Rock Rings

[R_Lefebvre]

Just curious, I stumbled upon this idea on another forum. I've been planning on switching to steel wheels soon because my alloys are getting seriously rashed. I noticed that some hardcore off-road guys are welding steel rings into their wheels to help the lip hold up to rocks. It ends up sort of looking like bead locks, but without the bolts. It's just some extra metal to help support the lip when banged off rocks. But I've never seen anybody here doing it.

Anybody have and disadvantages I should know about? Wouldn't be hard to have some rings waterjet cut and weld them in before mounting the tires.

 

[Root Moose]

It's an interesting idea.

Depends on what you are trying to build. I wouldn't do it. Extra weight at the wheels means less MPG, acceleration, etc. Also, at that point might as well get bead locks so you get additional benefit from the weight and shape of the rings.

I could see doing it if you were building a crawler and already had internal Stauns... but even then, I'd be inclined to sell the Stauns and run a "normal" bead lock rim at that point.

For my usage plain ol' steel wheels are fine.

$0.02

 

[XJINTX]

I would wonder what it would do to the balance of tires for a non-trailer queen? It would have to be a pretty good weld job and cut to balance easily (I would guess).

I believe bead-locks are not DOT approved so are only on trailer queens but not sure.

 

[R_Lefebvre]

I did think about the balance issue. I would think it could be done with care, and if the rings were precision cut (water or laser) from cold rolled sheet, the ring itself would balance. The only difficulty left is in the centering before welding. Could even have the rim balance checked, then tack the rings in and recheck before final welding.

I understand bead-locks are "illegal", and don't think I need to go that far, as I don't have enough tire to run such low pressures anyway. This is just a way to hopefully make a set of steel rims stronger. I've seen the lips of other people's steel rims get mangled on some of the trails I run. Nothing too hardcore, just an off-camber trail with a rocks on the outside, the sidewall flexes out of the way and the rim lip gets caught and bent. It's particularly a problem for me with skinny tires.

I've already "machined" off the lip on most of my aluminum rims, would hate to buy a new set of steel wheels and have it happen to them too.

I've very aware of the "trailer queen" nature of some trucks, and definitely don't want that. The process would have to be carefully done, but it seems doable. So the fact that it's not common... is it because of the expense,, nobody thought of it, or some other killer reason?

 

[Scott Brady]

I would not consider it.

Added unsprung weight, increased rotational and reciprocal mass, possible challenges with mounting and dismounting the tire. Balance issues, etc.

I have never found a need for them, even on the nasty trails.

 

[chet]

what alot of off road guys up here did was weld a piece of 1/4" round bar to the inside of the lip. rolled previously of course. I have had steel wheels on all my rigs and never needed axtra lip protection. i have bent a lip over but it hammered out pretty quick.

 

[ntsqd]

The rolled bar stock approach seems more to the point of the need than a ring of plate. I've seen that done and it can be a pretty low key mod, something few would notice if post-weld prepped and painted. I do wonder about if the welding heat is enough to significantly remove an HT that might be in the rim, but that's probably the Engineer in me over-thinking things again.
Available for purchase are aluminum ATV wheels with a similar, but aluminum plate welded to them. Seem to be common on sand machines, though I'm at a loss as to why. Obviously DOT legality isn't an issue with those.

 

[max adams]

I wouldn't bother personally, I think the cost would be greater than replacing the steelies one at a time. That being said if I was to do it I would weld it on a rotisserie then have it machined after it was out significantly.

 

[762X39]

This seems like another solution in search of a problem that has already been solved.In the case of a trailer queen, why would you care.In the case of a daily driver, just get a set of DOT legal beadlocks (yes there is such a thing) or run the bags inside your tires (Stauns or other).On the other hand , if you are running skinny tires (I do on the Unimog, 10 inches wide) maybe the best solution is steel wheels which are "relatively" cheap compared to alloys.

 

[Root Moose]

Second the cheap wheel approach. The wheels I am currently running cost ~$50 a corner (on sale in the U.S. at $38 last time I bought... do the conversion, etc.).

 

[java]

i have bent one lip, it was easily bent back out with the proper tool at the tire shop, think wrench with a lip shape cut out in it. i couldnt beat it out with a sleggo. still held air even being really bent, moved to spare duty after that.

 

[R_Lefebvre]

My alloys cost Minus $600, so if you have a source of steel rims cheaper than that, I'm all ears!

I do wonder about if the welding heat is enough to significantly remove an HT that might be in the rim, but that's probably the Engineer in me over-thinking things again.

You and me both. That's a good point, though I highly doubt factory steel wheels are heat treated. Though, there is probably some amount of cold working done when they formed the lip that would be lost. Still, you'd get all this extra strength.

Added unsprung weight, increased rotational and reciprocal mass,

I've never been one to worry about wheel weight, even on sports cars. The reality is that for people in the real world, wheel strength is more important than weight. I always buy stronger wheels before lighter weight. Obviously professional race teams have an unlimited wheel budget, so they can go light weight.

I probably won't bother if it's that unpopular of an idea. Surprised, seemed to make a lot of sense. The only negatives I could really see so far is the expense and complexity. And actually the expense... I could get the rings cut for less than $50 each.

 

[Root Moose]

My alloys cost Minus $600, so if you have a source of steel rims cheaper than that, I'm all ears!

Jegs, Summit, et al. put on sales occasionally for basic stuff like Cragar and ARE. I'm guessing that you'll get raped because of the LR lug pattern though - if those mail order houses even carry anything that fits your truck.

I bought my wheels about a year or two ago. Cragar Soft 8 397 wheels, 16x8, 5 on 5.5", 5" BS. Basic wheel that was on sale for just shy of $40 each. Kinda meh on the style of them but they are a basic black steel wheel so it really doesn't matter as long as they are true.

 

[ntsqd]

Yeah, I was lumping the cold-work effects into "HT". How significant that is to actual use is the $64 question.

 

[rusty_tlc]

I just run cheap steel rims on my FJ40. At the end of the season if they leak around the rim, I beat them with a 3# single jack until they stop blowing bubbles. Eventually I'll have to replace them:shrug:

I'd like to get internal bead locks, when I run under 10# of pressure sometimes I have to air up on the trail because they bleed air when the side wall flexes.

If you do the weld on dealios you would want to run dynamic balancing media, airsoft pellets work as well as any thing else.