Will reducing wire size after a long run drop my voltage?

[DaveInDenver]

@FlipperFla, that looks like a Locoloc swaging tool, not a terminal crimper. How are the jaws on the dies marked? Is it 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 by chance? A crimper is going to marked in AWG and should have two types that correspond with the type of terminals, starter or battery lug.

 

[DaveInDenver]

For example the FTZ crimpers I have use rotating dies and list the combinations to select on the handles.

 

[FlipperFla]

@FlipperFla, that looks like a Locoloc swaging tool, not a terminal crimper. How are the jaws on the dies marked? Is it 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 by chance? A crimper is going to marked in AWG and should have two types that correspond with the type of terminals, starter or battery lug.

You are correct, they use them for sailboat rigging, it makes one heck of a crimp for terminals up to 3/0. I used to work at a West Marine and we had one on our sailboat rigging bench. The customers had to do their own sailboat rigging because of the liability factor if they would lose a mast or other damage. I was always making custom cables with the Ancor tinned wire, shrink tubing and terminals. Cant beat marine grade, my whole truck is wired with it ! LOL Employees got everything 10% above cost which really helped.

 

[DaveInDenver]

I wish sometimes I'd have sprung for a bench mounted crimper but since I currently don't have a bench that may not have been such a bad thing.

 

[FlipperFla]

I wish sometimes I'd have sprung for a bench mounted crimper but since I currently don't have a bench that may not have been such a bad thing.

I know what you mean I had it mounted on my bench at home but I couldnt take it to different work sites so I mounted it on a 2x10 and use 2 large C clamps attach it in different locations or have a coworker stand on it. I even attach it to a trailer bunk pad if one is around the boat yard.

 

[rayra]

I have read and now cannot find the articles discussing wire splicing and wire connections in "Off-Road" and
"Trailer" applications. These "Pro's" possibly self anointed recommend "Crimp" connectors for use in these applications rather than soldered connections due to vibration, moisture and other issues associated with this type of environment. The electrical theory is that "Crimp" connections are a more solid connection in high vibration situations that a soldered connection.

All recommended good quality "Crimp" connectors with Heat Shrink a part of the connector or added if not a part of the "Crimp" connector.

Everyone's thoughts?

yeah. that crap's all backwards. And do both. Crimp for mechanical strength and solder for conductance.

And the water simile is not a bad one, in terms of flow. Think of wiring like sprinkler piping. Diameters matter for total flow / carrying capacity, and joints matter. Undersizing is Bad. Oversizing is relatively o.k., as long as you don't get ridiculous about it?

 

[rayra]

Crimp is a normal word, no need for quotes.

An expert solderer can do as good a job, but takes a lot of knowledge and practice.

Crimping relies on expensive equipment, but once set up properly even a noob can get excellent **repeatable** terminations.

A proper crimp gains nothing from adding solder.

Yes adhesive-lined heatshrink is great, part of the fitting or as an add-on.

soldering doesn't take 'expert' skill. It's much like sweating a copper water pipe. You have to understand heat conductance and how the heated solder flows into a heated joint. Biggest mistakes noobs make is either overheating, spot heating, or cold joints. Gradual heating over a broader area, greater heating at the joint itself and introducing the solder only after things are just getting hot enough make all the difference. You can spot test the solder against the heated joint when you think things are close. When the solder melts with light contact, you are good to go and get it done quick before you overheat the joint and fry all the flux out and turn the copper purple. Oops.
Overheating matters MUCH more with fine electronics, requires more finesse and proper soldering iron wattage and tips and solder gauge. Battery cables not so much.

 

[DaveInDenver]

yeah. that crap's all backwards. And do both. Crimp for mechanical strength and solder for conductance.

If you crimp there's nothing to be gained by soldering. Copper has 13 times lower resistance than lead. The only material that conducts electricity better than copper is silver and I doubt you're talking about using silver solder. Once you crimp all the strands into a terminal there's both a mechanical connection and the best electrical connection you can make. Cover it in adhesive heat shrink and it's a connection that will last forever. Adding solder is just making the cable less resistant to vibration. The only reason to solder a connection is when you can't make an acceptable crimp.

 

[rayra]

"Adding solder is just making the cable less resistant to vibration. "
I'm mildly intrigued by that statement, but I've got too many evangelists and absolutists in my life as it is. So you do it your way and I'll do it mine.
Particularly as all my 1/0 cable runs are supported, clamped etc., 'vibration' doesn't apply.

as for your silver-solder guff, I'm in CA where one is far more likely to find silver solder than lead available for purchase. And most of my soldering these days is copper water fittings so I DO predominantly use silver, not lead.

 

[Umbrarian]

I'm wiring up an ARB 63 quart fridge in my 2018 GMC Sierra. I've already set up a dual battery system in the engine compartment with a blue sea ACR and fuse block.
Since i'll have about a 20 foot run from the second battery to where the fridge is going to be, i opted for 8 gauge OFC wire. I plan to install a couple different DC port in the bed. My main concern is to get as much voltage to the fridge port as possible. I was originally planning on installing a 1/4" slide on terminal to the 8 gauge wire and then tapping off of that port to run power to a USB and cigarette outlet. However it seems no one sells 1/4" blade terminals for 8 awg wire.

My question is, if i trim a few strand off of the 8awg wire so i can fit it into a 10 awg blade terminal, will that reduce my voltage at the fridge connector? Or will i still be seeing max available voltage that the 8 awg will allow?

Why not use the 20 foot ARB wiring harness?

http://store.arbusa.com/ARB-FRIDGE-FREEZER-WIRING-KIT-THREADED-SOCKET-10900027-P22817.aspx

 

[VoodooCLD]

Why not use the 20 foot ARB wiring harness?

http://store.arbusa.com/ARB-FRIDGE-FREEZER-WIRING-KIT-THREADED-SOCKET-10900027-P22817.aspx

I only want to run one set of wires from the engine compartment to the bed of the truck. Since i plan to also charge devices, run a fan, and power the fridge i opted for 8 gauge. Plus, i have a blue sea fuse block that i plan to run the wire out of, so the inline fuse would be redundant. I also didn't like that their web sight does not specify that it's pure oxygen free copper. It could very well be copper coated aluminum wire which would be a rip off at that price.

 

[VoodooCLD]

Copper coated aluminum is ripoff no matter what. I understand its common in the bullshitteroo business of selling stereos.

ARB stuff is expensive, but were that ’fridge harness using pure oxygen free copper, that harness would cost 1/2 as much the fridge itself.
At least to us mere humans, There is no useful benefit using pure oxygen free copper wire to power a ’fridge or any other appliance. Ordinary copper wire is already over 99.9%.
Pure oxygen free copper wires are the realm of NIST and noseringed fools.

Na, I got 25 ft of each red and black OFC copper wire for $33. Whether it's 99.99% OFC or 100% OFC doesn't matter to me, they will perform the same. After buying the ARB threaded connector for $9 i will only have a couple dollars more in my harness than the off the shelf ARB one.

 

[rkfoote]

I did the same setup in my Tacoma about 3 years back. The write up is here: https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/12v-bed-outlet-install-write-up.378833/
I ran 10 gauge wire to a fuse block in the bed with a 50 qt ARB fridge. Worked like a champ for 3 years (i've since upgrade to a Ram 1500 and about the do the same think again). On the tacoma it was simple as it had a composite bed. I'm thinking for the Ram i'll put all the electronics into a metal box and mount the box to the bed wall.
Only change I would have made would be putting in 3x 12v outlets instead of the gauge/usb/12v combo.

The fuse block was nice. I later added some LED backup lights (see: https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/12v-bed-outlet-install-write-up.378833/#post-11718310) and was able to tie into the existing power.
Just be sure to fuse everything properly (I think I had 30 amp on the wire at the battery, 15 amp for the 12v and 3 amp for backup lights and USB)

 

[VoodooCLD]

I did the same setup in my Tacoma about 3 years back. The write up is here: https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/12v-bed-outlet-install-write-up.378833/
I ran 10 gauge wire to a fuse block in the bed with a 50 qt ARB fridge. Worked like a champ for 3 years (i've since upgrade to a Ram 1500 and about the do the same think again). On the tacoma it was simple as it had a composite bed. I'm thinking for the Ram i'll put all the electronics into a metal box and mount the box to the bed wall.
Only change I would have made would be putting in 3x 12v outlets instead of the gauge/usb/12v combo.

The fuse block was nice. I later added some LED backup lights (see: https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/12v-bed-outlet-install-write-up.378833/#post-11718310) and was able to tie into the existing power.
Just be sure to fuse everything properly (I think I had 30 amp on the wire at the battery, 15 amp for the 12v and 3 amp for backup lights and USB)

Nice work, my setup is similar to yours. I actually purchased a blue sea dc panel just like yours however didn't like how the backside would be exposed to underside of the bed after mounting. I don't know how the toyota's are designed but on my GMC if you drill into the bed wall then you're basically exposed to everything the wheel wells kick up.

I've since bought a much cheaper surface mount unit that way i can just feed the wire through the bed wall and keep all the connections inside the housing. I'm removing the usb port from my unit and going to add the ARB threaded socket in its place.
I'll try and create a thread in the domestic forum for my install when i'm finished.

 

[Bayou Boy]

You guys are all missing the forest for the trees. Bantering on about expensive crimpers when the guy is going to use a junk blade terminal on 8AWG wire. Blade terminals are for your dishwasher.

On a moving vehicle it's ring terminals only. Period. Especially one that goes on rough roads, since this is an "expedition" forum.

Not to mention that if you are looking for voltage drop, a blade terminal is a good way to guarantee it.

If you are going to run multiple things with the fridge off of the 8AWG wire run it to a distribution panel/fuse block with a ring connector and then run 10AWG to the fridge with an SAE connector after you cut off the factory cigarette plug. You can put another SAE connector on the end with the cig plug to use when you have to use the fridge in another vehicle.