Tires: Wide or Narrow?

[devinsixtyseven]

With your smooth tire with grooves idea I think you are touching on some of the points addressed in Mr. Brady's "narrow tire white paper" I'm not so sure that if you cut those groove in the wider tire face that you will eliminate the rest of the 'smooth' tires contact and its other 'wide' negative affects?

Like Scott stated it probably would not completely mitigate the effect of the additional width. It would work until whatever you were pushing through became deeper than the thickness of the tread (deep puddles), and it will still "grab" ruts and breaks on the highway. But...if it's a very tall tire, it will be more stable at low pressure than the narrow tire.

 

[Redline]

Yep

Like Scott stated it probably would not completely mitigate the effect of the additional width. It would work until whatever you were pushing through became deeper than the thickness of the tread (deep puddles), and it will still "grab" ruts and breaks on the highway. But...if it's a very tall tire, it will be more stable at low pressure than the narrow tire.

 

[Redline]

All this talk about tall & narrow has me remembering the brief experience with my Michelin XZL 9.00R16s on my F350. I loved the size.

Pros:

-Tall and not too wide
-Had/have plenty of power and gearing to turn them with my Diesel
-Rock solid tough, all-steel construction

Cons:

-Rode like hell/stiff, load range F, all-steel design.
-Needed a little lift in front to clear them, which also contributed to a stiffer ride over the nice, flat stock springs and load-range-D 255/85s I had on before and after the 9.00s.
-Loud

I ran them as low as 25-psi on the road to get them to ride decent, found a buyer for the barely used set and decided the test was completed...

Back then I couldn't or didn't want to afford a couple sets of tires. If I was to buy them today I would put them on different wheels for off-highway/expeditions only. But, I'm pretty impressed with Toyos M/Ts which ride much better, are quieter, and are available if you want them. And it's not just Toyos, there really are lots of great tires to chose from. But like you stated, taller tires in the 35-in. range are not available in narrow sizes; a shame.

 

[vengeful]

Granted, most of you guys on here are out west, where mud isn't an object. But, here on the east coast, the old standard Tall-Skinny is the 34x10.50 Interco Super Swamper LTB. I've driven vehicles with these tires, and while they excel off-road, IMO they're horrendous on the street.

I'm more of a rocks and dirt kinda guy than mud and swamps anyways, which is why I enjoyed wheeling out in Arizona so much more than I do here. Does give another option in the Tall-Skinny tire class though.

I had also been looking at "tall" skinny tires to run on the street for my truck, to help with gas mileage and all of that. I found what I thought would be the perfect size, a 235/85R16, which equates to a 32x9.3X16" tire. I've got a mild suspension lift on my truck, and the 32s fit perfectly in the wheel wells, and with a 32" diameter tire, my odometer and speedometer are actually nearly dead on accurate. However, I've been unable to find any tires in this size that are less than a Load Range E. Since these will be street only tires, and will not be used to haul very heavy loads, and possibly rare towing, I'd rather stick with a load range D tire, for the sake of comfort on the street. If anyone knows of a Mild All-Terrain tire in that size available in Load Range D, please let me know.

 

[Redline]

Yep, I mentioned The 'load-range-E' issue above and I agree it is a serious concern if you are looking for a nice on-road ride. The 235/85R16 was 'THE' heavy-duty tire size for 3/4 & 1-ton light-trucks in the eighties and nineties. Therefore these tires are almost always load range E-range (just like all 255/85 are D-range). I remember seeing at least one tire in this size made in load-range-D, but limiting oneself to tire choice based on load range in this size might prove frustrating, as there are lots of tread/manufacturer choices if you can put up with or want E-range.

Unfortunately the excellent 235/85R16 lost lots of ground to 245/75R16 (Dodge & G.M.) and the 265/75R16-Ford (still a good size IMO) in the past several years. Now big pickups are coming with 17 & 18-in wheels. These taller wheels are unnecessary and potentially negative for how we would like to set-up our rigs, as well as greatly reducing tire choice (though that will improve as time passes).

Though I have good tires for my 4Runner (265s), I priced a set of Toyo A/Ts in 235/85R16E a couple days ago; $700.00 out the door for a set of four! I won't be able to afford these for a while, the Mall Crawler is currently breaking the bank with other accessories. I may be able to afford and try some 235s on the 4Runner in a few months with the plan that if I don't like them, they will go onto my F350 as its everyday tire, saving my BFG M/T 255s for my steels wheels and seasonal use.

...

I had also been looking at "tall" skinny tires to run on the street for my truck, to help with gas mileage and all of that. I found what I thought would be the perfect size, a 235/85R16, which equates to a 32x9.3X16" tire. I've got a mild suspension lift on my truck, and the 32s fit perfectly in the wheel wells, and with a 32" diameter tire, my odometer and speedometer are actually nearly dead on accurate. However, I've been unable to find any tires in this size that are less than a Load Range E. Since these will be street only tires, and will not be used to haul very heavy loads, and possibly rare towing, I'd rather stick with a load range D tire, for the sake of comfort on the street. If anyone knows of a Mild All-Terrain tire in that size available in Load Range D, please let me know.

 

[slooowr6]

Need some help on deciding going load range E (235/85/16) or D(265/85/16). I want a load range E tire for the toughness but I'm afraid it will ride like a rock on road. Usually it takes couple hundred miles on freeway before get to the trail head so on road comfort is pretty important for me. My 06 Tacoma with camper and everything will be around 6000lbs. Will this be enough for a load range E tire? I'm thinking it's not, cause Redline is using it for F350 which can load a LOT more. I like the idea of narrow tire but I can't find one in D .... Suggestion???

 

[Scott Brady]

I ran an E rated 235/85 on my Trooper for a few years. Rode great at 35 psi.

 

[Beowulf]

I love my Stock E rated Rubicon tires. I did not find them to stiff at all.

 

[jeff@work]

i run E rated 265/75r16 on my trooper and I have no complaints about the ride at all.

 

[Redline]

Ride sensitivity is such a personal thing... but I'm inclined to agree with these guys who say that they are/were happy with E-range tires on their utility wagons.

I was not particularly happy with the stock Goodyear MTR E-range tires on my Jeep Rubicon, I thought there were too stiff for the platform (245/75R16); even before I lifted it. My first tire upgrade on that 05 LJ was a set of 255/85 D-range. Loved the ride of these D-range tires. I later went to E-range Toyo M/Ts, first in 265/75, then 285/75. I love these tires/tread, was not wild about the E-range but I ran them around 25-psi on the Jeep and they were pretty good (they are true and need little weight to balance!).

The ride on my 4Runner is so much softer, even now after I added OME heavy-duty springs to the front last week (without bumper/winch) it still rides very nice. Weight on the front will settle it a bit and should be fine if not perfect. I think it really depends on the platform and your opinion/sensitivity. There is no way you will know until you try them. I would say if you are willing to try 265 D-range instead of C-range, then maybe just take the next step and go for the E-range 235s.

The reason I'm talking about E-range and the F350 is because Load-Range-E tires are what came on it and have the load capacity (3042-lbs per tire) to handle the weight that the F350 can carry when loaded. When not loaded, I run much lower pressures in my tires for better ride, wear, and traction. For example, my everyday 'wet' 'unladen' weight on my F350 is about 3000-lbs on the rear axle and 4300-lbs on the front. With 255/85s I run 45-psi in the front and 30-35-psi in the rear for this everyday 'empty' weight. If I have a load, I add PSI. I get lots of miles out of my tires.

I pulled a new, stock, mounted 235/85 out of a corner of my garage tonight and rested it against a mounted Toyo 265/75 M/T I have for the Mall Crawler's dirt tires just to compare their width. My past experiences and knowledge mixed with a heathy serving of this thread has convinced me I need to try a set of 235/85 A/T on my 4Runner for the street tires.

Need some help on deciding going load range E (235/85/16) or D(265/85/16). I want a load range E tire for the toughness but I'm afraid it will ride like a rock on road. Usually it takes couple hundred miles on freeway before get to the trail head so on road comfort is pretty important for me. My 06 Tacoma with camper and everything will be around 6000lbs. Will this be enough for a load range E tire? I'm thinking it's not, cause Redline is using it for F350 which can load a LOT more. I like the idea of narrow tire but I can't find one in D .... Suggestion???

 

[slooowr6]

Thanks all for the tips, it's really helpful. After the stock P rated 245/75/16 wear out I'm going for a set E 235/85!! Hopefully it won't be long, the wear index on the stock tire is only 300

 

[vengeful]

I was researching the Michelin LTX M/S tires for street only tires. After reading some reviews, I've noticed that it's not uncommon to see well over 100,000 miles out of them with proper alignment and maintenance. That's impressive! I'd imagine the E-Range tires would match or better that with ease. I'm about 65-70% sold on them in a 235/85R16 - E (or D, since it is available, and about $10/tire less expensive) for my street tires. Does anyone have any experience with these tires specificially, or any reason why I should NOT buy them? I've had nothing but great experiences with Michelin tires on previous vehicles, but I've always run BFGoodrich tires on the Pathfinder.

 

[Redline]

Since they are available in "D" I would consider them just like you. D will ride better than E, and E will much quite a bit stiffer than the stock "P" tires.

I also like Michelin tires. The original set I had on a1993 Dodge W250 w/Cummins Diesel, 235/85R16, were very nice. They were in a good A/T pattern no longer available. The reasons I have not been buying Michelin tires in recent years is because my 'preferred provider' Les Schwab Tires doesn't carry them, and there are not enough (any?) semi-aggressive all-terrain patterns that I like. But if you are buying a set for the street/mileage, I think you are on the right track.

If I were to buy Michelins today I would consider Costco & the Tire Rack as sources.

I was researching the Michelin LTX M/S tires for street only tires. After reading some reviews, I've noticed that it's not uncommon to see well over 100,000 miles out of them with proper alignment and maintenance. That's impressive! I'd imagine the E-Range tires would match or better that with ease. I'm about 65-70% sold on them in a 235/85R16 - E (or D, since it is available, and about $10/tire less expensive) for my street tires. Does anyone have any experience with these tires specificially, or any reason why I should NOT buy them? I've had nothing but great experiences with Michelin tires on previous vehicles, but I've always run BFGoodrich tires on the Pathfinder.

 

[bigreen505]

The Michelins are an excellent tire, but I think they do better on heavier vehicles if you are driving in snow. How long they last depends on the weight of the vehicle, but I would guess that you will be around 6/32 or so by 60,000 miles. They do wear like iron and provide excellent ride, handling and control on most on-road conditions, but they have gotten very pricey too.

 

[vengeful]

I don't think weight of the vehicle has that much to do with tire wear, at least not when they're properly maintained.

If you look at the reviews on Tire Rack, you'll see people getting over 100,000 miles with 1 ton trucks.