Tundra vs F150

[plainjaneFJC]

I call BS on 18mpg at 80 with 36's. I have owned 4 cummins I think, 2 duramaxes, currently a powerstroke 6.7 that might get 14 mpg with 35's doing 80 mph. The cummins was slightly better but nowhere that good.

 

[Deleted member 9101]

I call BS on 18mpg at 80 with 36's. I have owned 4 cummins I think, 2 duramaxes, currently a powerstroke 6.7 that might get 14 mpg with 35's doing 80 mph. The cummins was slightly better but nowhere that good.

I second the BS call. Seems a tad bit high.

 

[F350joe]

You paid thousands more to buy a diesel, you pay more for insurance, you pay more for maintenance, you pay more per gallon of fuel, you pay more for oil changes, and to top it off your repair cost are drastically more. At the end of the day a diesel cost much more per mile driven for the vast majority of consumers. Even if you only look at fuel economy, it takes hundreds of thousands of miles to recoup the increased purchase price of a diesel.

While the new diesel trucks deliver amazing performance while towing, it comes at a higher operating cost and reduced payload rating. The new breed of gas motors are making diesels far less appealing to people who track their operating cost.

Once Ford starts selling the "Godzilla" motor and Chevy counters it, diesels will be far less attractive to those who can do basic math.

I agree with you, modern diesels don’t really pencil out and the new 7.3 will probably be a big hit. The pre smog diesels though can be had for a good price, brought back to life, and do anything the modern ones can. It’s not hard to get another 200k miles out of a 5.9 or 7.3. Also, while diesel cost more, they resale for more too, you get that premium back when you sell it. That said I also agree with the guy that likes to do 80. The cliche smiles/gallon is worth something as well. Now, my 7.3 with 35s, gearvendor, fuel sipping tune, and every mod for efficiency will do 15mpg with a tail wind and a lot of downhill at 80mph. I’m only doing 1800 rpm at that speed but pushing a lot of air.

Tundra - one era
Ford- pre smog era (6.9 7.3), flailing figure it out years(6.0 6.2), and modern expensive complicated but torque monster years(6.7).

Tundra loses the pre smog era (late to the party), dominates the ford flailing years, found their niche and seem to be sitting out the big power era so far. I think a lot of this back and forth is applying one era strengths/weaknesses to a different era.

Tundra vs f150 is a fair comparison but was tundra ever suppose to compete with a Diesel super duty?

 

[Kors Camps]

I originally offered the 3/4 & 1 Ton comparison as a pre-owned vehicle alternative at a comparable price point to a new, reasonably optioned F-150. Diesel economy is fair comparison because F-150 comes in diesel.

Dudes, im not sure what sort of Flat Earth Mathematics you Diesel-Disbelievers subscribe to... The quantifiable reality is that on the whole, diesels perform better while hauling or towing. Some people actually put their full size trucks to work beyond hauling beer & groceries. The 25-40% increase in fuel economy absolutely pays financial dividends if your annual mileage is high enough.

Story Time:

I had a few evening beers in Death Valley with a German couple who were on a 3 year expedition through North and South America. Their 78 Series Landcruiser tows a small utility trailer and has 1600 miles of range. They had already completed Australia, South Africa, Western Europe and Iceland. They traveled the breadth of most states and some small countries without having to refuel. Epic! Only possible because of diesel.

Diesel makes sense virtually everywhere around the world besides ‘Merica. But our inordinate fuel subsidies work differently ‘round these parts, so i digress.

Its a sad day when the primary sales point going for the Tundra is that “Its Reliable Bruh”. Toyota’s offering the same reliability in equally capable but more efficient products in other marketplaces. I cant blame an objective shopper to lean towards Ford...

 

[Deleted member 9101]

I originally offered the 3/4 & 1 Ton comparison as a pre-owned vehicle alternative at a comparable price point to a new, reasonably optioned F-150. Diesel economy is fair comparison because F-150 comes in diesel.

Dudes, im not sure what sort of Flat Earth Mathematics you Diesel-Disbelievers subscribe to... The quantifiable reality is that on the whole, diesels perform better while hauling or towing. Some people actually put their full size trucks to work beyond hauling beer & groceries. The 25-40% increase in fuel economy absolutely pays financial dividends if your annual mileage is high enough.

******** @ annual mileage... It can easily take hundreds of thousands of miles for a diesel to reach a break even point ... And that can be increased exponentially by one out of warranty repair. The 8-9k upcharge for the diesel can take over a decade to balance out.

Clearly you have either never owned a full size diesel, or if you did you never tracked the operating cost. I can tell you for an absolute fact that any savings in fuel economy is more than offset by every other increased cost.

Here is a fun game: compare the price of an oil change for a 2019 6.2 gas and a 2019 6.7 powerstroke. (Every third oil change will cost more because you have to change the fuel filters on the 6.7)


Now take the price difference and see how long your 25-40% increased fuel economy will take to make up that difference. Suddenly a diesel makes less sense.

 

[Dalko43]

Once Ford starts selling the "Godzilla" motor and Chevy counters it, diesels will be far less attractive to those who can do basic math.

It's a pushrod v8 gasoline engine....stop pretending that it's going to be some magically efficient engine that will perform the same way as a diesel.

 

[tacollie]

If they had 1600 miles of range they were carrying extra fuel. There are plenty of people on "epic" trips with gas vehicles.

7.3 will be huge for fleet vehicles and guys driving 6.4s and 6.2 gas motors. Diesel guys will still buy diesel. Diesel F150 doesn't make sense to unless you're using it as a commuter car during the week.

 

[Buliwyf]

I originally offered the 3/4 & 1 Ton comparison as a pre-owned vehicle alternative at a comparable price point to a new, reasonably optioned F-150. Diesel economy is fair comparison because F-150 comes in diesel.

Dudes, im not sure what sort of Flat Earth Mathematics you Diesel-Disbelievers subscribe to... The quantifiable reality is that on the whole, diesels perform better while hauling or towing. Some people actually put their full size trucks to work beyond hauling beer & groceries. The 25-40% increase in fuel economy absolutely pays financial dividends if your annual mileage is high enough.

Story Time:

I had a few evening beers in Death Valley with a German couple who were on a 3 year expedition through North and South America. Their 78 Series Landcruiser tows a small utility trailer and has 1600 miles of range. They had already completed Australia, South Africa, Western Europe and Iceland. They traveled the breadth of most states and some small countries without having to refuel. Epic! Only possible because of diesel.

Diesel makes sense virtually everywhere around the world besides ‘Merica. But our inordinate fuel subsidies work differently ‘round these parts, so i digress.

Its a sad day when the primary sales point going for the Tundra is that “Its Reliable Bruh”. Toyota’s offering the same reliability in equally capable but more efficient products in other marketplaces. I cant blame an objective shopper to lean towards Ford...

I haven't completed America yet. Don't care about africa.

Don't overland with a 10 000# trailer. Yeah, that sounds like fun.

And we can drive in snow, now, not an hour from now while filling our neighbors homes with stinky diesel exhaust smoke.

Wait until you have to rebuild one for over $10 000 due to water in mexican fuel. You'll be over on this side of the fence, pretty darn quick then. There's 3 custom diesel pick-up truck shops between me, and Canton OH. All three have their parking lots filled with modern broken diesel trucks.

 

[Deleted member 9101]

Diesel F150 doesn't make sense to unless you're using it as a commuter car during the week.

Actually, that's when it makes the least sense. The 2.7 isn't far behind it in fuel economy and cost thousands less to buy and less per mile to opertate.

 

[redthies]

So I read up to page 2 and the Ford vs Toyota thread had already digressed to the gas vs diesel debate. I then skipped forward THIRTY pages and it’s STILL gas vs diesel. Neato.

My $.02 is this: drive what makes you happy. Life is short.

I’m currently owning 2 gas and 1 diesel. The gas engines are great. So is the diesel. I got my 2014 3500 Cummins truck to tow long distances. I’m usually at or near it’s max GVW. I also was a savvy shopper and bought it during Rams “no charge diesel” promotion so it cost the exact same as a gasser would have. I don’t think they do that anymore, but luckily, I’m not in the market for a new truck. Mine is capable of 18 mpg if I drive it right, but I usually enjoy all of that great torque and get around 14 mpg. My Land Cruiser gets the same 14 mpg, but in 4 years of ownership, and 40,000 miles, has cost me $230 in repairs. That’s hard to beat.

 

[tacollie]

Actually, that's when it makes the least sense. The 2.7 isn't far behind it in fuel economy and cost thousands less to buy and less per mile to opertate.

Honestly, I'm not sure why they even offer the diesel. If you're towing enough to need the diesel a 3/4 ton seems better to me.

 

[Deleted member 9101]

Honestly, I'm not sure why they even offer the diesel. If you're towing enough to need the diesel a 3/4 ton seems better to me.

I have no clue. Originally it was only offered in the really expensive trim levels to consumers and only fleets could get it in an XL. Now you can get it in an XLT so it is much more affordable.

 

[Bayou Boy]

I call BS on 18mpg at 80 with 36's. I have owned 4 cummins I think, 2 duramaxes, currently a powerstroke 6.7 that might get 14 mpg with 35's doing 80 mph. The cummins was slightly better but nowhere that good.

You guys can call BS all you want. I could care less what anyone else's truck gets. If nothing else those 3.54 gears Ram put in these trucks is certainly good for mileage on the highway.


Also who cares about a break even point? This isn't a business acquisition. Diesel gives you significantly more range and tows better. That's enough for a lot of people.

 

[Dalko43]

You guys can call BS all you want. I could care less what anyone else's truck gets. If nothing else those 3.54 gears Ram put in these trucks is certainly good for mileage on the highway.


Also who cares about a break even point? This isn't a business acquisition. Diesel gives you significantly more range and tows better. That's enough for a lot of people.

^This.

People will think nothing of buying a 3.5l ecoboost over a 2.7l for their F-150. Likewise, many people buy more powerful and more expensive versions of sedans and coupes (BMW's regular lineup vs its M lineup). Why should we treat diesel trucks any differently? Some people want the low-end torque offered by diesels...they're willing to pay a bit more up front for that extra performance.

If someone is truly concerned about preserving their finances, buy slightly a slightly used vehicle and hold onto it for at least 10 years, longer if possible...that's going to save you a whole lot more money than deciding between a gasoline versus diesel.

 

[battleaxe]

^This.

People will think nothing of buying a 3.5l ecoboost over a 2.7l for their F-150. Likewise, many people buy more powerful and more expensive versions of sedans and coupes (BMW's regular lineup vs its M lineup). Why should we treat diesel trucks any differently? Some people want the low-end torque offered by diesels...they're willing to pay a bit more up front for that extra performance.

If someone is truly concerned about preserving their finances, buy slightly a slightly used vehicle and hold onto it for at least 10 years, longer if possible...that's going to save you a whole lot more money than deciding between a gasoline versus diesel.

I agree mostly. Financially yes, it's something like 150,000 miles to break even on the price difference between gas and diesel.

The whole point that keeps getting missed/overlooked, is if you need the diesel, buy the Ford (or one of the other offerings). The Tundra does not, and likely will not ever come in a diesel. So the comparison is stupid. That horse died on page 1.