Winter/Snow Tires

[7wt]

I was actually thinking about 235/85/16 would be my preferred size. That is 30mm narrower than my current tires, which is fairly significant. Particularly for a winter tire to drive primarily on-road it seems that narrower would be preferable as you want to punch through and hit the pavement under the slush/snow.

I have BFG AT's in 235's on my 03 Tacoma and they work great in the snow. You are right about the tires getting through the slush. They give fantastic traction on pavement and they even do well off road in the snow.

 

[bigreen505]

With winter not too far away I have started to think about getting some snow tires for my '04 Tacoma. I was looking for opinions/suggestions for suitable tires. While the tires will be used for some driving in deep snow (Colorado powder), the reality is the majority of the miles will be on mountain highways. Previously I have had studded Cooper Discoverer M+S on my 88 4runner, but I would prefer a studless tire this time. The studded tires were loud and down right scary on dry concrete roads. Consumer reports gives a thumbs up to the Blizzack DM-Z3 and the Michelin Latitude X-Ice, does anyone have experience with either of these?

I run a studded Cooper Discoverer M/S in a 235/85 on my Trooper. I am, in general a big fan of studded tires. Basically any decent ice tire is better on ice than a studded tire, but studs handle the ice allowing the rest of the tire to be designed for more general snow use. So generally an ice tire will be better than a studded tire on ice, but the studded tire will do better in slush, wet snow and breaking through wind slabbed snow.

Where studs are downright frightening to me is on dried mag-chloride. Effing awful. I ran the car version of the Michelin X-Ice (first generation) on my Outback. They were excellent on ice and packed snow, and really good on dry road for a snow tire. They are one of the worst tires I have ever used (and I'm counting summer tires here too) in wet snow. Also surprisingly bad in rain. On the whole, they are the best all season tires I have ever run. The X-Ice2 basically takes all the traits of the X-Ice 1 and extends them.

If you want the best of the best, go with Nokian, but they are hella expensive. They start with an ice compound like the Blizzak, with a generic snow tread pattern, and then studs them. Stay away from the Vatiiva, it is not a snow tire. It is a Cooper ATR in a slightly different tread pattern. Also, understand that Nokians are designed for European conditions - i.e. high speed on packed snow. I think they tend to be a little lacking in dry, deep snow that won't stick together. Meadow Creek Tire at Colorado and I-70 is the regional importer for Nokian.

While I'm not over the moon about the studded Coopers, they are the best all around winter truck tire I have used in a variety of conditions. They remain my choice for commuting on 36 and I-70.

I suggest you do a search for snow tires on ih8mud. There have been some really good discussions there. The ones that tend to come up a lot are the Blizzak, Yokohama I/T and TrXus MT. PM Kcowyo about the TrXus as he had some mixed thoughts about them. If getting through deep snow is the top of your list, they may be worth considering. I've been told the soft rubber compound and sipes makes them decent on ice and hardpack, but no personal experience. A friend runs a studded Pirelli on her Suburban and loves them.

 

[R_Lefebvre]

Studs are for ice, not snow. Studs should be better on ice than any other tire. That is why there are two classes in ice racing: Studded and Rubber. The Studded class is faster.

 

[Rando]

I was under this impression too, however after poking around it seems that this is not always true. In a test on an ice rink, non studded Blizzacks did better on ice than studded WinterForce:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/testDisplay.jsp?ttid=94
I think that the WinterForce tires are bottom of the line tires, so this test maybe biased towards the top of the line Blizzacks.
A meta analysis of reviews also suggests this may be the case:
http://www.consumersearch.com/snow-tires/review

I was very happy with my studded Cooper M+S in the snow and ice, but I am hopping to avoid the studs on a new pair. I really didn't like how loud and squirrely the studs were, and they ripped up my garage floor, where I drive about 10' at 5MPH - it makes me wonder what I am doing to the road with studs.

I think I will check out the Blizzacks or the Geolanders.

Edit - maybe I should act fast, blizzacks are on sale for super cheap:
http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Sizes.jsp?make=Bridgestone&model=Blizzak+DM-Z3

Studs are for ice, not snow. Studs should be better on ice than any other tire. That is why there are two classes in ice racing: Studded and Rubber. The Studded class is faster.

 

[kellymoe]

Take a look at the Kedge Grip tires from Treadwright. I have been using their regular tires for years with no issues. Their Kedge Grip tires come in many different tread patterns. I searched high and low for some bad press on Treadwight retreads and I have yet to find any. Before you dismiss them I would take a serious look at using a set for a winter tire. I use their mud terrain tires year round in all conditions and have been very pleased though a mud tire is not the best snow tire it does okay.
http://www.treadwright.com/faq.php

 

[R_Lefebvre]

The other thing about Blizzaks is that besides being scary on bare pavement, they also wear really fast when run on pavement. You really need to be sure you NEED that much grip. When I lived in Ottawa, I ran them. I'm a little more south now, and don't feel the need.

 

[4Rescue]

Why not just look at a good all-terrain or mud-terrain type tire that can be run year round? Some people say they don't like them, but I'm on my second set of BFG all-terrains on my Land Cruiser and they may not be the best in DEEP snow but I've been impressed with them year round. I also got 70K miles from my last set. That's hard to beat.

For other options, I have heard very good things about the Super Swamper Trxus in the snow. It may not have the best road characteristics, but I'm guessing it will still be better than your studded tires you've been running.

I've also heard decent things about the Procomp Extreme All-Terrain. Good looking tire and should be on par with some of the others.

X2 on the BFG's... This winter will be their first real test but so far I'm REAL impressed with these tires in both wear, noise-levels, and they do pretty well for what they are off-road(they're not Simmex Treckers or Boggers so let's be fair eh). They got good reviews for foul weather traction (I live in Oregon so I'm about to get ready for the rainy season) and from what I've experienced they've been GREAT in the rain. PLUS could be had in a size I wanted (33x10.50) unlike most other brands.

Another tire I was REAL keen to try was the Bighorn MT in the Expo-aproved 255-85 size but chose not to go with new Rims just for the sake of new tires. However as I've heard and now seen these are pretty great tires all around.

Take your pick but I presonaly suggest a good agressive AT or milder MT for rain and snow unless it's REAL DEEP.

Cheers

Dave

 

[mjmcdowell]

Winter tires.....

I have (year around) Firestone Destination AT's on my "09" 4x4 Ford Ranger they worked fine in all conditions during last winter and this past summer, check the Tire Rack's site about reviews, Oh, I live on the southern edge of the Adk. mtns. here in NYS. and we do get winter up here. stay safe, mjmcdowell

 

[java]

run the blizzaks on my winter wheels for my audi, great in the rain and snow, ok in dry, not the best but worth it for winter only tires

 

[Rando]

Here is a follow-up question. I am still looking for something in 235/85/16 and am considering Cooper Discoverer M+S again, this time without the studs. My concern is that they are only available in load range E. Is this going to lead to an exceptionally harsh ride?

 

[pete.wilson]

Hey

I had a 94 Suburban with Hankook Dynapro MT's in 235/85/16's and they were very good in winter condtions, Kansas snow and ice. They performed good even on the highway. Before that, I had a 86 Jeep CJ7 with BFG AT's in 33/12.5/15's and they were good in MI snow. I'm running the Nitto Terra Grappler in 295/70/17's but have not used them in snow yet. Goodyear has a couple of new tires out that look good: the MTR and I forget the other, it's aggresive. Good luck.

Pete Wilson

 

[R_Lefebvre]

Here is a follow-up question. I am still looking for something in 235/85/16 and am considering Cooper Discoverer M+S again, this time without the studs. My concern is that they are only available in load range E. Is this going to lead to an exceptionally harsh ride?

That depends on what vehicle they're on, what suspension you're running, what tire pressure you use, and what your personal judgement of "harsh" is. Some people are more tollerant than others.

I have E's on my Disco, and I don't find it objectionable.

 

[bigreen505]

Here is a follow-up question. I am still looking for something in 235/85/16 and am considering Cooper Discoverer M+S again, this time without the studs. My concern is that they are only available in load range E. Is this going to lead to an exceptionally harsh ride?

Not an issue, they actually ride pretty soft with low air pressure. I run mine about 30 psi on the Trooper. If I am running a lot of twisty roads I'll actually bump up the pressure to about 34 psi to firm them up some. Yes, they are E rated, but they also are snow tires so they are a little more pliable. At least that is my guess, I've never run an E rated MT or AT, but they are about the same as my D rated MT/Rs.

If you spend much time driving on ice, I would definitely get them studded. Studded tires are scary on mag-chloride, but CDOT has scaled way way way back on that. The last couple winters have brought pretty ice roads. Also, CDOT has done an exceptional job removing snow, but leaving ice. Just my $.02.

 

[Rando]

To follow up on this thread, I ended up with Bridgestone Blizzack W965's in 235/85 R16 ordered through my local Sears.. It ended up being cheaper that tire rack without even considering shipping.

They only came in today, but it also happened to snow about 8" (and still falling). There was a night and day difference between my Geolander ATs on the way to Sears and my Blizzacks on the way back. ABS kicked in twice on the way there and I couldn't get it to kick in on the way home. The ride was also much quieter and smoother on the few patches of bare pavement.

For reference 235/85 16 does not look at all funny. I will update this as I put some more miles on the tires.

 

[deadbeat son]

Glad to hear the Blizzaks worked out well for you today! I put a set of Cooper Discoverer STs on my '09 Tacoma a couple of weeks ago and was happy on my daily Denver to Boulder commute today. I'm sure they don't have anywhere near the traction in this weather as your new tires, but I think they'll do just fine for me this winter. I'm interested to hear your thoughts as the season progresses.