Thinking about Trailbalzer

[CrazyDrei]

Two years ago I finished building my 2000 Suburban to be the most perfect daily driver/weekend warrior/family overlander. I love the truck, had an absolute blast building it and 150,000 miles later it's still my daily driver and weekend warrior. It's perfect and I am itching to build another truck for off road adventuring.

I saw a fantastic Trailbalzer build thread in full size trucks and it has evolved over the years to a pretty reliable and capable rig.

Does anyone out there have a Trailblazer, modified or not that is used for "overlanding." Lets see some pictures, and I want to hear about reliability issues or anything else.

I can find a Trailbalzer with reasonable miles for under $2,000 V8 for under $4,000. Can lift it high enough to stick 35s under for under $1,000. So this seems like a fun low budget project to pass the time.

Thank you all in advance.

 

[Martinjmpr]

The Trailblazer was an interesting vehicle. I think the fact that it wasn't successful on the market was largely because it was a victim of poor timing.

By the time the TB was introduced in 2002 or so, manufacturers were moving away from mid-sized BOF SUVs in favor of pickups and unibody crossover vehicles. As a BOF vehicle the TB was much heavier and much thirstier than the competition with their lighter unibody frames and FWD/AWD drivetrains.

AFAIK the TB was the last mid sized SUV to be available with a straight 6. The 4.2 I-6 has a good reputation, I think, but I don't think it was used on many other vehicles.

Don't overlook the GMC Envoy which is the GMC version of the TB. There were also AWD versions sold under the Buick, Oldsmobile, and, weirdly, Saab (when Saab was owned by GM.) I think all of those were AWD/full time 4wd with a single-speed T-case though.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

The Trailblazer was an interesting vehicle. I think the fact that it wasn't successful on the market was largely because it was a victim of poor timing.

By the time the TB was introduced in 2002 or so, manufacturers were moving away from mid-sized BOF SUVs in favor of pickups and unibody crossover vehicles. As a BOF vehicle the TB was much heavier and much thirstier than the competition with their lighter unibody frames and FWD/AWD drivetrains.

AFAIK the TB was the last mid sized SUV to be available with a straight 6. The 4.2 I-6 has a good reputation, I think, but I don't think it was used on many other vehicles.

Don't overlook the GMC Envoy which is the GMC version of the TB. There were also AWD versions sold under the Buick, Oldsmobile, and, weirdly, Saab (when Saab was owned by GM.) I think all of those were AWD/full time 4wd with a single-speed T-case though.

Explorer and Durango were still body on frame SUV's for a long while after that for competition. They both did have V8's, I am not sure the TB ever did in masse (I think there was an SS type thing though)

They were pretty common in my area for awhile, I haven't seen one for awhile though. I can't say as I really watch for them though either.

 

[Todd780]

I think if you pick one up, you should name it Trailbalzer. And get a set of trucknutz for it.

 

[gkieser92]

I had a 2003 Trailblazer, and it was a pretty comfy, roomy (I am 6'5" and had plenty of leg and head room), decent power, and worked great in snow and sand. It had some downsides though. Replacing a head light required removing the grille and is supposedly a dealer-only procedure. It theoretically had a 6,000 lb. towing capacity but the transmission shifting would go crazy even towing my 1,500 lb. popup trailer. Build quality was terrible. In less than 150,000 miles, I had to replace factory radio (under warranty), catalytic converter, muffler, all weatherstripping, windshield seal, liftgate struts (twice), front fender liners, front bumper fascia, both rear window regulators, rear liftgate latch. These didn't get damaged from hard use, they just fell apart. This was on a vehicle that was never off-roaded more than a dirt parking lot and mostly did family hauling duties. The worst thing though was the engine mysteriously dying. Every few weeks it would always happen when exiting a freeway, and the first touch of the accelerator after coming down the offramp, the engine would cut out, with the power steering. It was never diagnosed, despite several trips to the dealership and independent shops.
On the other hand, my in-laws have a 2004 Trailblazer, with no problems. My BIL has an 05 in 2wd and the long wheelbase, and it trucking along at 300,00 miles. With GM it just seems to be a crap shoot. For me, it will be a long time before I trust a GM product again.

 

[CrazyDrei]

The Trailblazer was an interesting vehicle. I think the fact that it wasn't successful on the market was largely because it was a victim of poor timing.

By the time the TB was introduced in 2002 or so, manufacturers were moving away from mid-sized BOF SUVs in favor of pickups and unibody crossover vehicles. As a BOF vehicle the TB was much heavier and much thirstier than the competition with their lighter unibody frames and FWD/AWD drivetrains.

AFAIK the TB was the last mid sized SUV to be available with a straight 6. The 4.2 I-6 has a good reputation, I think, but I don't think it was used on many other vehicles.

Don't overlook the GMC Envoy which is the GMC version of the TB. There were also AWD versions sold under the Buick, Oldsmobile, and, weirdly, Saab (when Saab was owned by GM.) I think all of those were AWD/full time 4wd with a single-speed T-case though.

Martinjmpr,

I have had several friends with TBs over the years, they loved their trucks and drove them for at least a decade before trading them in for a unibody crossover, and I have never heard anyone having any problems with them.

I am no stranger to unique, odd and unpopular vehicles as you have seen with my Suburban build. I saw an 04 TB in full size forum thats sitting on 35s and has that classic look of a 90s Nissan Patrol.

One of the main reasons I am thinking about it is the fact that it is a body on frame design, and even though it weighs more than unibody I can do more fun things with it.

 

[CrazyDrei]

Explorer and Durango were still body on frame SUV's for a long while after that for competition. They both did have V8's, I am not sure the TB ever did in masse (I think there was an SS type thing though)

They were pretty common in my area for awhile, I haven't seen one for awhile though. I can't say as I really watch for them though either.

85_Ranger4x4,

Yes Trailblazer did come with V8 in regular TB as well as in the SS. I have looked at both Durango and Explorer however I have the tools and electronics to work on GMs in my garage and don't particularly want to get Ford or Dodge specific tools. I have also really liked seeing Explorers out on trails.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

85_Ranger4x4,

Yes Trailblazer did come with V8 in regular TB as well as in the SS. I have looked at both Durango and Explorer however I have the tools and electronics to work on GMs in my garage and don't particularly want to get Ford or Dodge specific tools. I have also really liked seeing Explorers out on trails.

4dr Explorers went IRS in '02, IMO that kinda killed them for offroad. The 2dr kept the solid rear awhile longer. My dream rig would be a 91-94 Explorer but that is neither here nor there.

I just use a wireless OBDII adaptor and Forscan (free) on my laptop for my stuff that is new enough to need the fancy computer wizardry.

 

[CrazyDrei]

I had a 2003 Trailblazer, and it was a pretty comfy, roomy (I am 6'5" and had plenty of leg and head room), decent power, and worked great in snow and sand. It had some downsides though. Replacing a head light required removing the grille and is supposedly a dealer-only procedure. It theoretically had a 6,000 lb. towing capacity but the transmission shifting would go crazy even towing my 1,500 lb. popup trailer. Build quality was terrible. In less than 150,000 miles, I had to replace factory radio (under warranty), catalytic converter, muffler, all weatherstripping, windshield seal, liftgate struts (twice), front fender liners, front bumper fascia, both rear window regulators, rear liftgate latch. These didn't get damaged from hard use, they just fell apart. This was on a vehicle that was never off-roaded more than a dirt parking lot and mostly did family hauling duties. The worst thing though was the engine mysteriously dying. Every few weeks it would always happen when exiting a freeway, and the first touch of the accelerator after coming down the offramp, the engine would cut out, with the power steering. It was never diagnosed, despite several trips to the dealership and independent shops.
On the other hand, my in-laws have a 2004 Trailblazer, with no problems. My BIL has an 05 in 2wd and the long wheelbase, and it trucking along at 300,00 miles. With GM it just seems to be a crap shoot. For me, it will be a long time before I trust a GM product again.

gkieser92,

Great insight into the wonderful world of GM. First week I owned my Suburban it just shut down one block away from my house as it shifted into second gear taking off form a light. I rolled it into a parking lot, popped the hood, pretended that I had a clue what I was looking for and magically started 10 minutes later after doing nothing at all and ran problem free for 200,000 miles never shutting down on me again.

Good to hear that the factory transmission tune was horrible, it took me a few months to dial in good shift points and shift pressures in mine and have not complained about it for over two years.

In 2003 GM went from PCM computer to ECU, I personally try to stay away from 03 and 04 GM vehicles. But the problems you have had with yours sounds just as bad as my experience with a 2011 Suburban 2500 which has had plenty of issues and now GM's newest airbag recall.

I am primarily interested in the TB because of body on frame construction, ridiculous ease of interchangeability of parts from other GM vehicles and the fun factor of having no aftermarket support and doing everything yourself.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

ridiculous ease of interchangeability of parts from other GM vehicles and the fun factor of having no aftermarket support and doing everything yourself.

It is downright amazing that some people think of this as a bad thing.

After you do it for awhile you tune in to a bolt on build and it is about as interesting as an episode of "this old house" where they change light bulbs and outlet covers. Everything just clicks together because it was made to... it's like cheating.

 

[CrazyDrei]

4dr Explorers went IRS in '02, IMO that kinda killed them for offroad. The 2dr kept the solid rear awhile longer. My dream rig would be a 91-94 Explorer but that is neither here nor there.

I just use a wireless OBDII adaptor and Forscan (free) on my laptop for my stuff that is new enough to need the fancy computer wizardry.

85_Ranger4x4,

I really like independent suspension for off-road trips. Mostly because of the comfort and increased stability or control for the 99% of driving off-road on dirt trails, washboard and mild to moderate obstacles.

Unfortunately aftermarket parts manufacturers have idealized solid axle as paragon for off-pavement driving however it only excels at that 1% of serious rock crawling cases and does not apply to daily driving or weekend warrior dirt road or washboard adventuring. I was very excited about the Explorer and Expedition IRS and seriously considered getting and Expedition just for the increased comfort and drivability of the IRS. It is still a strong contender once my Suburban dies.

I really like the IFS and 5-link rear axle I have in my Suburban and want to see how it compares in the Trailblazer which is 2,000lbs lighter if I do a similar build: 2" suspension level, 3" body lift, 35s or 37s with lots of sawzall action as well as rear locker.

 

[CrazyDrei]

It is downright amazing that some people think of this as a bad thing.

After you do it for awhile you tune in to a bolt on build and it is about as interesting as an episode of "this old house" where they change light bulbs and outlet covers. Everything just clicks together because it was made to... it's like cheating.

85_Ranger4x4,

I could not agree with you more. I helped a buddy lift his 2019 Jeep Wrangler and it was just as exciting as helping my toddler put together a 20 piece jigsaw puzzle.

 

[85_Ranger4x4]

85_Ranger4x4,

I really like independent suspension for off-road trips. Mostly because of the comfort and increased stability or control for the 99% of driving off-road on dirt trails, washboard and mild to moderate obstacles.

Unfortunately aftermarket parts manufacturers have idealized solid axle as paragon for off-pavement driving however it only excels at that 1% of serious rock crawling cases and does not apply to daily driving or weekend warrior dirt road or washboard adventuring. I was very excited about the Explorer and Expedition IRS and seriously considered getting and Expedition just for the increased comfort and drivability of the IRS. It is still a strong contender once my Suburban dies.

I really like the IFS and 5-link rear axle I have in my Suburban and want to see how it compares in the Trailblazer which is 2,000lbs lighter if I do a similar build: 2" suspension level, 3" body lift, 35s or 37s with lots of sawzall action as well as rear locker.

Mom's '02 had IRS, the entire discombobulated mess of a rear axle/suspension was a joke.

It rode nice when it wasn't broke. PITA to work on (the sealed wheel bearings have to be pressed in an out of the knuckle with a shop press) rear axleshaft leaks, driveshaft vibration, struts broke... on a pavement pounder that usually only carried two people and never saw a trailer. Just yuck.

I don't care about the front (I do like the real wheel bearings and lockouts on my Ranger's IFS) but gimme a solid rear axle any day over an IRS for a truck.

 

[1stDeuce]

Two years ago I finished building my 2000 Suburban to be the most perfect daily driver/weekend warrior/family overlander. I love the truck, had an absolute blast building it and 150,000 miles later it's still my daily driver and weekend warrior. It's perfect and I am itching to build another truck for off road adventuring.

I saw a fantastic Trailbalzer build thread in full size trucks and it has evolved over the years to a pretty reliable and capable rig.

Does anyone out there have a Trailblazer, modified or not that is used for "overlanding." Lets see some pictures, and I want to hear about reliability issues or anything else.

I can find a Trailbalzer with reasonable miles for under $2,000 V8 for under $4,000. Can lift it high enough to stick 35s under for under $1,000. So this seems like a fun low budget project to pass the time.

Thank you all in advance.

I bought the wife a 2006 Envoy off Copart. It needed both driver's side doors, but only had 105k on it. I bought the doors at a local junkyard in the correct color and swapped them out. It still has a dent just beind the new rear door, but we don't much care... Total, I've got about $2200 in it, and she's been driving it for a year now. The I-6 is a smooth engine, and gets around 17-18mpg for us.

Issues: I don't know that anything is "common" for all years... Oh, yes I do. The center console is almost always broken loose. It doesn't like when people shift their weight in the seat by using an arm on the console...

After being mostly trouble free for the first 10k or so that we had it, ours is having a few issues with the cold weather... I imagine most of them may be due to the year it sat on the copart lot waiting to be processed... I just replaced the AIR solenoid, which was not sealing after being commanded closed. This caused a MIL for lean condition on a cold start when the pump ran. $120. I have a thermostat for it too, as the current one is sticking open a bit, resulting in below desired operating temps. $40. Finally the fan clutch seems to stay engaged once commanded. It's "thermo-electric", so a new fan clutch may be necessary, but I'm doing the thermostat first to see if that fixes the fan. $140 if it doesn't.. I also replaced the outer tie rod ends when we bought it, as one was a tiny bit loose. ($40)

Plusses: ALL GMT360/370 platform vehicles have a 2" rear hitch built into the frame. They were carried down the assembly line with it, and it's pretty solid. The I-6 is a great engine IMO. It offers excellent torque, and was one of the first uses of Variable Valve Timing. ONLY the Trailblazer version will accept factory front tow hooks. They won't fit an Envoy. There is not really a good option for really HD front tow points aside from a low hanging front hitch. The Trailblazer hooks are NOT for severe use...

The 2006+ versions have stability and traction control, as well as some updates to the I-6. Traction/Stability is a plus for me, as the RWD platform is fairly tail happy in the slick, and it'll save my wife if she forgets to put it in 4wd. IMO, even auto 4wd can be a bit loose at speed, as it allows the rear to slip before engaging the front, and that causes the rear to step out a bit at times. In low range, the brake traction control works well to keep the truck moving even with wheels off the ground, but you have to stay in the throttle a bit for it to build brake pressure on spinning tires. Offroad in 4wd high range, you'll want to kill both traction control and stability control (Press and hold the button) so it doesn't shut you down if things get suddenly soft or sloppy. I'd recommend finding a truck with G80 option, which is the locking rear diff. It works excellent in high range. I'd also recommend 3.73 or 4.10 gears with the I-6. Yes, 4.10's were available, but not common... Many of them had 3:42 gears, which i would avoid in general if you plan to upsize tires anyway.

Lift: IMO, you will NOT get 35's on one of these without really significant trimming/bashing of the body, or a massive body lift. Max lift that I'd recommend in the front is 2". Yes, people do 3", but that's pretty hard on stuff... The problem is that the front diff mounts to the engine oil pan, which means you can't drop it at all. The upper control arm balljoints also max out at about 1" more droop than the factory allowed. You can flip them for a bit more droop, but then you have to watch compression travel too. I'd think a 255/75R17 on a stock rim would be about the max tire that will fit if you want it to remain a nice driver. Much larger than stock sizes will really sensitize the stability control on later model trucks. Kind of a plus, the undercarriage is fairly flat, with nothing really hanging down as a one way check valve for trail progress... Of course the down side is that it's all fairly low compared to a 4-runner or XJ Cherokee. For our Envoy, I cut 1/2" plate strut spacers for the front and that leveled it nicely with no ill effects. (~3/4" of lift) Nothing seems to bind a full droop, and if I wanted more lift, I could probably get it with a bit of preload in the struts. The rear is easy to lift with a coil spacer, but when you can't lift the front a lot, ease of lifting the rear is moot...

My biggest disappointment: The hood has a prop rod. For some reason, it just seems to me like it should have springs or a strut. This gets me every time I open it...

 

[CrazyDrei]

I bought the wife a 2006 Envoy off Copart. It needed both driver's side doors, but only had 105k on it. I bought the doors at a local junkyard in the correct color and swapped them out. It still has a dent just beind the new rear door, but we don't much care... Total, I've got about $2200 in it, and she's been driving it for a year now. The I-6 is a smooth engine, and gets around 17-18mpg for us.

Issues: I don't know that anything is "common" for all years... Oh, yes I do. The center console is almost always broken loose. It doesn't like when people shift their weight in the seat by using an arm on the console...

After being mostly trouble free for the first 10k or so that we had it, ours is having a few issues with the cold weather... I imagine most of them may be due to the year it sat on the copart lot waiting to be processed... I just replaced the AIR solenoid, which was not sealing after being commanded closed. This caused a MIL for lean condition on a cold start when the pump ran. $120. I have a thermostat for it too, as the current one is sticking open a bit, resulting in below desired operating temps. $40. Finally the fan clutch seems to stay engaged once commanded. It's "thermo-electric", so a new fan clutch may be necessary, but I'm doing the thermostat first to see if that fixes the fan. $140 if it doesn't.. I also replaced the outer tie rod ends when we bought it, as one was a tiny bit loose. ($40)

Plusses: ALL GMT360/370 platform vehicles have a 2" rear hitch built into the frame. They were carried down the assembly line with it, and it's pretty solid. The I-6 is a great engine IMO. It offers excellent torque, and was one of the first uses of Variable Valve Timing. ONLY the Trailblazer version will accept factory front tow hooks. They won't fit an Envoy. There is not really a good option for really HD front tow points aside from a low hanging front hitch. The Trailblazer hooks are NOT for severe use...

The 2006+ versions have stability and traction control, as well as some updates to the I-6. Traction/Stability is a plus for me, as the RWD platform is fairly tail happy in the slick, and it'll save my wife if she forgets to put it in 4wd. IMO, even auto 4wd can be a bit loose at speed, as it allows the rear to slip before engaging the front, and that causes the rear to step out a bit at times. In low range, the brake traction control works well to keep the truck moving even with wheels off the ground, but you have to stay in the throttle a bit for it to build brake pressure on spinning tires. Offroad in 4wd high range, you'll want to kill both traction control and stability control (Press and hold the button) so it doesn't shut you down if things get suddenly soft or sloppy. I'd recommend finding a truck with G80 option, which is the locking rear diff. It works excellent in high range. I'd also recommend 3.73 or 4.10 gears with the I-6. Yes, 4.10's were available, but not common... Many of them had 3:42 gears, which i would avoid in general if you plan to upsize tires anyway.

Lift: IMO, you will NOT get 35's on one of these without really significant trimming/bashing of the body, or a massive body lift. Max lift that I'd recommend in the front is 2". Yes, people do 3", but that's pretty hard on stuff... The problem is that the front diff mounts to the engine oil pan, which means you can't drop it at all. The upper control arm balljoints also max out at about 1" more droop than the factory allowed. You can flip them for a bit more droop, but then you have to watch compression travel too. I'd think a 255/75R17 on a stock rim would be about the max tire that will fit if you want it to remain a nice driver. Much larger than stock sizes will really sensitize the stability control on later model trucks. Kind of a plus, the undercarriage is fairly flat, with nothing really hanging down as a one way check valve for trail progress... Of course the down side is that it's all fairly low compared to a 4-runner or XJ Cherokee. For our Envoy, I cut 1/2" plate strut spacers for the front and that leveled it nicely with no ill effects. (~3/4" of lift) Nothing seems to bind a full droop, and if I wanted more lift, I could probably get it with a bit of preload in the struts. The rear is easy to lift with a coil spacer, but when you can't lift the front a lot, ease of lifting the rear is moot...

My biggest disappointment: The hood has a prop rod. For some reason, it just seems to me like it should have springs or a strut. This gets me every time I open it...

1stDeuce,

Wow, thats pretty much the kinda feedback I was looking for, thank you very much.

I am aware of the front diff oil pan mounting, weird as all hell. I am also thinking about one with a 5.3 motor just because thats what I am very familiar with and can tune it to be exactly how I like it. Not sure about the front diff configuration in the V8 vs I-6. If you know anything about that let me know.

Interesting you mention how tail happy it gets even with the 3.73 gears.

Tell me more about the 3" body lift, you mentioned that it's pretty hard on stuff, what stuff is it hard on?

I know that I want to play with a GMT360/370 platform, but not really sure which direction I want to go with it. I either want to do bad and stupid things with it and build it as a dedicated 4x4 trail rig (with GM IFS, I know, feel free to give me crap about this one) or a really screwed up "practical" backroad 2wd street legal truck. In either case I want at least 35" tires on it.

I think that I am narrowing my search down to a TB with 5.3, I might have to pay a premium for it but with all the parts I have laying around it will be a huge savings over the entire build.