*Rickashay's 04' Tundra* - A build of Compromises

[theBullfrog125]

Long travel arms are usually 3.5 inch wider than stock and the gains are worth it. So I'm leaf spring world. Long leaf means longer travel. 5 inches doesnt sound a lot but 3.5 doesn't either.
The 63s are flexy springs from guys I rock crawl with.


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Oh I'm not debating that Chevy springs aren't flexy, because they sure are! But it really just depends what you are comparing them to. Taco and pickup/early 4runner guys do the swap because they're stock springs are stupid short (I think pickups have 52 inch springs)

5 inches doesn't sound like a lot because it really isn't for leaf springs. When I swapped my T100 springs they were 54 inches so 9 inch longer springs made sense. For you Tundra guys 5 inches of spring length will equate to maybe a couple inches of extra droop which is something you could easily gain from a custom progressive pack and a shackle flip.
I'll also say that I think Addison's truck is way too nice to put some mediocre stock Chevy springs under.

 

[Climbermac]

I haven't seen 63's on a Tundra or a Tacoma in person so I can't really speak to that but the custom Alcans I have in the rear of my Tundra are OUTSTANDING! The flex is fantastic while still handling very well at high speed and with a wide range of loads in the rear. I am waiting to really feel like they are fully settled in (they went on in early July) but some day very soon I will pick a rear tire with a forklift and really measure the travel but to this point I have been very, very pleased with the performance. If I could simply flip the rear shackle cleanly with a solid shackle angle I'd love to but I genuinely think I would exceed the travel of my already custom 10" rear-resi shocks. I would really be interested in comparing flex/travel of Chevy 63's vs my Alcans on a Tundra. I know the Alcans are more expensive out of the gate but after sourcing parts, fabrication, re-working geometry and all, I wonder how the performance vs price gains really stack up.

 

[theBullfrog125]

^That's what I'm saying. I was wondering when you were going to chime in Climermac! A built pack will have much better handling anyway so might as well invest the cash vs time into a properly built pack.
Me and a buddy spent a lot of time getting the mounts done on my rig. We cut and moved the front mounts twice and moved the shackle mounts like 4 times to get the angle right primarily because there is little info regarding the swap on a T100, same goes for a Tundra. It was kind of a headache.
In my mind a good compromise without buying new springs would be a progressive add a leaf mini pack and a shackle flip.

 

[Blackdawg]

You don't have to get longer leafs for longer travel. Im on the shortest leaf packs for a tacoma...and i have plenty of travel..

A well made custom pack will get you far and work better. Never got the hard on people have for Chevy leaf swaps. Especially expedition style guys. Granted, i have no idea how you'd get nice leafs in Canada..so that's a problem..but id gladly pay the 700 bucks for a custom Alcan pack before i cut up the mounts and put chevy springs on. My Dads are amazing and my buddies. Mine are alcan's too just not custom..other then i modified them because they where just the Wheelers stock leafs made by alcan.

 

[River19]

Did I miss the write-up on the "gingerfab" light bar? I like how simple it is, but a few more details would be nice... Sweet Tundra BTW.

Yes......agree......how did you mount the lights?

I have been in a 6 month analysis paralysis with regards to light bar mounting......bull bar is "meh" and push bars are OK but some make the front feel too "heavy" visually....I am a fan of functional upgrades not a big *** push bar with no personal function for me.

 

[dyogim]

I noticed a big improvement swapping out my tundra leafs w/aal to chevy 63's. Positive results for both on/off road. Payload capacity increased and better flex when wheelin'. I went for a camping trip and loaded the truck with the same gear I had brought in a previous trip with stock leafs. The rear end sagged and at certain dips/bumps, I would hit the bumpstops. With the 63's, the rear end stayed level with the front and I never hit the bump stops. The cost for the swap $300 total. I got the springs for $100, parts and labor $200. I pieced the kit together and bought material at a very low cost because, the sellers were trying to get rid of them. It also helped to have a friend who did all the welding.

 

[theBullfrog125]

That was my exact experience, and my swap costed about the same all in all. Got the springs for $50, only had 60k on em! I immediately noticed the ride quality increase, but my old springs were totally shot (180k) so by comparison some average springs felt tons better. Doesn't mean they are necessarily that good, just better than what I had. I often wonder if I had springs built for me instead of the swap, not that I regret it I just wonder how much better custom would have been.
One thing I do know is my overload is THICK. And it doesn't take a whole lot to hit it when loaded down because the springs are quite soft. Mind you I have 1999+ 1500 springs so they are 2+1, not a very common year range for this swap. This is what I plan to add soon:
http://performancelifts.com/deaver-gm-mini-pack-j1.html

 

[dyogim]

I often wonder if I had springs built for me instead of the swap, not that I regret it I just wonder how much better custom would have been.

At the time I was doing the swap, I spoke with other tundra owners that went with Alcans/Deavers. Both had their differences. However, based on a couple of experiences some wanted best of both worlds and by going custom, if you went with flex, you lose on payload. If you went with payload, you lose in flex. Mind you this was 10+ years ago. So, technology changes. The 63's was the only tried and true set-up at that time for many different rigs.

 

[Climbermac]

I will also add that my setup also utilizes airbags with cradles. The improvement in the flex of the springs is certainly all due to the springs and the travel increase as well but the handling is also due to the airbags. They really do allow for a very adjustable and versatile setup back there. I have definitely had some major headaches with the bags themselves over the years but I refuse to ditch them entirely because the function (when working) is so killer!

I'll also just toss in that I was running a progressive AAL pack on my OEM Tundra rear leafs and I'll be honest I never liked how the springs behaved. Maybe it's in my head but I've had leaves added to packs or AAL's on several trucks and they never feel like they move that well. The Alcan packs on the Tundra cycle really smooth and clean, just like the Alcans on my FJ40. I've also seen springs packs break leaves where the AAL puts additional pressure on the original leaves.

The bottom line is if the 63's will get the job done by themselves and travel/flex like you want, dive in. If you are just going to keep having to manipulate them, you might as well just get packs made right the first time. I almost went with Alcans when I did the AAL's, in hindsight, I really should have just spent the money then and done it ONCE...

 

[theBullfrog125]

I haven't been happy with my Fabtech add a leaf either. It has way to much arch, which provides lift, but is very bouncy even when loaded down. I liked the handling characteristics of the Chevy's themselves but need the extra height so I think I can get that from the Deaver mini pack because it is much more progressive than the single add a leaf.
One thing that I find interesting is how Toyota uses leaf springs that have unequal eye to center pin lengths. Like one side is shorter than the other. I wonder why? The Chevy's are the same eye to pin length either end and that would in my mind contribute to a more sensitive flexible ride... maybe?

 

[Climbermac]

I'm not an engineer so I can't speak to the geometry of why but I can say having a long end and a short end is pretty a long time standard from Toyota. The springs on the FJ40 are the same way, long side to the shackle, short to the hanger. On the 40 it gives some added versatility in that you can "flip" your springs to stretch the wheelbase. I run my fronts flipped and it netted me +/-2" in WB and drastically improved the approach angle.

 

[rickashay]

Wow lots of good Tech Talk going on in this thread! Don't have time to read and reply to it all tonight but I'm sure it will be digested soon enough on my quest for more rear travel.

In the meantime, I did some exploring this weekend. I would say it was probably one of the top 2 wheeling experiences of my life. I'll have more info up in the next couple of days but here are a couple teasers for now:


IMG_5516.jpg by Addison Rickaby, on Flickr


IMG_5599.jpg by Addison Rickaby, on Flickr


IMG_5550.jpg by Addison Rickaby, on Flickr

 

[theBullfrog125]

:Wow1:

 

[lndhark]

Wow lots of good Tech Talk going on in this thread! Don't have time to read and reply to it all tonight but I'm sure it will be digested soon enough on my quest for more rear travel.

In the meantime, I did some exploring this weekend. I would say it was probably one of the top 2 wheeling experiences of my life. I'll have more info up in the next couple of days but here are a couple teasers for now:


IMG_5516.jpg by Addison Rickaby, on Flickr


IMG_5599.jpg by Addison Rickaby, on Flickr


IMG_5550.jpg by Addison Rickaby, on Flickr

Those of us that frequent the area (wife is a native of Canmore/Prairies) would like to know where that is :Wow1:

 

[theBullfrog125]

All I can say is I wish Oregon had mountains like that! I mean we got mountains but not many roads go over 6000ft here.