Tacoma that's 1600 lbs over GVWR... recertifying and wheeling

[nickw]

If you have and have found something related to GVWR, I'd be very interested in seeing it.

If you mean insurance on the upgrades to the truck and the camper itself, then ya... that won't be covered unless you've specifically included them.

The insurance may not specifically call out "GVWR" but I'm sure it's called out like "....any operation outside of intended use as described and qualified by manufacturer....". Capacities fall under that 'umbrella' and why manuf. spend so much time putting very specific capacities around their rigs, to limit their liability when some knucklehead puts a 1T camper on a 1/4T rig.

 

[rruff]

The insurance may not specifically call out "GVWR" but I'm sure it's called out like "....any operation outside of intended use as described and qualified by manufacturer....". Capacities fall under that 'umbrella' and why manuf. spend so much time putting very specific capacities around their rigs, to limit their liability when some knucklehead puts a 1T camper on a 1/4T rig.

Since they even have to pay when you are driving drunk, I kinda doubt that is so. They are required to pay for any crash that isn't intentional. They'd all have a dui disclaimer if they could.

Why Insurance Companies Must Pay for Drunk Driving Accidents​

When you get into an accident, the at-fault party’s insurance should pay for it. However, many people falsely believe that insurance companies will not pay out for drunk driving accidents because they think these accidents are intentional.

While driving drunk may be intentional, drunk drivers do not intend to get into a car crash. Due to the lack of intent, insurance companies should payout when a drunk driving accident occurs.

 

[dstefan]

Here’s a remarkably (to me at least) clear eyed and and logical run through of the risk profile for an overweight Tacoma. From the Blog of the folks ExpeditionPortal.com is featuring as “Two Rogue Wanderers”. See the section titled “The Challenges of the Tacoma”.

There are no absolutes! It depends on how you mitigate risks, how you drive, where you drive, etc. etc. Sure you can break your vehicle with too much weight. You can also be way under and drive like a knuckle head and break your vehicle. You can also buy a new vehicle and have it crap out in the middle of nowhere due to QC issues.

 

[rruff]

^ https://www.roguewanderers.com/the-build

 

[jchasse]

On second look, it seems like they missed a form:

"If the vehicle has been modified, such as the addition or removal of axles, or you are requesting a change to the manufacturer weight specifications, Form MV-426B must be completed."

Form MV-426B:

I am requesting a r street rod, r collectible or r modified vehicle. A detailed description of how the vehicle is configured (chassis, body components, engine, etc.) including all modifications, is attached. I understand my Pennsylvania Certificate of Title will be branded as a street rod, collectible or modified vehicle

This part of MV-426B confusing though:

Weight Certification - The weight certification for trucks, truck-tractors and trailers must be completed by a certified enhanced vehicle safety inspector if the correct weight(s) do not appear on the vehicle's certificate of title or salvage certificate (such as unladen weight, gross vehicle weight rating or gross combination weight rating). A weight slip for the unladen (empty) weight must be attached if the correct unladen weight does not appear on the certificate of title or salvage certificate. It is not necessary to complete the weight certification in order to change the registered gross weight of a vehicle. Previously titled vehicles that have been altered to raise or lower the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) must be certified by the vehicle manufacturer. A new VIN-specific weight certification decal must be issued for the vehicle by the manufacturer. This label must be affixed to the left (driver's side) door jamb or door latch post.

The part in green and red seem do disagree.

I'm no expert here, but is the confusion because the green is referring to GVW but the red is about GVWR?

 

[nickw]

Since they even have to pay when you are driving drunk, I kinda doubt that is so. They are required to pay for any crash that isn't intentional. They'd all have a dui disclaimer if they could.

Why Insurance Companies Must Pay for Drunk Driving Accidents​

When you get into an accident, the at-fault party’s insurance should pay for it. However, many people falsely believe that insurance companies will not pay out for drunk driving accidents because they think these accidents are intentional.

While driving drunk may be intentional, drunk drivers do not intend to get into a car crash. Due to the lack of intent, insurance companies should payout when a drunk driving accident occurs.

You still have responsibility to operate a vehicle within a "reasonable" expectation....people get denied for all sorts of reasons and I bet you anything there is a clause outlining something to the effect that I proposed. If the truck fails and somebody gets killed you better believe your insurance is going to look into it, if it was being operated within spec, they may look at the car manuf....that's how recalls get put in place and why the car manuf. have had to pay out hudreds of millions (billions) over the years. If it's deemed you had a camper that was 1000 lbs over payload, the car manuf. is going to push back and say look at the door sticker knucklehead.

LIkely - probably not but neither is 99% of the stuff we worry about.

 

[dstefan]

^ https://www.roguewanderers.com/the-build

Thanks @rruff ! Can’t believe I omitted the link! Duh … 🙄

 

[nickw]

Thanks @rruff ! Can’t believe I omitted the link! Duh … 🙄

Gotta love their "logic" - people have a amazing way of justifying anything when they know what end result they want.

 

[tacollie]

^ https://www.roguewanderers.com/the-build

They have traveled 55 countries in 85,000 mi and had the similar mechanical issues I had with a stock Tacoma🤔

 

[tacollie]

Plenty of states allow you to legally register your vehicle above the GVWR of the door. Usually requires a commercial registration. It's purely a financial thing. DMV doesn't care about what you're driving down the road as long as you paid them.

It's pretty easy to find specific cases on all the camper forums of people who wrecked their overweight trucks and had insurance cover it. It's easier to find people that have aftermarket bumpers and been denied coverage.

 

[nickw]

Plenty of states allow you to legally register your vehicle above the GVWR of the door. Usually requires a commercial registration. It's purely a financial thing. DMV doesn't care about what you're driving down the road as long as you paid them.

It's pretty easy to find specific cases on all the camper forums of people who wrecked their overweight trucks and had insurance cover it. It's easier to find people that have aftermarket bumpers and been denied coverage.

Details matter - wrecking a truck that is overweight is very different than wrecking a truck because it is overweight.

I'll also add there is a massive difference in liability vs collision, the liability thing is where my major concern would be in an accident if somebody were to ever get hurt.

 

[Alloy]

So wouldn't his truck fall under the red then? That would require the vehicle manuf. unless I am missing something.

Yes, for 3 reasons:
- a Tacoma has a payload sticker (tire size/pressure) which means it's a complete vehicle.
- if a company is registered as a vehicle (DOT) up-fitter the company can purchase vehicles direct from the mfg. Similar to a dealer. To be registered requires the purchase/stocking of 100's of vehicles.
- if this was legit then mechanics in Pennsylvania could make a fortune signing the paper giving every Tacoma a 7200lb GVWR or better yet 10,000lb GVWR.
-

 

[nickw]

Yes, for 3 reasons:
- a Tacoma has a payload sticker (tire size/pressure) which means it's a complete vehicle.
- if a company is registered as a vehicle (DOT) up-fitter the company can purchase vehicles direct from the mfg. Similar to a dealer. To be registered requires the purchase/stocking of 100's of vehicles.
- if this was legit then mechanics in Pennsylvania could make a fortune signing the paper giving every Tacoma a 7200lb GVWR or better yet 10,000lb GVWR.
-

It's effectively a legal loophole then.

 

[rruff]

Details matter - wrecking a truck that is overweight is very different than wrecking a truck because it is overweight.

I'd like to see your examples of "wrecking a truck because it is overweight". I can't think of any...

 

[nickw]

I'd like to see your examples of "wrecking a truck because it is overweight". I can't think of any...

You think it never happens? It's just logic and a matter cause - effect, getting into an accident with no fault of your own is different that getting into an accident because you couldn't brake quick enough since your truck was overloaded. Did a quick google search and this is the first one that came up with some comments in red:

RV Accidents and Statistics

Some bold words on the use of the weight distribution system along with air springs when towing conventional trailers.

fifthwheelst.com

Most common causes of RV accidents​

Although some of these common causes of RV accidents overlap with causes of car accidents, they are exacerbated in an RV where sheer size plus reduced visibility and maneuverability increase the risk factors for a crash.

• Inexperienced drivers
• Senior drivers
• Speeding
• High winds
• Overtired drivers - very common among many people here
• Overloading the RV with too much weight - to the point
• Runaway trailers
• Rollover caused by higher center of gravity - definately an issue with tires + lift + heavier camper
• Poorly calculated turns
• Miscalculated stopping distances (heavy vehicles require longer stopping distances) - big issue with overloading, I had this issue with a trailer, mountains of ID, well below my towing capacity.
• Poorly balanced loads - indirect issue with overloading
• Failing to see another vehicle in the lane beside the RV due to a blind spot