Too Much Weight For Reliability?

BigAl

Expedition Leader
HI goodtimes,
You have not been keeping up with the latest. I have instigated a search for a viable solution to the Dana 35 issue. You are right. The Dana 35 is the red flag everybody seems to be bringing up.

Since you have come to your senses, i'll add my 2 cents. :sombrero:

I have a a 1990 YJ that I too have been building for 10 years. I went against the grain for years and said the d35 was under estimated. Then i broke one then another. Not extreme stuff just, average. I was running 32s when they failed. I switched to a FSJ D44s and my problems axle problems have not returned. What gear ratio do you have?
 
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Karma

Adventurer
HI warhead,
Thanks a bunch for bringing the pics over. That's wonderful. Now we will see if they can be found. :luxhello:

Sparky
 

Karma

Adventurer
You sound like an engineer....

Since you want to keep your rear axle, toss a truss on the 35 and call it good, the housing is real weak and even heavy loads will bend it. Between a truss and the upgraded axles and ARB it should be pretty reliable.

...Unloaded i'm right around 4800lbs. And the lift and bigger tires does not make it more tippy, this thing sticks to where ever you point it.

.... If I were to do it again, I would keep it low and build more of a traditional expo rig but i'm working with what I have.

HI coco,
I'm only going to comment on a couple of your points. First, I am an engineer. I didn't think it was so obvious. It must be my bad spelling!! Engineers are famous for their bad spelling.

Your statement about the vehicle not getting tippy in a crawer build if it is used in an expedition application is wrong. It most definitely does get tippy if you have a loaded top rack, high lift, and big tires. This is very unstable in off camber situations unless you keep the rig low. That is one reason why rock crawlers and expedition builds have such different needs. Crawlers don't make good expedition vehicles and expedition vehicles do not make good crawlers. Very different animals. Very different needs. It's all about trade-offs.

You will be glad to hear that I decided to install a truss. I did some research and called a few manufacturers and this is what I learned.

I have the best of the D35 versions. I have a non-C clip differential. I knew that but I did not realize why it was the preferred D35. That's good. The axle bearing each have a load rating of 2200 lbs. for a total load capability of 4400 lbs. My max total rear axle load is 2820 lbs. That gives me a total head room of 1580 lbs. That's significant and sufficient for reliable performance. Spyder issues are taken care of with my ARB. The ring and pinion are plenty strong for my application. My upgraded axles removes the axles as a concern. The one remaining issue is the case and tubes.

Superior suggested (are you listening, coco) that I get an axle truss which will solve the case and tube flex problem. The engineer at Superior calculated that my existing D35 with a good truss will be fine for my use.

I bought Superiors axle truss. It should be here by Friday.

Since anybody can say anything, I need a reason to trust any given individuals view. In this case, I called Superior checking into their Super 35 axle. As you know, that's a pretty expensive option with its included ARB locker. So, Superior would have made much more money if they had said "Your D35 is trash and you must replace it with our super good Super 35". I would have listened. But that's not the direction the conversation went. Instead, he led me away from the reason I called and justified the truss as a good, reliable choice. I was impressed with his technical knowledge and his overall appreciation of my vehicle needs.

He made his point, made a sale, and captured a possible future customer.

So, coco, your suggstion has been taken but I did this before I read your post. You simply confirmed my decision. Thanks.

Don't forget that Warhead moved my pictures into this thread. Check them out.

If this decision closes this thread, I want to thank everyone for their concerned comments and knowledge. This is why forums can be great.

Sparky
 

Topgun514

Adventurer
He made his point, made a sale, and captured a possible future customer.

Sparky

I would try to sell something to make money. Why would he tell you get another axle, that would take away from his sell if you went and got a real axle.


ps, I have a d35 off my parts jeep. Its the best one they ever made EVER, would you like to buy it? It has held up to 31's in moab so it must be good.
 

monele

Adventurer
So to try to un-stir the pot a bit..(and since I didn't see anyone else suggest this)...what about moving some of the stuff into the trailer when you bring it? That would lower the jeep weight, and since you still have 500# left of your tow rating you get a nicely balanced rig. That way, you only occasionally haul all the weight on the jeep, thus reducing wear and tear.
 

Sangster

Adventurer
I would try to sell something to make money. Why would he tell you get another axle, that would take away from his sell if you went and got a real axle.

uh...so that he could sell you the Superior axle? I imagine the axle they sell is quite a bit more than the truss.

Point is, he sold him the truss instead of the axle because that's all he determined was needed. Sold what the CUSTOMER needed instead of what cost the most.
 

Karma

Adventurer
uh...so that he could sell you the Superior axle? I imagine the axle they sell is quite a bit more than the truss.

Point is, he sold him the truss instead of the axle because that's all he determined was needed. Sold what the CUSTOMER needed instead of what cost the most.

HI,
Yes, Sangster, that's exactly the point I was trying to make. Thanks.

Sparky
 

Topgun514

Adventurer
uh...so that he could sell you the Superior axle? I imagine the axle they sell is quite a bit more than the truss.

Point is, he sold him the truss instead of the axle because that's all he determined was needed. Sold what the CUSTOMER needed instead of what cost the most.

Not many people will buy a new axle from a company. Thats (most likely) why he didnt suggest the 4500 dollar D44. People can go out and get a used Dana, Ford, Chryco, etc for way less and upgrade it still.


How much was the truss if you dont mind me asking?
 

Karma

Adventurer
So to try to un-stir the pot a bit..(and since I didn't see anyone else suggest this)...what about moving some of the stuff into the trailer when you bring it? That would lower the jeep weight, and since you still have 500# left of your tow rating you get a nicely balanced rig. That way, you only occasionally haul all the weight on the jeep, thus reducing wear and tear.

HI monele,
I do exactly that. Actually, I have several modes available:

1. Local trails without camping: These are 1 day trips typically with my Jeep club. The Jeep is fully unloaded and the cases and cans removed. This is the lightest case.

2. Camping only: The Jeep is fully loaded as shown in the pictures but, maybe, without the chain saw depending on the trip. No trailer.

3. Long trip with trailer but no camping: Jeep is fully unloaded with the cases and cans removed, but, maybe, the gas and water cans may be mounted. Most of the load is in the trailer because I typically would stay and live in an RV Park and run only day trips. This would be my typical Moab trip.

4. Combined RV and Camping: This is the most complicated case where I'm doing a combination of activities. For example, my upcomming Hole In The Rock trip will require three days of camping and wheeling for a long distance in completely deserted country. Then I'm going to Moab for a week and stay in the RV Park. So for the frist three days, the Jeep will be fully loaded and the trailer parked at an airport. Then, I will go to Moab for a series of day trips where I will fully unload the cases and gas cans from the Jeep and store most of it in or under the trailer. The trip back to New Mexico will be with an unloaded Jeep.

So, as you can see, it gets logistically complicated but I have flexibility to accomodate all these cases.

Sparky
 
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Karma

Adventurer
HI Bob,
There is no need. I have plenty of room inside my Jeep with this loading scheme. I carry my clothes in a duffle bag inside where they will stay dry but still out of the way.

Sparky
 

trust

Adventurer
Hey Sparky, why don't you gt the Unimog running and finished up for these more complicated trips and not worry about load on the jeep?

Sorry, I had to through my $.02 in after the fact, you can owe me....
 

monele

Adventurer
Well, to be honest, if you've made it 10 years, I'd say keep going as you are, but keep a sharp eye on that D35. As soon as it shows any sign of scary, drop an new, stronger axle of what ever kind fits your price range and don't worry for now. My best advice: drive with in the parameters of your vehicle and you skills. All engineering has dome kind of design factor, meaning the breaking strength is some factor higher than the rated strength, so you have some headroom. I say be gentle and enjoy the outdoors. As long as you are a tuned to your vehicle, you'll know when it's time to upgrade. When that time comes, have this thread archived somewhere to refer to.
 

Karma

Adventurer
Hey Sparky, why don't you gt the Unimog running and finished up for these more complicated trips and not worry about load on the jeep?

Sorry, I had to through my $.02 in after the fact, you can owe me....

HI trust,
How did you know I have a Unimog? Hmmm. I feel a spy in our midst. Truthfully, you have never driven one. This thing is more underpowered than my Jeep.

Sparky
 

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