The importance of a rear dust light in the southwest.

[pappawheely]

I am familiar with both offroad racing and your basic 4 wheel drive offroad travel. One thing that some 4x4 owners don't understand is 2wd prerunners. In deep sand like some sections of the mojave road, you need to keep your momentum so you don't get stuck. I was following a bunch of jeeps at koh one time when they just stopped in front of me. As I downshifted, pitched my 2wd prerunner sideways, and buried the throttle, they all just stared at me and thought I was some kind of jack azz. They think it's cool to crawl everything in compound low. That doesn't work for 2wd. It's not wise to follow 4x4's in the sand at any speed. The more visible you are in the dust, the better the vehicle behind can judge your speed and avoid a collision. That's why desert racing adopted the "dust light"

 

[MagicMtnDan]

That's why desert racing adopted the AMBER "dust light"

Fixed it for ya

 

[Webfoot]

One thing that some 4x4 owners don't understand is 2wd prerunners. In deep sand like some sections of the mojave road, you need to keep your momentum so you don't get stuck. I was following a bunch of jeeps at koh one time when they just stopped in front of me. ... They think it's cool to crawl everything in compound low. That doesn't work for 2wd.

At risk of coming across as a ************** myself: in that case maybe people shouldn't be running 2WD trucks on public roads/paths of that condition. The way it is being described, in addition to the earlier claim that the suspension (on some of these trucks) is out of control unless driven fast, sounds like trying to run a race car on the highway and then saying you have to go 150 MPH to generate enough downforce and keep the brakes hot or you'll fly off the road.

 

[Pilat]

At risk of coming across as a ************** myself: in that case maybe people shouldn't be running 2WD trucks on public roads/paths of that condition. The way it is being described, in addition to the earlier claim that the suspension (on some of these trucks) is out of control unless driven fast, sounds like trying to run a race car on the highway and then saying you have to go 150 MPH to generate enough downforce and keep the brakes hot or you'll fly off the road.

Where's the frigging "like" button!

In other words, I wholeheartedly agree.

 

[HOOLIGAN]

OCD Overlands post is spot on with the exception of red light vs amber light visibility. Most research I've done states amber is more visible to the human eye than red. This is why we have been putting more amber on the rear of our ambulances and firetrucks. There was even one study that showed drunk drivers have a tendency to steer towards red lights, but that stuff is neither here nor there. A single solid red light is the way to go for giving vehicles advanced warning in foggy, blizzard conditions on the road. Amber would be best if off-road and in dusty conditions.


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[proper4wd]

At risk of coming across as a ************** myself: in that case maybe people shouldn't be running 2WD trucks on public roads/paths of that condition. The way it is being described, in addition to the earlier claim that the suspension (on some of these trucks) is out of control unless driven fast, sounds like trying to run a race car on the highway and then saying you have to go 150 MPH to generate enough downforce and keep the brakes hot or you'll fly off the road.

Have you ever ridden a motorcycle across difficult terrain? The same physics apply. Certainly you wouldnt suggest that dual sport bikes dont belong in the back country. And, you probably understand that riding a moto across sand or rough terrain requires momentum and the right line - so you'd probably have no issue letting them pass. (Hopefully they saw your dust light and could gauge where you where in your dust cloud so they didnt crash into you). Why the prejudice against 2WD prerunner type trucks?

 

[ducktapeguy]

I am familiar with both offroad racing and your basic 4 wheel drive offroad travel. One thing that some 4x4 owners don't understand is 2wd prerunners. In deep sand like some sections of the mojave road, you need to keep your momentum so you don't get stuck. I was following a bunch of jeeps at koh one time when they just stopped in front of me. As I downshifted, pitched my 2wd prerunner sideways, and buried the throttle, they all just stared at me and thought I was some kind of jack azz. They think it's cool to crawl everything in compound low. That doesn't work for 2wd. It's not wise to follow 4x4's in the sand at any speed. The more visible you are in the dust, the better the vehicle behind can judge your speed and avoid a collision. That's why desert racing adopted the "dust light"

At risk of coming across as a ************** myself: in that case maybe people shouldn't be running 2WD trucks on public roads/paths of that condition. The way it is being described, in addition to the earlier claim that the suspension (on some of these trucks) is out of control unless driven fast, sounds like trying to run a race car on the highway and then saying you have to go 150 MPH to generate enough downforce and keep the brakes hot or you'll fly off the road.

It's almost like Webfoot read my mind and posted what I was thinking.

If you are familiar with basic 4wd off road travel, then you should also understand that some vehicles with short wheelbase and high center of gravity (which is almost all jeeps) either can't safely travel at high speeds on some of these roads, or the drivers aren't comfortable doing it. So it's not like they think they're cool doing everything slowly, that's just the safest way to travel.

I understand the whole need to travel fast in racing and certain conditions, and if you're alone with nobody around I'd say do whatever you want. But the whole argument about having to travel fast on a public road is pointless. Because it's not a race, the other people driving out there aren't in a race, and a public road in the desert isn't a racetrack. If you want to race, there are designated races like KOH or Baja where you can do that all day long and nobody would complain.

You know how after every Fast and Furious movie comes out, every guy with a riced out civic with a spoiler and an exhaust is now weaving through cars on the freeway and trying to drift around corners like they're Vin Diesel. They've even closed down places like GMR because every weekend people were driving their cars off the canyon roads like lemmings. I'm sure you know what most people think about those ricers. Well, to put this in perspective, the wannabe BJ baldwins in the fake trophy trucks are the desert equivalent of those guys.

 

[FJOE]

You know how after every Fast and Furious movie comes out, every guy with a riced out civic with a spoiler and an exhaust is now weaving through cars on the freeway and trying to drift around corners like they're Vin Diesel. They've even closed down places like GMR because every weekend people were driving their cars off the canyon roads like lemmings. I'm sure you know what most people think about those ricers. Well, to put this in perspective, the wannabe BJ baldwins in the fake trophy trucks are the desert equivalent of those guys.

+1

 

[kmlacroix]

I was always taught the best, most skilled driver knows how to modify driving behavior base on the situation.

 

[Hltoppr]

Having just done a Laguna Salada route in Baja, and the Mojave Road in California...and seeing how useful dust lights are...I'll be adding one to my truck.

-H-

 

[Webfoot]

Have you ever ridden a motorcycle across difficult terrain? The same physics apply. Certainly you wouldnt suggest that dual sport bikes dont belong in the back country. And, you probably understand that riding a moto across sand or rough terrain requires momentum and the right line - so you'd probably have no issue letting them pass. (Hopefully they saw your dust light and could gauge where you where in your dust cloud so they didnt crash into you). Why the prejudice against 2WD prerunner type trucks?

The two wheel conveyances I've ridden were powered by my own legs. I have (had) no prejudice against any kind of vehicle. I think I am a courteous driver. I try to be the first to pull off a one lane road, I wait for and defer to cyclists since I know how vulnerable they are, etc. When I was in the dunes last summer I did my best not to block the buggies, ATVs and bikes with my slow moving slow turning SUV.

If nine out of ten vehicles on these dirt roads are "prerunners" and motorcycles then perhaps it's the slow 4x4s that don't belong there. Otherwise it seems to me that prima facie it is a shared-use road, and that demands that all users drive in a safe and responsible manner.

Several people seem to be describing a vehicle that is unsuitable for a shared road, one that expressly prevents the kind of courtesy I hope I exhibit if not being outright unsafe. I have no experience with this as I have never driven a "prerunner" truck nor have I had problems with anyone driving one. If a road is really dusty I wait for the dust from others to settle before I continue. If I see someone coming up behind me I look for a safe place to pull off and make use of it, then wait for the dust to settle. I don't expect to have a truck, bike, or anything else barrel through my own dust cloud as I would never do that myself; to do so seems totally reckless.

 

[lugueto]

Wow this thread has picked up.

If one or the other vehicle has to move out of the way, it doesn't mean the other one shouldn't slow down or drive cautiously before they're given way.

I think prerunners and high speed off road vehicles will be condemned to closed tracks if this gets out of hand. Stadium truck kind of stuff..

I love the Fast and the Furious vs. BJ Baldwin wannabe comparison. I think its pretty accurate.

I'm not one to drive like an 80 year old blind lady driving a semi truck, I do travel at 50-60mph in gravel roads and double tracks if I feel its safe. But if there are other vehicles on the road (aside from my tight knit strongly communicated convoy) we slow way down. Its the logical thing to do, regardless of the type of vehicle you drive..

 

[Clutch]

This thread has more looking a lights on the back of vehicles now...and road side flashers. Some of the stop signs out in the country have flashing red lights, while some major cross roads have yellow flashers.

Might be my eyes, but I can see the yellow...errr amber better.

Noticed the school buses have a white strobe on their roof. Can see that a ways off. Though the roadside assistance vehicles have amber strobes, can see those even better. Someone mentioned about hanging a solid bright red light low and to the left off the vehicle. We just had a couple snow storms blow through...even tail lights were getting obscured with snow. Would imagine a light hung below the bumper would get fairly dirty/snow covered...so have it on top of the vehicle? do both?

 

[kmlacroix]

Regardless of lighting, drivers need not be going faster than they can stop safely.

 

[Sparse Gray Hackle]

On public trails in ohv areas, there are no speed limits. In rough sections, more capable vehicles MUST keep speed up in order to smooth out the ride. It's how high dollar suspension systems work, going to slow could cause a the vehicle to lose control.

Growing up in the desert it's always been common knowledge that the faster trucks have right of way and your *** will get nerfed(rear run into to let you know a faster truck is behind you) if you don't get out of the way.

It's only recently where people have started taking their stock vehicles onto trails previously only used by off-roaders. And I believe that public land is for everyone to enjoy, and in order to do that safely, people need a dust light.




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That's asinine! It's time to grow up Sparky!