The Status of Overlanding Today

[Oscar Mike Gulf Yankee]

You mean like this?

UNICAT Expedition Vehicle MD83H MAN TGS 33.540 6X6 - YouTube

Or, more like this-

Exceptional Engineering | Offroad Caravan Monsters | Free Documentary - YouTube

Seriously, 2 bedroom, 2 bath....begins to sound like an ad for an apartment!

So when that thing rolls across Africa, I wonder what that starving kid thinks when he sees it?

But, I too am guilty of considering building a larger voyager for land travels. So, the outlook for growth in this industry is pretty good, economic fluctuations won't matter that much.

However, what is coming can be a concern for full timers. Seems the National Park Service is adopting new regulations about full timers, saying that those living in or out of vehicles is "homesteading" on public lands.

You need to say you're camping on vacation like camping.
Be prepared to give a hard home address, 1234 Kings St, Alover, Ca. (might be good to take some mail addressed to you with an address. Might need to convince them you're just camping by telling them where you have been and where you are headed.

Mention this because the next big hill in overlanding will most likely come from politicians through restrictive laws. Fact is, those politicians who talk about freedoms are actually the ones trying to restrict them keeping an eye on everyone, reminds me of the song: Signs, signs, everywhere are signs, do this, don't do that, can't you read the sign? It's like that!

 

[MOAK]

Wow! This is a really old thread, however I usually have a penny or two to throw around. I don’t go to expos. Too many people, too many vendors, and why should I pay big bucks to attend? I’ve been piecing together our set up for over 25 years and recently, two years ago, purchased a new tent & shower stall. Beyond that, the rest of our stuff is an average 10-12 years old. I’m also a member of another forum that boasts membership of over 40,000. Interestingly when we are touring the remote areas of the western US, we have yet to encounter any of that membership, even on a trail as popular as the Rim Rocker. The term “overlanding” or “overlander” here in the US, has become meaningless, other than a marketing ploy used by the industry to sell cool stuff to folks that have expendable income in order to make a fashion statement. The positive side of this cultural phenomena? There still aren’t a lot of “overlanders” exploring remote regions, thankfully, and because of mass marketing schemes the cost of top shelf equipment has stabilized. Just my two & 1/2 cents, eh?

 

[Av8Chuck]

People (especially on the internet) have a compulsive need to categorize. It kinda drives a lot of the problems in the US today. Regardless, folks tend to get up in arms when something doesn't fit in their silo of what they consider to be "Overlanding." Several others have pointed out already that there seems to be no generally accepted definition of it other than vehicle-dependent travel (generally speaking), which is a mighty broad definition.

People online also feel the need to complain which just might be part of the process of making others fit their definitions. I agree, there's way too much of that today. I'm not sure I'm disagreeing but I don't like to define overlanding based on the vehicle. My wife horse camps. They either decide on a location to basecamp or a distance to travel, which can be 100 miles or so in the High Sierras. When they basecamp they arrive at the location, sometimes has internet/cell, hot shower and is well stocked with food, so it's more like horse camping. When they travel a distance they have to pack everything in and out. The commitment is very different, the latter is more of a lifestyle taking months of planning, preparedness and training. Also, it changes with age, now days its more basecamping than adventuring.

So in keeping with the theme, I'd like to see people use their rigs for more than just driveway showcasing, but I have no issue with showing them off. I like to see build threads. I like them better when they are followed by trip reports and aren't made up completely of pictures taken in the 4 Wheel Parts service bays. I'm a "built, not bought" kind of guy, though I get that not everyone is or can be. I feel like you can't really "Overland" if you don't know how to work on your rig. You might as well just book a tour with someone else. You certainly can't engage in this hobby cost effectively if you can't work your rig yourself.

I think most people probably want to use their rigs more but they aren't willing to go much beyond the safety of their driveways. To your point, forums almostly exclusively talk about the vehicle but not how to learn it, use it and repair it in the middle of nowhere. Some 4X4 clubs where a bridge to this lifestyle because people actually went places with the club and you learned first hand what it was about. You broke things, you figured out how to recover the vehicle and get home, in no small measure because of the safety of the club. Often people would go on adventures with other members of the club not to go four wheeling but to go four wheeling somewhere for camping, fishing, hunting. The vehicle is simply the enabling technology, it's the application of the vehicle that defines overlanding. I don't think it matters whether the vehicle is a 4X4, RV, car, or horse.

I mean to each their own, but I'd love to see some folks getting up into the back country to camp, or fly fish with their rigs. I love seeing creative solutions to cooking and sleeping in vehicles. I know the purchased mods keep suppliers in business, and I know that's the bulk of the profitable business for a lot of shops. I just really enjoy creative solutions, and kind of miss seeing them here and elsewhere in lieu of the big dollar parking lot threads.

I think part of the challenge is that much of the idea of overlanding is being driven online. You can certainly find a lot of inspiration for overlanding online but something is stripped away by electronic technologies. You can't experience this lifestyle vicariously through Youtube. There are a ton of good online tutorials on how to bolt on an accessory but few that impart the wisdom on how to use it when your life might depend on it. Ninety percent of the internet focuses on the how to do anything but only ten percent focuses on why you would want to do it in the first place. This has created a society where everyone knows how to do everything but very few have actually done anything. In large part this is why all forums talk about the same things the same way and when you attend an expo they're all selling the same things.


My wife and I have been to quite a few Overland Expo's to talk to vendors and customers about the things their selling and buying. Its a great way to get a sense of where people think this industry is. Much of the hype you see at a tradeshow doesn't match the reality of what's going on in the world. That gap in perception is mostly filled with mediocrity, a lack of innovation. The innovation will come from the people who are living this lifestyle, after all, they are the ones qualified to generate the requirements. This video just shows a bit what its like to attend the Expo. No real point to it.

So back to the challenge, this is why I think it's important to define what overlanding means to people. If there's a definition people agree on then we can elevate the conversation to talk about the requirements for making the lifestyle better and away from "which should I get, 37" or 40" tires?"

 

[AbleGuy]

⬆ “I think most people probably want to use their rigs more but they aren't willing to go much beyond the safety of their driveways. To your point, forums almostly exclusively talk about the vehicle but not how to learn it, use it and repair it in the middle of nowhere.”

Once upon a time we always made sure our gear list included a Chilton’s (remember these?), plus basic tools and spare parts and successfully dealt with broken shocks and exhaust mounts, bad alternators and fuel filters, failed master cylinder, busted hoses and belts…

But these days with the complexity of current rigs, I don’t think I could do much emergency repairs work on a broken down rig.

 

[Jupiter58]

I think what separates overlanding is that the destination and or journey is to a remote location.

 

[Dirt Rider]

bought an old truck and old camper and feel like I am missing nothing, great joy in fixing it up and keeping it running, adding bling only as needed.

 

[calicamper]

You mean like this?

UNICAT Expedition Vehicle MD83H MAN TGS 33.540 6X6 - YouTube

Or, more like this-

Exceptional Engineering | Offroad Caravan Monsters | Free Documentary - YouTube

Seriously, 2 bedroom, 2 bath....begins to sound like an ad for an apartment!

So when that thing rolls across Africa, I wonder what that starving kid thinks when he sees it?

But, I too am guilty of considering building a larger voyager for land travels. So, the outlook for growth in this industry is pretty good, economic fluctuations won't matter that much.

However, what is coming can be a concern for full timers. Seems the National Park Service is adopting new regulations about full timers, saying that those living in or out of vehicles is "homesteading" on public lands.

You need to say you're camping on vacation like camping.
Be prepared to give a hard home address, 1234 Kings St, Alover, Ca. (might be good to take some mail addressed to you with an address. Might need to convince them you're just camping by telling them where you have been and where you are headed.

Mention this because the next big hill in overlanding will most likely come from politicians through restrictive laws. Fact is, those politicians who talk about freedoms are actually the ones trying to restrict them keeping an eye on everyone, reminds me of the song: Signs, signs, everywhere are signs, do this, don't do that, can't you read the sign? It's like that!

This is an issue even in popular campgrounds near urban areas. Friends scored a rare site in a popular CA Coastal campground. While there they noticed several “campers” who had been in their site for an obvious extended period move two sites over. On the way out they asked a host whom they befriended after discovering he was an old family friend. He explained that those long term “campers” book sites for the max allowed length of time under different names and typically stay for nearly a month then move to various streets where vehicle dwellers live etc. He said its a big issue given people just looking to vacation for a few days can’t get in given the sites are booked up by homeless vehicle dwellers

 

[Av8Chuck]

⬆ Once upon a time we always made sure our gear list included a Chilton’s, plus basic tools and spare parts and successfully dealt with broken shocks and exhaust mounts, bad alternators and fuel filters, failed master cylinder, busted hoses and belts…

But these days with the complexity of current rigs, I don’t think I could do much emergency repairs work on a broken down rig.

I went to a family reunion where my father and brother in-laws, both with their PhD's, proceeded to tell everyone how much smarter this generation is compared to their grandfathers. They used current day cars as an example. There weren't repair stations and dealerships in every town like there is now so he had to know everything about how a car worked. Doesn't mean he could repair every problem but he had to figure out a workaround to get back on the road. I had several choice things to say to them. About eight of us were leaving including my father and brother in-laws, my brother in-law couldn't open his rental car. He proudly exclaimed that he figured out the battery in the key fob was dead and was about to call the rental agency.

I snatched the keys from his hand, flipped out the key from the fob, inserted into the lock and opened the door. As I tossed the keys back to him I pointed out that he solved the wrong problem. Figuring out that the key fob didn't work didn't get him back on the road, figuring out how to use a key in a keyless entry did. I couldn't resist, I told him I'm pretty sure his grandfather would have figured this out. He was pissed and that was the last family reunion I attended.

There are lots of things that I know I couldn't repair but a basic understanding and some common sense can go a long way for being prepared and keeping yourself safe. There are a lot of Van-lifers and overlanders who can't put a chain back on a bicycle. For them (and my brother-in-law) a fool and his money is soon parted...

 

[Oscar Mike Gulf Yankee]

@Cali Camper thanks, out west it's almost a different country compared to the heartland. After 9/11 much changed under the Patriot Act. Here, the City required non-profits assisting the homeless to register personal information about their clients, basically like a hotel registry to be reported to the police department. They refused to do so saying they would not be part of any police registry. Recently, a similar ordinance was passed requiring information on all "campers" in any campground. We will comply at our American Legion Post site, but we don't like it.

@Jupiter58 if there are thousands of people crawling over an unimproved area is it "remote"?

@Av8Chuck good points, I noticed when you mentioned "when your life depends on it". It reminded me of a guy saying that at the last MOORE Expo here talking about recovery equipment. That phrase seems to add a bit of excitement to this pastime, as if we in CONUS are in the remote jungles of Africa or South America. I think my life is at greater risk on pavement, especially in Texas, with pot shots fired and idiot drivers on cell phones.

Speaking of bicycle chains, I noticed in Wal Mart they had a ten speed with the chain threaded through the derailer the wrong way! I probably know more than 20 Phd's lacking common sense; much of that comes from the lack of exposure to life's experiences.

You do have safety in numbers when traveling but I'm not too concerned going anywhere in the States if you're half azz prepared, water, some food and a few tools and having a cell phone along with various radios. I just don't see my life being in danger being stranded due to a breakdown or being stuck.

@Dirt Rider Nice rig! And, you can take your bike! If your truck breaks down you can go get parts, or a tow.

@AbleGuy If our Jeep Cherokee breaks down, excepting the obvious, I won't attempt to wrench on it. It, like all other late model vehicles, are designed not to be worked on by owners. I'll be traveling this weekend and the A/C works well on the Jeep, the concern is 102+ degree heat. The heat on Texas blacktop could easily be 110 degrees, I don't think I've ever driven any vehicle in heat like that. My concern will be heat related injuries to my vehicle. I'll take 7 gallons of water with me.

Which brings me to an observation: Gaining interest in overlanding I've concluded that I should take additional water on a long trip in the Cherokee during very hot weather. Back in the day I would have taken off in any of my cars which were more prone to overheat on such a trip without any concerns. Even an old dog can learn new tricks. So, thanks to EP, if I do have any issues in this weather, I'll be better prepared.

 

[calicamper]

Europe is older than the US and I see the policy around “camping” vs homeless migration in that direction. Very strict vehicle over night parking, strict sleeping in vehicle regulations, shuttered Public lands to vehicle access etc. When a sub population of people basically abuse the freedom’s of “public” parking and “Public” lands by over staying or using it as low cost housing then eventually society gets fed up with the cost’s of regulating those who can’t self regulate and we simply shut it down completely.

Public lands, camp grounds, streets etc are not Public housing. But we most definitely have a population of people who abuse this and will eventually reach the point we simply take a zero vehicle policy.

Eastern Oregon locals just did a big BLM land clean up the amount of trash and burned out dumped vehicles was just stupid. The locals are getting fed up with it and do see the future is likely restricted access if the issue isn’t corrected.

Whats the fix? No doubt small affordable, safe, clean, fixed housing!! If 1000’s of people can live in squalor and junked vehicles with no utilities/ or services. Then they can easily have improved living conditions in small efficient low cost fixed location pod housing groups close to services etc. A person who has limited ability to house them selves, can’t afford and don’t need tons of collected junk. (That is definitely a mental factor in having nothing- so many collect stuff thinking they’ll need it) Mental health services, life coaching, financial services, law services, health services all need to be hand holding on site for a large portion of this population or they revert back to being off grid costly impacts on society and public lands.

 

[AbleGuy]

When a sub population of people basically abuse the freedom’s of “public” parking and “Public” lands by over staying or using it as low cost housing then eventually society gets fed…and we simply shut it down completely. …we…will eventually reach the point we simply take a zero vehicle polic. ...the future is likely restricted access if the issue isn’t corrected.”

Sadly, you’re likely right on all counts.

So yeah, welcome to the predictable expansion of the poorly thought out, lazy, “Lowest Common Denominator” strategy of Public Lands Management, guaranteed to make everyone unhappy. ?

Plan accordingly…

 

[calicamper]

When a sub population of people basically abuse the freedom’s of “public” parking and “Public” lands by over staying or using it as low cost housing then eventually society gets fed…and we simply shut it down completely. …we…will eventually reach the point we simply take a zero vehicle polic. ...the future is likely restricted access if the issue isn’t corrected.”

Sadly, you’re likely right on all counts.

Yeah, so welcome to the predictable expansion of the poorly thought out, lazy, “Lowest Common Denominator” strategy of Public Lands Management. ?

Plan accordingly…

Out west you will see more and more locals supporting even requesting the closure to vehicles as we see more burned out neighborhoods due to wild fires started by homeless living on public lands.
You cannot wring money out of people with no money so when they start fires living where they shouldn’t and housed people loose their homes, its a cost that even Red Blooded Conservatives will not tolerate.

 

[AbleGuy]

⬆ Recent tp burning, destructive wildfire on the outskirts of Flagstaff AZ, for example?

The more frequently chosen LCD results? In the height of summer, more and more, total closures of USFS lands.

 

[calicamper]

⬆ Recent tp burning, destructive wildfire on the outskirts of Flagstaff AZ, for example?

The more frequently chosen LCD results? In the height of summer, more and more, total closures of USFS lands.

We have had a couple of vehicle dweller on public land fires out west recently. Today in the news s central zone state had several homes damage and burned by a fire set in a homeless encampment next door. Within a few hours the large city sent in law enforcement and crew to clear it out.

The larger issue here is this 1000% is a threat to public use of public lands. There is no argument that we have a big population of people who are not capable of unsupervised/managed living. Normal healthy people don’t live and dump trash on public land. Those who live near these beautiful places and use them yr around know just how bad this issue has become and the serious ramifications it has on future access and use if solutions aren’t found sooner than later.

Sorta a micro case are 100’s of old Abalone divers along the west coast that have loosely organized and worked with law enforcement to identify, track and ultimately bust huge smuggling rings that are literally strip mining natural public resources for huge profits. If the legal users don’t get involved they would no longer have a Abalone season to participate in at all.

Groups and organizations like EP need to pick a cause and help or sooner than later we’ll all be fenced out.

 

[RiverCityDave]

bought an old truck and old camper and feel like I am missing nothing, great joy in fixing it up and keeping it running, adding bling only as needed.

View attachment 732592

ooooooooh I LOVE this beauty. Hope you’re out somewhere having fun in it right now. ??