czukie
Active member
Huh?
Vagabond Outdoors Drifter
- Thread starter Michael Gibbs
- Start date
I think it was a reply to my comment that I hoped they didn't turn out to be like another Pelfreybilt. Taking in too many orders, way in over their heads, no real means of producing as many campers as they took deposits from and essentially funding current orders with new deposits. I mean that still remains to be seen.
Vagabond used to post camper rollout videos all the time on their IG. Haven't seen one since Nov 2021. Their latest IG post 4 days ago is about their new online "store" where you can buy products from their partners like totalchaos, alubox, nationalluna, bajadesigns, etc etc through them. I'm a skeptic and there is no way in hell I'd buy something from VO through their online store until they can get campers built. It seems a little odd that they would roll out an online store when they've got so much on their plate and difficulty building campers that they'd introduce something that only further complicates things and slows them down. Hate to say it but it only seems like another way for VO to funnel money into their business. Seems dubious to say the least.
grain_of_salt
Member
I'll believe that things have changed once he starts responding to his customers, delays or not. He's missed 4 of 4 Calendly appointments for me. Voicemails are perpetually full and darned if they ever responded to messages even when they weren't. Not sure if they are just scared to talk to people or what is happening, aside from a vague apologetic email every few months of constant prodding.
Since I've been trying since June to get some rudimentary questions answered, was hoping maybe one of y'all might be able to help. (Bless you. If by some wonder you live near Manitou Springs, CO area I'll buy ya a beer.)
1.) As far as build-process: the windows are cut out *after* the camper is welded up, right? Followed, finally, by powder-coating, etc? Have been trying to reach for options for a "late 2022 build date" and frankly worried, about VO just starting to weld campers without finalizing build / color options. They give the impression that they are pretty poor at logistics.
2.) Anyone know what windows are actually available moving forward? It's mentioned in that "newsletter" that they are going to a single-hole-size design, which is a great idea and would imply that their original "windoors" are going away, as might be the slider, in addition to the Front Runner being ditched.
3.)Since mattresses are one of the "hold ups" in production, I wonder if I could just ask for him to send tent insulation (another hold-up) on later, and make my camper without a mattress... just buying a Hest or similar instead. Insane that those weren't things that were being caught up on during the aluminum delays, but here we are.
4.) Will the "Upper" light illuminate the lower area? It seems like with the gap in front of the bed would allow the upper light to serve a dual purpose, as it shined through, lessening the need for "Lower" lighting.
5.) Definitely powder-coating the lower white for heat purposes... thoughts whether the upper (with a 175w Merlin solar) is worth powder coating for keeping heat down?
---- You guys are incredible and, in a near-literal sense, keeping me sane during this sloppiness.
Cheers-
*EDIT* - Looks like an Exped Megamat was added as an "option" for mattress, FYI:
Since I've been trying since June to get some rudimentary questions answered, was hoping maybe one of y'all might be able to help. (Bless you. If by some wonder you live near Manitou Springs, CO area I'll buy ya a beer.)
1.) As far as build-process: the windows are cut out *after* the camper is welded up, right? Followed, finally, by powder-coating, etc? Have been trying to reach for options for a "late 2022 build date" and frankly worried, about VO just starting to weld campers without finalizing build / color options. They give the impression that they are pretty poor at logistics.
2.) Anyone know what windows are actually available moving forward? It's mentioned in that "newsletter" that they are going to a single-hole-size design, which is a great idea and would imply that their original "windoors" are going away, as might be the slider, in addition to the Front Runner being ditched.
3.)Since mattresses are one of the "hold ups" in production, I wonder if I could just ask for him to send tent insulation (another hold-up) on later, and make my camper without a mattress... just buying a Hest or similar instead. Insane that those weren't things that were being caught up on during the aluminum delays, but here we are.
4.) Will the "Upper" light illuminate the lower area? It seems like with the gap in front of the bed would allow the upper light to serve a dual purpose, as it shined through, lessening the need for "Lower" lighting.
5.) Definitely powder-coating the lower white for heat purposes... thoughts whether the upper (with a 175w Merlin solar) is worth powder coating for keeping heat down?
---- You guys are incredible and, in a near-literal sense, keeping me sane during this sloppiness.
Cheers-
*EDIT* - Looks like an Exped Megamat was added as an "option" for mattress, FYI:
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Windows are definitely cut at the laser cutter before they receive them, and powder coating may be done before welding as well. At least that's what I remember Phil telling me when we were covering options.
grain_of_salt
Member
Ugh. I guess that makes it extra obnoxious that he's saying my parts are "at the laser cutter" when I've been trying to solidify my window options for the past 4 months. He doesn't know what windows are even being cut.
crazysccrmd
Observer
If they go with the typical online store these days they are just drop shipping from manufacturers and making a couple bucks without doing much work. Might be a decent way to get some cash flow for them without committing much time to that side of the business.
That is exactly how the store is set up, I agree it will be a good thing for them.
czukie
Active member
Exactly, the only way they are going bankrupt is if they are royally f’ing up somewhere behind closed doors somehow.…with the lack of communication the whole company is a mystery these days though ?
With that said…anyone have any update?
grain_of_salt
Member
Holy crap. For the first time ever, I can say that I have an update! After much hemming, hawing, and gnashing of teeth I talked to Phil for the first time in 2 years. Not necessarily new info, but maybe reassuring to others as well:
1.) Phil, or at least someone impersonating him, is alive.
2.) It sounds like a lot of the changes being made are to address the shortages VO encountered the last 2 years. Example: It sounds like their initial tent insulation fabric producer went out of business, meaning that they had to find a different one (which they found). They are mailing out insulation packages after the fact so that it doesn't slow down orders. Similarly, they are consolidating window sizes so that they can order laser-cut aluminum en masse, knowing that it will fit all windows. Larger orders = they can more effectively compete with others who are also buying up the aluminum stock and requesting laser cutting services.
3.) I certainly appreciated that he had real-world opinions on almost everything I had to ask him: color of powder coating, solar build-out, wire routing, placement of accessories, etc.
4.) It re-affirmed to me that the Drifter / Nomad is, at the time of install, the most customizable light weight camper available today. Phil seems willing to bend over backwards (possibly to the massive detriment of timelines) in order for his customer to get exactly the camper they are imagining. Maybe his biggest problem is just saying "no" to all the wild ideas of ours.
5.) He let me know that an "upper" light wouldn't be able to illuminate the lower level when closed, because the tent fabric would fold in and block it, which isn't a big deal, but a question I had.
6.) Another question I had: He confirmed that windows are cut out, ideally at the time of the initial laser cutting of the panels. It's much more efficient that way, rather than having to cut them out by hand, which should incentivize folks to make window choices early, I'd think.
7.) He was of the opinion that it's notably cooler, at least putting his hand on both at the same time on a hot sunny day, to powder coat the roof white, rather than leaving raw aluminum. So: as a desert-dweller, I'm sucking it up and getting the top white as well.
8.) I decided on a slider window for the passenger side and he confirmed that we can put L-Track on the top and bottom, so I can mount traction boards / fuel over the outside if I'm so inclined and it will clear the window. I think it's a cool idea.
Darned if I know the exact time I'll get a camper, but he seemed really flexible with pickup times and understanding of my work schedule in the coming months (I'm frequently out of the country/state). He said they have been working on making the shop more modular to store completed campers, in anticipation of all the completed coming batches, so that un-picked-up campers can be stored and don't impact timelines for new builds.
My camper isn't being welded yet, but talking to him certainly assuaged some of my fears of them quietly disappearing into the night with all our money.
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Anglin’ Man
New member
That’s cause Phil has a history of not following through on his promises very well. His average wait time now is 30+ months and only recently removed the “12 month wait time” advertisement from the website. I’ve been “promised” three separate completion dates (the earliest being 9 months ago) and still don’t have one.
Just like in your last post, his reasoning for fabric delays are allegedly said to be due to the fabric supplier going out of business? That’s the first I’ve heard of that and quite frankly why on earth would you not have an inventory of a product that is used in literally every single one of your campers? The lack of communication really raises lots of questions for lots of different situations lol
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SoCalTacoTruck
Active member
Don't do it again
Anglin’ Man
New member
You a moderator now? ? Comments like yours are just as derailing and divisive as my original post. With that said, I’ve edited my previous post to eliminate opinions that may be construed as rumors and any perceived insults towards Phil. My intent was not to shut down the thread as I think (unfortunately) a forum like this is necessary to communicate issues and experiences with VO. As far as I’m aware though I’m still allowed to be pissy about the situation and share my opinions, and experiences, whether they be positive or negative (no more insults, scouts honor). Both are equally as important to new people considering purchasing a VO camper as well as those who have already purchased.
czukie
Active member
I was more referring to the photo posted. I must have missed what it was in reference to