in the Sprinter.

The point being that there's plenty of utility to be had from a Promaster and it will meet all of your needs at a reasonable cost. They're new enough in the US that there's limited information available, but you can, and probably should, get some useful opinions from here:

http://www.promasterforum.com/

You may also want to consider the Ford Transit van if you don't have to do something immediately. They are in pre-production, with training vans being driven around to Ford dealers now. More information on the Transit is here:

http://www.fordtransitusaforum.com/.

For what it's worth, all three manufacturers' websites now have a "Build your Own" configurator that will let you compare features and costs pretty easily. It's worth noting that it doesn't take too much bling to build a Sprinter or Transit that costs nearly double the price they offered the Promaster for.

 

[JMyerz]

Awesome information, thanks everyone.

The price point and potential are pretty darn attractive. I'm courting the dealers now and am looking at a 118" cargo, windows on all doors and the fully loaded cabin for around $24k. That's pretty hard to beat price wise! I've been looking at slightly used Express or E150 (30k miles) and in the neighborhood of $18-$22k which makes this promaster all the more attractive.

Thank you for the lead on the promaster forum, looks like most guys are getting 17/21 out of the V6. Not too bad for a vehicle of it's size.

For those with experience, how is the pentastar V6 in terms of reliability?

 

[haven]

Here's a used Promaster, low roof, 136" wheelbase, no windows, 15K miles for $22k. It's at a Ford dealer in Florida.

http://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-sale/vehicledetails.xhtml?listingId=368890781

 

[JMyerz]

Not bad although it's in the other corner of the US! We'll see what these guys come back with. I have to say dealing with Fleet salesmen is way better than the usual car dealers!

 

[Christian P.]

i said it before...in a couple years, those vans will be everywhere. Just like they are in Europe.

You can't go wrong, although I would go for a 136" with high roof

 

[JMyerz]

I think your right Christian, I just got to drive one and was shocked at the ease and comfort. I really hope we can work out a deal.

 

[bdog1]

3.6L and 62 trans is used in Chrysler corp. minivans. The V6, of Mercedes heritage, has had cylinder head issues, but improvements have been made. The six speed trans. has been "beefed up" for durability. Electronics seem Fiat blended with Chrysler controllers.

I must say I'm not personally a fan of the seating position, like a fish bowl feeling in the cab. For a Sprinter owner this might be more familiar.


Sent by wing, prayer & ATT

 

[Cole]

Hey everyone,

I've been looking into vans for the last couple weeks and I keep coming back to the 118" Promaster. Dealer has one for $26k new which seems like a pretty decent deal.



Maybe someone has some other suggestions? Here is what I need it to do:

1. Good Daily Driver
2. I'm a photographer, has to haul lights / stands / etc
3. Light overland use (gravel roads)
4. Fit 10+ ft surfboards inside while I'm on a hike
5. Sleep a young family of 3
6. Decent gas mileage (realistic but also not wanting 13mpg).
7. Last about ten years
8. Haul Mountain Bikes easily

The eurovan would be a perfect fit, but I'm not wanting to spend $10k + on a vehicle that age with over 100k on the clock.

Thanks for helping out.

Best,

J

I was just cruising the Promaster site. $26k is lower than the lowest MSRP for even the most basic of basic vans.

I own two vans, a Sprinter that I'm trying to convert from a cargo van to a "Family Adventure Van" and a Eurovan "Weekender".

Despite having more space inside my 158" Sprinter, the Eurovan Weekender is FAR more useful. (Two beds, table, "living room" with 5 seats facing the table, standing room when you want it and low clearance parking when you need it, already has a house battery system, full camperized windows, big screens, etc, etc). (I can also tell you where my young family likes to spend their time, its in the factory finish quality of the Eurovan, not the half converted and industrial feeling Sprinter)

The point being that just because you can get a "new" van for $26k doesn't necessarily mean that it's the better deal.

If your goal is a family adventure van with cargo capabilities you may want to shop for something already set up for that task.(or add more options to the Promaster, but then it won't be a $26k car) You would be surprised at how much more it will cost to build out a basic cargo van.

As always with new cars. They will depreciate. The Promaster is a complete unknown at this point. It could have average depreciation here or massive depreciation. Used cars have already gone through the massive depreciation cycle and have much more predictable values moving forward. Some are even appreciating.

Obviously some cost more to maintain than others.

 

[JMyerz]

Cole,

All points well taken. We are a pretty active family and time spent in the van would be for sleeping or ducking the rain, we'll
be out playing in the ocean / tide pools or riding our bikes out east. I agree the Eurovan is much more user friendly but the cost
of these plus the maintenance seems daunting. My wife and I have had VW's in the past, both in similar era as the Euro and they
were nightmares.

While I'm the first one to hate the new car depreciation and dealer hassle I'm looking at this a little more long term. I need this to
last ten years with a pretty light maintenance schedule. I own my own business so time is precious to me, while I enjoy working on
cars I like getting out even more.

The Promaster, stateside, is an unknown. They have been incredibly popular in Europe for a long while and I see why, I drove one yesterday
and was shocked at how well it drove. The big gamble to me is pentastar, but they seem to be dialing it in and the newer ones seem pretty
great. The powerband sure seemed smooth. It's a bit of a risk jumping into a new car but I can't help but think of the Honda Element, everyone
thought they were the ugliest thing ever and now they fetch an amazing used price, at least in Portland.

Still, no decision has been made. Still playing volleyball with the sales team

J

 

[Christian P.]

Sounds to me like you are ready for a Promaster.

I have some European catalog here that shows literally hundreds of different campers build on that platform currently available in Europe - including Westfalia.

I will be in France in a few weeks and I want to collect more information on parts available for camper conversion.

 

[Cole]

Don't get me wrong here. I'm not suggesting you get a Eurovan per se. Just using it as an example since you mentioned it, and I happen have one and a Sprinter Cargo for comparison.

Sometimes the discussion itself is helpful and might simply lead to something productive. Like possibly spending a bit more for some options on the Promaster now.

I wish that I had found a deal on a Sprinter Passenger van instead of a Cargo now. Here is the short list of things I wish my Sprinter Cargo had that my Eurovan does. (And a Sprinter Passenger would have)

-Windows all the way around! Much easier to drive and quite honestly we go places to see and do things, not stare at the inside of the van. It's amazing how much nicer it is to watch the rain outside rather than just hear it!

-rear AC and HEAT!!!!! I drove my Eurovan today because it was going to be mid 80s and the Eurovan has front AND rear AC!! Not to mention the insulation and a layer of interior trim panels instead of bare (hot) steel walls. Along the lines of "heat issues", because the Eurovan is under 6'7" tall I can park in cool underground parking garages. My Sprinter is about 9' tall which lands me in the "open" a lot. Even some trees hanging over parking lots are too low.

-To expand on the windows and factory interior panels that are missing in a cargo van. They add a level of sound insulation heat/cold insulation and "fit & finish" that feels much nicer inside than the plain cargo walls do!

If you are thinking of the long term it may be worth it to get a passenger version of the Promaster to gain some factory quality creature comforts.

One last thought on pricing of things like the Eurovan. There is a reason people are willing to pay those high prices. Mostly because it(and the Vanagon) are the only "car sized" RVs available in the USA. Unless someone brings in something like the T5 California (at $80k plus) the price of the VW campers is only going one direction.

 

[JMyerz]

Your totally right Cole and I appreciate the conversation!

The windows and insulation are points well taken. This particular van has a window on the slider and rear doors so most of
the needed windows are there. My uncle is a master fabricator, with his experience and resources and my never ending goal
to keep simplicity at a maximum I think I can end up with something pretty comfortable, utilitarian and lower cost.

I'm taking the the layout of the non pop top vanagon (just the bed) and combining it with the simplicity of my Honda element. Another
vehicle that makes me wonder why they killed it!

Passenger vans at this point are $10k more and not readily available yet in the Promaster. I just found out though my bank does not like
to lend on "Commercial" vehicles so the dance continues.

 

[zelatore]

Awesome information, thanks everyone.

The price point and potential are pretty darn attractive. I'm courting the dealers now and am looking at a 118" cargo, windows on all doors and the fully loaded cabin for around $24k. That's pretty hard to beat price wise! I've been looking at slightly used Express or E150 (30k miles) and in the neighborhood of $18-$22k which makes this promaster all the more attractive.

Thank you for the lead on the promaster forum, looks like most guys are getting 17/21 out of the V6. Not too bad for a vehicle of it's size.

For those with experience, how is the pentastar V6 in terms of reliability?

Wow - if I could have found a new Promaster like that for $24K I'd have strongly considered that instead of the NV200 I picked up. I paid less and I get better mileage, but not that much better on either count. (about $19.5K for a loaded SV w/8500 miles; averaging 24.5 mpg to date)

The extra room would have been nice, though it probably would have cost more to upfit also since it's simply a bigger truck. i.e. more shelves, racks, etc to buy. But still....