Trailer tongue weight distribution

[NevetsG]

Well The OP has too much stuff loaded on the Draw Bar of his trailer, and you would not need that trolley if you loaded your trailer correctly,

The OP has responded yet, but he states the trailer isn't loaded, and it isn't hitched. A well designed trailer will be tongue heavy before they are loaded, and we also don't know what his physical ability is. I'm getting to an age where getting a trolley may help me from hurting myself.

 

[67cj5]

The OP has responded yet, but he states the trailer isn't loaded, and it isn't hitched. A well designed trailer will be tongue heavy before they are loaded, and we also don't know what his physical ability is. I'm getting to an age where getting a trolley may help me from hurting myself.

Yes, You and Me Both, Although I still feel like superman those aches and pains tell me I am well past my 20's, Lol.

Going from the picture he posted with it hooked up to the landcruiser I would the draw bar is grossly over loaded.

Going back to your trailer it might lighten the hitch weight if you reverse that mower on there because then the Engine would be closer to the Axle, Also with a trailer like yours unless you are carrying a lot of weight then you don't have to worry about the 10/20/30% rule, and seeing as the Axle is so far back I would load all the accessories at the front near the Draw Bar and reverse the mower on because that would give you a nice amount of weight on the hitch But Keep the heaviest part over or near the Axle, Then you would find it easier to move even when using the Trolley, If it was a mini Digger I would still load the main body of the digger so about 1/3 of it's tracks were over the Axle and the other 2/3's in front of the Axle,

Your Trailer seems to have the Axle mounted at about 65% rearward which puts a huge load on the Tow Ball, As someone already posted that in the US People Tow at break Neck speeds which is really crazy because that leaves no margin for error, Even when I was Driving my F100 and my F350 Duelly there is no way would I Tow at 130kph/80mph+/-, At our Age we need to load these thing so we can still manage moving them etc without busting a Gut.

 

[Buliwyf]

[Stop moving the trailer by hand. That's what the truck is for.]

 

[NevetsG]

Yes, You and Me Both, Although I still feel like superman those aches and pains tell me I am well past my 20's, Lol.

Going from the picture he posted with it hooked up to the landcruiser I would the draw bar is grossly over loaded.

Going back to your trailer it might lighten the hitch weight if you reverse that mower on there because then the Engine would be closer to the Axle, Also with a trailer like yours unless you are carrying a lot of weight then you don't have to worry about the 10/20/30% rule, and seeing as the Axle is so far back I would load all the accessories at the front near the Draw Bar and reverse the mower on because that would give you a nice amount of weight on the hitch But Keep the heaviest part over or near the Axle, Then you would find it easier to move even when using the Trolley, If it was a mini Digger I would still load the main body of the digger so about 1/3 of it's tracks were over the Axle and the other 2/3's in front of the Axle,

Your Trailer seems to have the Axle mounted at about 65% rearward which puts a huge load on the Tow Ball, As someone already posted that in the US People Tow at break Neck speeds which is really crazy because that leaves no margin for error, Even when I was Driving my F100 and my F350 Duelly there is no way would I Tow at 130kph/80mph+/-, At our Age we need to load these thing so we can still manage moving them etc without busting a Gut.

LOL! The pictures are not my trailer, I pulled those pictures from the internet to show as an example. But thanks for the input.

 

[67cj5]

LOL! The pictures are not my trailer, I pulled those pictures from the internet to show as an example. But thanks for the input.

Most big Camper Trailers here have Remote controlled Motor movers that can make them do a 360 on the spot at the touch of a button. You can buy the movers and fit then to any trailer.

 

[hidesertwheelin]

Going from the picture he posted with it hooked up to the landcruiser I would the draw bar is grossly over loaded.

In the picture, the 2 water tanks are empty, the propane bottle is empty, and the 2 harbor freight pelican boxes are empty. The only thing in the box is 4 trailer jack stands for leveling the trailer. I think part of the problem is I don't have much weight in the back to counter balance any of the weight in the front.

 

[CampStewart]

Going from the picture he posted with it hooked up to the landcruiser I would the draw bar is grossly over loaded.

Ive designed and built trailers, modified them in all kinds of ways and I couldn't imagine how I could possibly tell if that draw bar is overloaded by one pound much less grossly overloaded. From looking at that picture how is it that you can make that statement?

It looks like you have done quite a bit of research to find information that seems to have made you incredibly cautious about loading trailers. Did you have some sort of an incident that has pushed you to this extreme caution? To be honest if I was as concerned as you seem to be I would not want the stress of being anywhere near a trailer and would find another way to transport my gear.

 

[67cj5]

Ive designed and built trailers, modified them in all kinds of ways and I couldn't imagine how I could possibly tell if that draw bar is overloaded by one pound much less grossly overloaded. From looking at that picture how is it that you can make that statement?

It looks like you have done quite a bit of research to find information that seems to have made you incredibly cautious about loading trailers. Did you have some sort of an incident that has pushed you to this extreme caution? To be honest if I was as concerned as you seem to be I would not want the stress of being anywhere near a trailer and would find another way to transport my gear.

I have Hauled every thing from Farm Tractors to Race Cars On Highways and Mountain Passes, Since the early 1980's and I have Never had a single Incident.

BUT ?? Then I started to upgrade my Tyres and looking at suspension packages and then I Wondered what was the Ultimate Towing Rig I could Buy for my Truck, The a Major Towing Supplies Company started talking about Facts and figures, This then Lead to me spending 18 to 20 hours a day researching what they had said, Which lead me to the Makers of the Truck and the Government web sites and the list got bigger and bigger,

Coming from Australia I have always gone by the 10/15% RULE to be my correct hitch weight / Tow Ball Weight, Using the Exact method as used in America. But after talking to the Towing Companies and going on the Government web sites and Checking in a Vehicle hand book At what this vehicle could Carry and Haul, So I compared these figures to the US and Australian Figure and then found out that my GCM was nearly 2000Lbs Higher that what the SAME vehicle has in the US and Australia Which was a pleasing discovery I must admit,

But then came the Ball or Hitch weight figures, Which to me were totally bloody stupid because I have a Truck with a combined gross combination Mass rated at around 2000Lbs higher than the US and Australian model with a Trailer rated and 2400kgs/ 5291Lbs where as mine can Tow 2900kgs 6393Lbs and combined with my Tow vehicle load capacity brings up my GCM to around 12000Lbs or 5.4 Tons, But both the US and Australian Vehicles have the 10 to 15% Hitch weights So On those 2 vehicles give a Hitch weight of 240Kgs / 529Lbs @10% and 360kgs / 793Lbs @ 15% Which to me seems about right and Correct.

This is where it Drove me NUTZ, Because I can legally Tow 2900Kgs / 6393Lbs, So My Hitch weight @ 10% should be 290Kgs / 639Lbs and at 15% it should be 435Kgs / 959Lbs, But remember I grew up believing the same facts and Figures as You Guys, But then upon reading this hand book It says TOW BALL / HITCH WEIGHT 115Kgs / 253.5 LBS, Now I am really pi$$ed because and totally confused, So now I am thinking how can I load up the Hitch weight to where I can Tow 2900Kgs / 6393Lbs So the Vehicle is safe to drive ?? 115Kgs / 253Lbs is less than 4% of the Trailers Loaded Weight because @ 2900Kgs 4% = 116Kgs which to me is down right Dangerous, But here is the Clincher, My Tow Hitch/Ball is Rated to 3500Kgs or Over 7700Lbs with a Hitch /Ball weight Of 209Kgs / 460Lbs and My other Tow Ball / Hitch is Rated at 3500Kgs / Over 7700Lbs and with a Ball ? Hitch Weight of 350Kgs / 771Lbs which just so happens to be equal to the 10% RULE of it's Towing Rating,

My Tyres had a Load Rating of 930Kgs / 2050Lbs per Tyre Per Axle and I have Uprated them to 1400Kgs / 3086Lbs Per Tyre Per Axle by going from 4 or 6 ply Tyres up to 10ply Tyres which means in Theory those 2 Axles can withstand a load of around 6172Lbs Per Axle.

But the Whole World gets to use the 10% / 15% Rule and I don't BUT I get to Tow over 2000Lbs / 1 Ton more and all because some Idiot with a Slide Rule who most likely has Not learned to Drive yet Says I can't use the 10% Rule, Annoying Facts come in to my mind that the 10% Rule has worked and Served the People well for over 70 Years until those Clowns in the EU forced this BS on the Rest of Europe, My Advise it To load the Hitch up with the Maximum Allowed Hitch Weight and add around 3 to 5% extra which is what the Allowance variation is IE with 115Kgs / 253Lbs up to around 120Kgs 265Lbs.

Yes I have spent a long Time Researching all the DATA from many Countries and Individual Vehicles and Tow Hitch Companies Etc.

And Check this Monster Caravan / Camper Trailer @ 11mtrs / 36ft Long.

Why our towing laws are ridiculous

How can you drive a truck and trailer with a combined weight of 11 tonnes on a car licence but not drive a truck over 4495kg?

www.caravancampingsales.com.au

Check this Video Out because this is where the real Info is, it also gives you the facts of how the Hitch Weight Effects your Load Capacity,

 

[calicamper]

My 4x6 runs nose heavy but that also makes it rock solid at highway speeds. With my Subaru I do pack it with the tongue weight in mind given I can easily end up too heavy for the Subaru. But my Sequoia I don’t care given any added nose weight simply adds stability for my long highway trips. It runs happily at the highest speeds the Sequoia is happy doing 80-85 on those long desert trips. As for too heavy for the tongue structure mine never gets over 230 and loaded the trailer is in the 1500lbs or less all up.

But many of these jeep style rigs are running 3500-4000 lb axles and easily twice the weight I run mine at.

 

[67cj5]

My 4x6 runs nose heavy but that also makes it rock solid at highway speeds. With my Subaru I do pack it with the tongue weight in mind given I can easily end up too heavy for the Subaru. But my Sequoia I don’t care given any added nose weight simply adds stability for my long highway trips. It runs happily at the highest speeds the Sequoia is happy doing 80-85 on those long desert trips. As for too heavy for the tongue structure mine never gets over 230 and loaded the trailer is in the 1500lbs or less all up.

But many of these jeep style rigs are running 3500-4000 lb axles and easily twice the weight I run mine at.

Yes Most Trailers are Nose Heavy but by how much is the key factor which is why those Nose Weight Gauges are a good Idea.

Yes Jeeps in the US have silly Towing Capacities where as in the UK and Australia the can Tow over 7700Lbs


The Annoying part about this Hitch weight Rubbish Is that No One can give Facts and figures of why My vehicle can Tow more that those in the US and AUS and yet they have reduced my Hitch Weight And Most of All NONE of these so called Experts can give me a way to Upgrade the Hitch weight From an Engineering Point of view Even though My Hitch is Rated 300% Higher and my Tyres are Uprated by 50% which has taken the Axle weights from 4100Lbs to just under 6200Lbs.

Either way the EU and UK BS is just unworkable

 

[dreadlocks]

I would not be surprised if SUV and cars are derated in towing capacity in US to push truck sales since thats the money/culture for the US auto industry.. like no cars here have any tow ratings published at all yet they do all over the rest of the world (yet you can outfit any car with a garbage hitch at uhaul).. pretty much all luxury european SUV's have ~8k tow ratings and never tow a thing.. last I looked domestically you had to get into like the mega SUV Suburbans/Escalades to find anything else that had more than 5k.. and those only had ~8k capacities.

I dont think europeans do anti-sway/equalizer hitches at all judging by hitch designs, that lets some trucks get over 1k tongue no problem, if you need more weight than that you go 5th wheel.. my Euro says no weight distribution devices in manual, none of the structure was designed for such forces.

This much I'm sure of, all over the world bureaucrats, politicians, mba's and lawyers are all pulling these numbers right out of their arses, without ever once even thinking of consulting an qualified engineer.. in the end your responsible for your load ultimately, regardless what anything else says.

 

[67cj5]

In the picture, the 2 water tanks are empty, the propane bottle is empty, and the 2 harbor freight pelican boxes are empty. The only thing in the box is 4 trailer jack stands for leveling the trailer. I think part of the problem is I don't have much weight in the back to counter balance any of the weight in the front.

And your Point IS ???,

From the Picture ALONE, It shows that the Centre Line of the Axle is about 2 or 3 Inches further forward of the Halfway point of the main Box which should make it easier to lift but as you say it is quite heavy even when empty, So either the Trailer has Excessive Iron work under the front of the main Box and very little under the Back half which tells me the Trailer has many design faults and even an empty Gas bottle weighting about 8 to 10 pounds It is set at roughly the halfway point between the Hitch and the Centre Line of the Axle which in real terms means that gas bottle is going to Add at leased 3 times it's weight being where it is than if it was placed above the Axle, So when The gas bottle and those 2 Jerry Cans are full they are going to equal about 300Lbs 3x their weight than they would if the were mounted above the Axle,

Seeing as those jerry cans are just used for water why not add 2 jerry can holders to the rear of the Trailer and then they will work as a counter weight for you, That Alone should reduce the Tongue weight by up to 30 to 40%

We are talking Loaded Trailers, A 15Lb/ 30LB Gas Bottle and 2x 20L / 5 US Gallon water jerry cans @ 8Lbs per US Gallon are going to Add another 100Lbs or more to the Hitch weight, What People need to realize is that The Trailers "A" Frame / Draw Bar was never intended as a place to Store Excess baggage and as such is like strapping Luggage on to the wings of a 747. Lol.

 

[67cj5]

I would not be surprised if SUV and cars are derated in towing capacity in US to push truck sales since thats the money/culture for the US auto industry.. like no cars here have any tow ratings published at all yet they do all over the rest of the world (yet you can outfit any car with a garbage hitch at uhaul).. pretty much all luxury european SUV's have ~8k tow ratings and never tow a thing.. last I looked domestically you had to get into like the mega SUV Suburbans/Escalades to find anything else that had more than 5k.. and those only had ~8k capacities.

I dont think europeans do anti-sway/equalizer hitches at all judging by hitch designs, that lets some trucks get over 1k tongue no problem.. my Euro says no weight distribution devices in manual, none of the structure was designed for such forces.

This much I'm sure of, all over the world bureaucrats, politicians, mba's and lawyers are all pulling these numbers right out of their arses, without ever once even thinking of consulting an qualified engineer.

Yeah Mate, I totally agree, My Truck / SUV has a Ladder Frame Chassis and can haul over 1500Lbs inside it and Tow another 6400Lbs So with a 7900Lbs Capacity I just don't get why they Mess with the Hitch weight because what ever Hitch Weight I Load on to the back Axle of the Truck is taken away from that 1500Lbs+ Load Capacity, So If I hook up a 5000Lb Trailer with a 500Lb hitch weight then I should reduce what I load in the truck by 500Lbs, You Can't have a Fixed Number Rating as in each Tow Vehicle having it's own Hitch weight because as Trailer weight and Size and Load Changes So Must the Hitch weight.

It's Not Rocket Science, This is just 4th Grade Maths.

 

[calicamper]

Yes Most Trailers are Nose Heavy but by how much is the key factor which is why those Nose Weight Gauges are a good Idea.

Yes Jeeps in the US have silly Towing Capacities where as in the UK and Australia the can Tow over 7700Lbs


The Annoying part about this Hitch weight Rubbish Is that No One can give Facts and figures of why My vehicle can Tow more that those in the US and AUS and yet they have reduced my Hitch Weight And Most of All NONE of these so called Experts can give me a way to Upgrade the Hitch weight From an Engineering Point of view Even though My Hitch is Rated 300% Higher and my Tyres are Uprated by 50% which has taken the Axle weights from 4100Lbs to just under 6200Lbs.

Either way the EU and UK BS is just unworkable

Easy my friend. Speed! Ever been passed by a pickup towing a trailer with 6 horses in it? Probably but how about when your doing 85mph 136kmph?.

Vehicle stability and trailer ratings are directly related to speed.

Every two years I do a big National Park trip with my family. 2700-3000 miles. My Yellowstone trip I was passed by a stock trailer full of saddled horses he was near 100mph.. I was doing 85 yes with my 4x6 which has done 10,000 miles many of which was over 70mph. Talking 6-9 hours of those speeds. It’s easy to in the US and yes common.
Auto makers aren’t dumb. They are out there seeing this like I have.

All the various countries I’ve driven, even ones with stunning wide sweeping highways trailered vehicles never do much over 45-55mph. That my friend is why a Land Cruiser in the UK can get an absolutely crazy tow rating and in the US we Cruiser owners know that 5000lbs is optimistic for anything other than slow speed 45mph parkways.

 

[67cj5]

Easy my friend. Speed! Ever been passed by a pickup towing a trailer with 6 horses in it? Probably but how about when your doing 85mph 136kmph?.

Vehicle stability and trailer ratings are directly related to speed.

Every two years I do a big National Park trip with my family. 2700-3000 miles. My Yellowstone trip I was passed by a stock trailer full of saddled horses he was near 100mph.. I was doing 85 yes with my 4x6 which has done 10,000 miles many of which was over 70mph. Talking 6-9 hours of those speeds. It’s easy to in the US and yes common.
Auto makers aren’t dumb. They are out there seeing this like I have.

All the various countries I’ve driven, even ones with stunning wide sweeping highways trailered vehicles never do much over 45-55mph. That my friend is why a Land Cruiser in the UK can get an absolutely crazy tow rating and in the US we Cruiser owners know that 5000lbs is optimistic for anything other than slow speed 45mph parkways.

I don't know how on earth a person would pull up a Horsebox fully loaded at 100mph, That speed with that weight in an emergency, That speed with that weight is an accident waiting to happen,