Too Much Weight For Reliability?

[goodtimes]

So are you looking for peoples thoughts and opinions (as suggested in your first post), or are you simply looking for affirmation of your choices? It sounds like you have already made up your mind, and are simply looking for others to reinforce your decisions.

Good luck with that.

 

[Karma]

So are you looking for peoples thoughts and opinions (as suggested in your first post), or are you simply looking for affirmation of your choices? It sounds like you have already made up your mind, and are simply looking for others to reinforce your decisions.

Good luck with that.

HI good,
I warned you in my frist post that this would be difficult for you. I appreciate you trying to help. And you have helped.

I want you all to try to let me design my Jeep in my way and point out weaknesses. You have tried to do that. What I don't want is for you to impose your own philosphies over mine. Do I want you confirm my decisions? Sure. That would tell me I have a viable vehicle. And it would make me feel good. But, ultimately that's not important. Simply stated, at the stated weight, will my scheme work?

I also wanted your experience. I don't think I am getting it in a way that applies to my situation. At least not always. For example, how many of you have actually blown up a D35? More to the point, a performance modified D35 such as mine. So far, nobody. It seems to me that you all are basing your comments on heresay and third party opinions. I've heard plenty of that on the forums yet my D35 keeps chugging along after 10 years plus the years before I bought it. You may be right but my experience does not confirm your opinons. Maybe you should listen to me. What do you expect me to say?

For example, Topgun admonishes me for having an elaborate set up. Yet, his Jeep and approach will not support the types of treks I have in mind. My vehicle is not elaborate for its intended use, just purposeful. It's apples and oranges. I can thank him for his thoughts but not be enthsiastic about how he has built his vehicle. He has nothing to offer me but he does not realize it.

In most instances I have made up my mind. That does not mean I can't change my mind but I will need firm experience to do so. I'm the one who thought the scheme out, bought the equipment, and installed it. That adds up to commitment. If I had not made up my mind, I would have changed things. Generally, I think it will work. BTW, I am checking into a full floating rear diff but I don't like what I'm finding. It will be very expensive when the ARB is included.

Most of you have not told me what your Jeep weighs or what the purpose of your build is. Are you building primarily a rock crawler, or have V8 power, or large tires and high lift?? Does it weigh 4000 lbs. or 6000 lbs? Without this information how am I supposed to judge the validity of your views and how they match my needs? How can you feel confident you are giving me good ideas? Without this data I'm kind of lost and somehow I'm not getting this idea across. That is my fault, I guess.

Sparky

 

[Patman]

Morning Sparky,

What your asking for is a little unrealistic. Is your current setup too heavy to be reliable. Yes. Do you want to hear that....No. Have you proven otherwise....Yes (which is great by the way). I think more people are too busy worrying instead of going out and doing. By the sound of it you have been busy doing. (Again great)

Affirmation is great, but I don't think that gets you the answer you want. "Dude your Wrang is SiCK!" Did that help?

If your only looking for YJ experience this may not be the correct place. I think it is and would never suggest otherwise, a wider pool of experience is always better.

You obviously have apprehensions about your setup, since your looking for opinions. I have never broken a 35, but I have seen several break (axle, housing and gears), and seen countless broken ones in my wrecking yard experiences. Nothing as heavy as yours though. You can be heavy and never break, however its the exception, not the rule.

Have you thought about converting the rear to ff using d44 ends and trussing the housing, easy and relatively cheap. Would address the inherent d35 weaknesses.

As for me. None of my rigs have been as extensively equipped as yours, but my trips are shorter

FJ60 stock axles 3" on 33's 5900 ready for the trail never a break
W200 crew short d44/d60. 4750 empty 6100 ready for the trail
Ramcharger d60/14bolt 7890 ready for the trail broke everything at some point (except housings ;-) )
86 cj7 4500 ready for the trail spring over on stock axles with 35s, broke both axles and currently going through 1 tonification with the axles from the Ram.

 

[Topgun514]

HI good,


For example, Topgun admonishes me for having an elaborate set up. Yet, his Jeep and approach will not support the types of treks I have in mind. My vehicle is not elaborate for its intended use, just purposeful. It's apples and oranges. I can thank him for his thoughts but not be enthsiastic about how he has built his vehicle. He has nothing to offer me but he does not realize it.

Really,
I just came back from 2 weeks sustained in Montana. Total of ~2100 miles and 1000 of which were in the middle of nowhere, 1000 were highway and the other 100 were city on the first and last day visiting Helena, MT.

Don't tell people we have nothing to offer you when you asked US.

I have personally seen 2 D35's explode too. One on dry pavement with stock highway tires. The reason was a dumb driver trying a 0-60 test but still, if a stocker cant try accelerating then I dont know why Jeep put this weak link in.

The next was a Jeep XJ on 32's. The BFG KM2's 32's(12.50's) are only 7 lbs per tire than 31x10.5. The XJ was empty besides 1 passenger...no tools, no tents, no nothing. Just a day wheeling mildly. (Rolling hills in GA)

Why do you ask when you have already made up your mind...post a pic of your jeep so we can see...try to resolve that problem so we can see what your working with.

If you are towing, then a D35 is a bad axle, many cars have there weaknesses and this is one for Jeep.
LR's have crappy wiring
Renix Jeeps have that Pukegoat ba10...
The 84-86 Jeep XJ's have tons of faults
Prius Gas Pedals

The list goes on. We are not attacking you or your Jeep, just noticing whats a weak point when you asked us. Don't be so quick to judge.

I have been with XJ's my whole life with background being snow travel in the Northeast, horse trailer towing (d44 was the axle used), hardcore offroading, mild offroading, highway, you name it.

 

[Karma]

HI All,
Still trying to post pics but with no luck. Same error message. I'm waiting for some action from the WEB Master. I don't know what is going on. I've never had this problem on other forums.

In the meantime, you could post some pics of your Jeeps. That would be helpful. I would be be very curious to see them. I love pics. We all love pics.

Thanks, Sparky

 

[leaffreux]

Yea Karma your YJ is to heavy, It took 10 years to ask that question WOW

:victory:

 

[Karma]

Pictures, Pictures, Pictures

HI,
Still having trouble on this forum with pictures. Have been in contact with with the WEB Master who did not fix problem. Claims something is wrong with my browser settings. Well, OK but what?

To see if I have problems with other vBulletin powered sites, I tried to download the same picture set to another site. It worked fine.

If you still want to see pictures of my Jeep here are the links:

http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f176/jeep-ready-trek-some-pictures-1098910/#post10082315

and

http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f176/jeep-ready-trek-some-pictures-1098910/#post10082350

I have more pics which I will put into an album here if I can get the problems fixed.

Sparky

 

[Karma]

Yea Karma your YJ is to heavy, It took 10 years to ask that question WOW

:victory:

HI,
Well, no. I've known I was heavy for quite a long time. I just weighed it recently after it was actually ready for a trek. The result is what inspired this thread. So now I know the truth exactly.

Here is the issue. If my Jeep is too heavy for a reliable expedition, then I conclude that a Wrangler cannot be built for expedition use. I'm not talking about a weekend camping trip but a real expedition. Is that what you are telling me? How do you know for sure? I'm betting you are wrong. What is your experience with this type of build? How much does your Jeep weigh? Generalities don't help me.

Sparky

 

[Patman]

Here is the issue. If my Jeep is too heavy for a reliable expedition, then I conclude that a Wrangler cannot be built for expedition use. I'm not talking about a weekend camping trip but a real expedition. Is that what you are telling me? How do you know for sure? I'm betting you are wrong. What is your experience with this type of build? How much does your Jeep weigh? Generalities don't help me.

Sparky

Well, there's you're answer isn't it?

If your unwilling to upgrade your GVW limiting axle housings, the general consensus is yes. Your use is well outside the designed service envelope of the YJ chassis. Jeep engineers would tell you the same, hence the little gvw sticker Don't see a lot of 3/4 ton trucks with d35s.

Come to think of it, aren't you getting close to overloading your tires too?

I personally think your Jeep is an excellent start and incredibly well equipped. Although I would spend more time worried about breakage then I would enjoying the trail.

There are many conclusions to be had, but only your opinion that matters. How many 3 ton single seat rigs are there on this board, after all?

Is a fairly stock YJ the pinnacle of OEM expedition rigs? Yeah..NO!. Is your's off to a great start? Yes. Would anyone else build and use it the same? No. Is that a rip on you? NO!

If Jeep wanted to build their version of a true overland rig.........wait......

So stretch it for more room, go to d44s and a d or e rated tire.

 

[Sangster]

Geez....just read this whole mess.

You asked for opinions and then argued with every single one of them.

Your jeep is awesome, it is set up 100% correctly, and should be the envy of all expedition people world wide. Your d35 will never break, and while your jeep is very over weight, it will continue on for eternity without a single breakage due to that overweight state.


There....now let's all get on with our lives.

/thread

 

[Karma]

HI Patman,
I assume you have looked at the pictures I posted on the other forum. I think your comments are realistic and well thought out. I will pick a nit. I'm not up to 3 tons. Just 5200 lbs. It seems to me that the following items raise the most red flags in this thread:

1. Suspension: I agree. I am looking into Alcan custom springs.

2. Brakes: I agree and have corrected the problem. I have good brakes.

3. Chassis: I'm not sure there is a problem. My frame is in really good shape. If it were rusted, I would be more concerned.

4. Space: With a lot of hard work, I have created enough space to support a long trek. This is not a problem. I have everything I need.

5. Gear ratios: Not a problem. Remember I do have a Tera Low +2 transfer case. Highway use requires a lot of downshifting. Trail use is good.

6. Dana 35: Well what can I say except I have not had any problems with the upgraded axles. But, I know there is more to it than that. I am looking into several options. A truss on the Dana 35 might be one that I can manage. If I change third members, I insist on getting a full floating arrangement. I think the Dana 44 is the most logical choice but I have not yet found a full floating version. An 8.8 is another popular possibility. Is there a full float version around? Or, my least favorite choice, there is the Dana 60 which is full floating. I don't like it but it remains on my list. It's too damn big and heavy. I will loose sacred ground clearance.

Sparky

 

[Sangster]

.......I will loose sacred ground clearance.

Sparky

Says the guy who won't increase tire size from 31's. 1.5" of gain available with a simple switch to 33" tires.

and don't give us any crap about the gas mileage loss from 33's....you drive a 5200 lb jeep!

 

[Patman]

Axle clearance on a 60 can be addressed with a shaved housing or a tera60 style center. Although, now you're getting crazy with funds.

Could always go with a fj80 rear (assuming you're not a dana pureist). Factory e locker, full float, disc brake. Width is close and affordable. Just grind off the link brackets and zap on some pads. Should almost break even by selling your current axle. Would have to redrill for 5 lug.

Another option is the truss along with a custom ff set up.

Use all oem front d44 spindles, hubs, eldorado rear calipers (same as d44 with e brake). Just get some adapters made to bolt the spindle and caliper onto the housing & and a set of axles.

Both options would work and not only increase the weight capacity significantly, but also go a long way to solve any brake issues you may have.

 

[alosix]

Geez....just read this whole mess.

You asked for opinions and then argued with every single one of them.

Your jeep is awesome, it is set up 100% correctly, and should be the envy of all expedition people world wide. Your d35 will never break, and while your jeep is very over weight, it will continue on for eternity without a single breakage due to that overweight state.


There....now let's all get on with our lives.

/thread

x2

I'll throw in my .02. (are we doing inflation or deflation this week?)

The GVWR and towing rating of a YJ/TJ are normally lower than their drivetrain can handle due to their short wheelbase. For example, an XJ with the same running gear you have will have a GVWR of about 4900.

So, I'd say you're about borderline on the axles and probably a little overweight for normal driving safety. You've already taken care of the brakes so it sounds decent there, but its still going to handle a bit odd loaded. You've probably learned to drive it at that weight by now so its not a big deal. If you cause an accident fully loaded you might have some issues with insurance, but who knows.

If it was me, I'd probably work around the Jeep and see where I could loose a few pounds. Swapping steel to aluminum to where possible, smaller bumpers, removing unnecessary skids if possible (you don't have a raditor skid right? ).

Next up, like the others, the D35 would worry me. If anything if you are near that weight driving it most of the time I'd want to check the wheel and carrier bearings more often. Also carry an extra set of shafts with you.

In my experience wheeling, a D35 + locker + Teralow was always asking for trouble. You must have one heck of a light foot wheeling or keep to some pretty tame trails.

 

[leaffreux]

Karma

You would lose that bet, I have been on various expeditions in various parts of the world for about 60 yes 60 years.

Africa North to South.
RTW
Round Austraila Towsend to Towsend.
Oodna(bloody)datta Pink Roadhouse
Dakar, Timboktu, Dogan Country, Country of the Blue men,
Even Death Valley, just to name a few
and oh yea and Anartica with DR. David Lewis
:victory: