calicamper
Expedition Leader
Thats why you rent them for $114 a night when you want one. Then drop it off and it’s someone else’s storage problem. ?
Only RV like things to own are the small ones that fit in a standard garage.
The truth about most RV's.
- Thread starter Teardropper
- Start date
Only RV like things to own are the small ones that fit in a standard garage.
Martinjmpr
Wiffleball Batter
Yep, this right here. Overall quality control in the RV industry is hit-or-miss, but a big part of that is that "FEATURES" are something you can point to and say "look at this!" but QUALITY is something you really can't.
If Manufacturer A makes a high quality travel trailer and sells it for $25,000, then manufacturer B will just come along, cut corners and sell a cheaper version for $15,000 and eat Manufacturer A's lunch.
Sad to say, but RV's are becoming more and more popular and the RV makers will not up their quality game until and unless we, the customers, demand it.
However, these problems are so endemic that even paying a high price is no guarantee of "quality." Go on the web sites dedicated to Airstreams or Prevost motor homes and you'll see that even customers who pay upwards of $100k for a travel trailer or $400k for a motor home still complain about poor craftsmanship.
Martinjmpr
Wiffleball Batter
Our Forest River R-Pod has been an excellent trailer for the past two years. No major issues whatsoever.
However, you can see evidence of sloppiness, cut corners and a general lack of quality craftsmanship all over the trailer.
We knew what we were getting into, so we weren't disappointed. As is almost always the case in life, the key to happiness is to have realistic expectations.
We weren't expecting automotive-level craftsmanship in our trailer so we weren't disappointed.
It might make a difference that our R-Pod is a Hood River edition, built in their smaller Oregon factory rather than in the bigger Indiana factory. Or it may be that we just got lucky and ours had no major problems.
We also bought ours gently used from a couple who bought it new and used it 3 times before they decided they needed something bigger. That saved us about $4000 right off the top, and as a bonus, the previous owners had "upgraded" some of the things in the trailer (added a 2nd battery and propane tank, and a sewer hose carrier.)
However, you can see evidence of sloppiness, cut corners and a general lack of quality craftsmanship all over the trailer.
We knew what we were getting into, so we weren't disappointed. As is almost always the case in life, the key to happiness is to have realistic expectations.
We weren't expecting automotive-level craftsmanship in our trailer so we weren't disappointed.
It might make a difference that our R-Pod is a Hood River edition, built in their smaller Oregon factory rather than in the bigger Indiana factory. Or it may be that we just got lucky and ours had no major problems.
We also bought ours gently used from a couple who bought it new and used it 3 times before they decided they needed something bigger. That saved us about $4000 right off the top, and as a bonus, the previous owners had "upgraded" some of the things in the trailer (added a 2nd battery and propane tank, and a sewer hose carrier.)
luthj
Engineer In Residence
Most consumers are not looking very far ahead. How many only consider the monthly payment, not the whole cost outlay? Part of the reason for the crap, is that there is no warranty requirements, and consumers are on their own in many cases. The comparison to homes is more apt than many give it credit for. I have worked on (and lived in) a number of homes that were shoddily built, but sold for good money. In almost all cases they were build in areas with minimal or no building inspections, and owners had minimal legal recourse other than suing taking civil action.
Martinjmpr
Wiffleball Batter
As for Camping World, they have an interesting business model. From what I've read, they make an enormous amount of their money off of "the back end", i.e. financing and extended warranties.
The Intertoobz are full of CW horror stories. It almost seems as if every CW franchise owner's business philosophy is "screw the customer as hard as you can because you'll only get one chance."
The Intertoobz are full of CW horror stories. It almost seems as if every CW franchise owner's business philosophy is "screw the customer as hard as you can because you'll only get one chance."
old_CWO
Well-known member
This simple economic law is definitely a root cause. The market is full of high priced junk because consumers are obviously willing to buy said junk. Easy lending terms on RVs sure don't help as it acts as an inflationary force (the standard situation of too many dollars chasing too few goods) driving up prices.
Now if you're the guy making a living selling the trailer, none of this is likely to seem problematic so it's all a matter of perspective I guess.
As always, Caveat Emptor.
Martinjmpr
Wiffleball Batter
RV sales are in a bit of a boom right now. That's good news for the RV industry and bad news for RV owners, because it incentivizes RV makers to slap 'em together quick and cheap and get them out the door.
Right now being an RV maker is like having a license to print money. It's similar to the situation that Harley Davidson found itself in during the "motorcycle boom" of the mid 90's to the mid 2000's. They can't make them fast enough and they are flying off the lots, with "easy credit" making them affordable to anyone with a job.
Even worse, the cynical RV manufacturing world knows that a significant percentage (my seat-of-the-pants guess would say close to 50%) of RVs are sold to people who dream of RV ownership but don't like the reality so they rarely (or never) use them.
IOW, RV makers know that a good percentage of the trailers they sell will either NEVER be used during the typically short warranty period, or if they are used they'll be used once or twice.
Since the manufacturer is not on the hook to repair them once the trailers are OOW, there is little incentive to make them better.
Case in point: in our camping group, there is an older lady - in her late 60's I think - who likes the IDEA of RV camping a lot more than she likes actually camping. Three years ago she bought a gorgeous (and HUGE) dual axle travel trailer.
Yes, 3 years ago she bought it. She took it camping with us for the first time - about a month ago. Now it's up for sale because it's too difficult for her to back up and to drive with. She literally has never hooked the trailer up to her vehicle, what she does is when she needs it hooked up she asks a neighbor near her home to do it for her. She stayed hooked up when camping and when she got home she asked her neighbor to unhook it for her (it has a weight distributing hitch because it's big - probably 5000# or more.)
So, when will this end? IMO it ends when enough RV buyers get pissed off and swear off RVs entirely, OR when the next economic downturn hits and people no longer have easy credit and disposable income for toys. At the point when the RV business actually gets COMPETITIVE, we will start seeing better warranties, better service departments, and companies competing with each other on the basis of quality rather than just "features."
But until that happens, expect quality to drop even further as the RV makers ramp up production to meet the demand.
Right now being an RV maker is like having a license to print money. It's similar to the situation that Harley Davidson found itself in during the "motorcycle boom" of the mid 90's to the mid 2000's. They can't make them fast enough and they are flying off the lots, with "easy credit" making them affordable to anyone with a job.
Even worse, the cynical RV manufacturing world knows that a significant percentage (my seat-of-the-pants guess would say close to 50%) of RVs are sold to people who dream of RV ownership but don't like the reality so they rarely (or never) use them.
IOW, RV makers know that a good percentage of the trailers they sell will either NEVER be used during the typically short warranty period, or if they are used they'll be used once or twice.
Since the manufacturer is not on the hook to repair them once the trailers are OOW, there is little incentive to make them better.
Case in point: in our camping group, there is an older lady - in her late 60's I think - who likes the IDEA of RV camping a lot more than she likes actually camping. Three years ago she bought a gorgeous (and HUGE) dual axle travel trailer.
Yes, 3 years ago she bought it. She took it camping with us for the first time - about a month ago. Now it's up for sale because it's too difficult for her to back up and to drive with. She literally has never hooked the trailer up to her vehicle, what she does is when she needs it hooked up she asks a neighbor near her home to do it for her. She stayed hooked up when camping and when she got home she asked her neighbor to unhook it for her (it has a weight distributing hitch because it's big - probably 5000# or more.)
So, when will this end? IMO it ends when enough RV buyers get pissed off and swear off RVs entirely, OR when the next economic downturn hits and people no longer have easy credit and disposable income for toys. At the point when the RV business actually gets COMPETITIVE, we will start seeing better warranties, better service departments, and companies competing with each other on the basis of quality rather than just "features."
But until that happens, expect quality to drop even further as the RV makers ramp up production to meet the demand.
shade
Well-known member
Maybe it was unintentional, but I suspect you've hit on a key group. The HD crowd that has tired of playing dress-up like rejects from Cap'n Jack Sparrow's crew to ride 20 miles two weekends a year has moved on to RVs - with similar real world usage.
TripLeader
Explorer
Plywood floors save lives?
Martinjmpr
Wiffleball Batter
There's certainly some crossover between the two, but largely I think it's a different demographic.
From what I've read the recent "RV Boom" not being driven by aging baby boomers (as the HD bubble was) but rather by Gen X'ers and older millennials (people from the age of 30 - 45) who are getting into RV camping for the first time as a way to enjoy the outdoors but still have some of the comforts of home. Or at least, that's the sakes pitch. I think sometimes the reality of dealing with RV's quirks is more than many new owners can handle and so they find excuses to NOT use that RV they are still making payments on.
luthj
Engineer In Residence
another_mike
Adventurer
which technically spans two generations, Gen X'ers and Millenials.... which means it probably just has more to do with people being at an age and in an economic position to have enough money to spend on toys and a willingness to want to get out and glamp.RV Quick Facts
www.rvia.org
Martinjmpr
Wiffleball Batter
Yes, exactly.
WRT baby boomers (full disclosure, I fall into the tail end of the baby boom, born in 1961) and RVs, one thing that many people who have not owned a travel trailer don't realize is that you have to have a certain amount of physical strength to manage a trailer, and as people get older, that becomes more and more difficult.
The act of hooking up, unhooking, winterizing and dewinterizing require at least a moderate amount of physical exertion. Hooking up a trailer in particular requires some strength if you are using a weight distributing hitch (my WDH shank ALONE weighs 50lbs. And that says nothing of the bars which are solid steel and probably 15 - 18lbs each.) Not only does it take some strength it also takes some flexibility - you have to be able to crouch or kneel, turn a crank or operate a drill to raise and lower the jacks, reaching into low spaces to access heater, water pump, etc. As you get older, that stuff gets harder and harder (ask me how I know that!)
Not saying you need to be an athlete, but you can't be an invalid either. IMO when people get to the point where they can no longer manage a trailer, they move to a Class B (van) or Class C (van-based motorhome) because those are easier to operate physically.
vintageracer
To Infinity and Beyond!
Now you know why automotive manufacturers quit using WOOD in construction of their vehicles over 75 years ago!
