Yeti Lawsuit

[Wilbah]

I am all for patents protecting true business innovation, and Im not for bigger guys beating up smaller guys just cause they can. But that said, some times a little guy tries to infringe on someone's successful patent and they should be stopped. As others have said- make enough changes to warrant the product without infringing on the patent.

All that said I checked the RTIC website and it seems I can still buy a RTIC cooler (at least the ones they have in stock) so maybe I am missing something?

 

[jeep-N-montero]

I'm surprised this thread taken this general direction. I avoided clicking on this thread all week because I assumed it would take a decidedly "pro Yeti" tone. In the past ,ExPo threads like this were prone to being staunchly on the side of the luxury label...no matter the product. Value wasn't given much credence, it was all about pinnacle performance. If you were foolhardy enough to advocate a product based on value you were quickly scorned by all the "buy once cry once" and "my life depends on the performance of my kit" crowd. Am I to assume the Overland arms race has subsided? Are we moving to a point where the concentration of this hobby has transitioned from the collections to the experiences?
.

Full disclosure: I own and am satisfied with an Ozark Trail 73 high performance cooler and OT 20oz and 30oz Tumblers.

Maybe folks are finally realizing that they can get the same product for less money and don't feel the need to pay more just to "look cool", not to mention the Yeti is more likely to be stolen.

 

[Roger M.]

I never really understood the "shade" some folks like to throw on YETI.

The Overlanding world is full of what are definitely "lifestyle" products that can easily be dismissed - Earthroamer (a "way too large" vehicle for Overlanding) but very cool, Snow Peak (seriously overpriced) but very well designed, and on and on and on.

I've got a few YETI items in my kit, including the Tundra45 cooler and a few of their mugs, cups and koozies ... and I purchased them primarily because they were on the shelf in my local bricks and mortar camp store, their quality is very high and very consistent, and perhaps most important of all ... I really enjoy owning and using the Yeti products I've purchased.

I'll never miss the few extra bucks I might have paid for YETI stuff, and wouldn't for a second bother throwing any serious "shade" (outside of attempts at humor) on any alternate quality product folks may have chosen to purchase instead of YETI ... (I simply don't care what other folks purchase).

There is also an undeniable advantage to dealing with, and purchasing from - a company that was here yesterday, is still here today, and will likely be here 10 and 20 years from now - as YETI will no doubt be, along with Coleman, Jeep, BF Goodrich, Goal Zero, and UCO (whose chandelier 3-candle lantern lights my camp without fail, and for pennies a night).

Horses for courses, peace to all

 

[Honu]

yeti is only 10 year old company I think ?

engel is what 50 years or more ?

how old is coleman etc..

 

[Roger M.]

Coleman started selling lamps in 1900, so 117 years ago!

 

[downhill]

I think that one aspect of all this that gets missed is the chilling effect that copycats have on the products that we all get to enjoy. Far from promoting "competition", or "innovation", stealing anothers' work harms the very people, the ONLY people who actually bring about positive changes. For every person that actually brings a positive change, there are a hundred vultures waiting to carry it away. Anyone who attempts to enter the market with a new idea, or a market changing upgrade, has to invest an enormous amount to tool up and to establish the market for that product. It's pretty easy for a copy cat to come in cheaper when they have not invested any of that sweat and capitol. These people never show up until that capitol is spent by someone else. It's especially demoralizing when the public you attempted to serve turns on you, and accuses you of gouging.

I understand that most people never have to think about the nuances of this topic. If you have been an innovator, you think about it a lot. Sometimes, the details of what is infringed is not obvious to a lay person. Anyone with any sense knows when they go into business, that these vultures are coming. You have to be aggressive in dealing with them. I'm all for real competition, but copying the essence of whatever the product is, is theft. Those copied items are stolen goods, just as surely as if they broke into a warehouse and took them. That is my opinion anyway. I think it is too bad that patent infringement is a civil matter and not criminal. The harm is to all of us.

An interesting case study is that of RCA. They were notorious patent thieves. They stole the rastering image technology that makes television possible and they stole frequency modulation (FM) radio technology. Both of the original innovators were destroyed by it. The former was bankrupted, and the latter jumped from a 13 story window and killed himself. Both won patent suits that did nothing to protect them. The latter was granted posthumously. Our loss. Who knows what else those men might have brought us?

For this reason, I shop for the best value, but I don't even consider copied products or knock offs.

 

[perterra]

I think that one aspect of all this that gets missed is the chilling effect that copycats have on the products that we all get to enjoy. Far from promoting "competition", or "innovation", stealing anothers' work harms the very people, the ONLY people who actually bring about positive changes. For every person that actually brings a positive change, there are a hundred vultures waiting to carry it away. Anyone who attempts to enter the market with a new idea, or a market changing upgrade, has to invest an enormous amount to tool up and to establish the market for that product. It's pretty easy for a copy cat to come in cheaper when they have not invested any of that sweat and capitol. These people never show up until that capitol is spent by someone else. It's especially demoralizing when the public you attempted to serve turns on you, and accuses you of gouging.

I understand that most people never have to think about the nuances of this topic. If you have been an innovator, you think about it a lot. Sometimes, the details of what is infringed is not obvious to a lay person. Anyone with any sense knows when they go into business, that these vultures are coming. You have to be aggressive in dealing with them. I'm all for real competition, but copying the essence of whatever the product is, is theft. Those copied items are stolen goods, just as surely as if they broke into a warehouse and took them. That is my opinion anyway. I think it is too bad that patent infringement is a civil matter and not criminal. The harm is to all of us.

An interesting case study is that of RCA. They were notorious patent thieves. They stole the rastering image technology that makes television possible and they stole frequency modulation (FM) radio technology. Both of the original innovators were destroyed by it. The former was bankrupted, and the latter jumped from a 13 story window and killed himself. Both won patent suits that did nothing to protect them. The latter was granted posthumously. Our loss. Who knows what else those men might have brought us?

For this reason, I shop for the best value, but I don't even consider copied products or knock offs.

The first high end cooler I saw was Australian, saw two different brands I bet 15 years before I ever even heard of Yeti. A guides boat I fished in Key West in 2000, eva cool or icey tek, maybe esky, cant remember now but Yeti was far from the first. So I guess you have to make a choice as to how far to dig to call it a copy. I mean you should really be using an Aussie cooler if you wanted the original.

 

[Ducky's Dad]

I mean you should really be using an Aussie cooler if you wanted the original.

Or a medical cooler used for transporting tissue samples and transplant organs. The Yeti and others are just higher end technologies filtering down to the consumer level. There is nothing magic about Yeti.

 

[krax]

There is nothing magic about Yeti.

No, but there's something magic about their marketing campaign. The time it took to go from a niche product to a lifestyle brand is pretty astounding. It's almost like they were trying to see what they could get away with putting the Yeti name on, and as long as they included a sticker for the buyer's vehicle people kept buying. In their defense, I've only ever seen top quality from them, right down to the high-priced bottle openers.

The knock-off issue is something else entirely. The knock-offs (and to be clear, by "knockoff" I'm referring to the cheaper coolers that look exactly like the Yeti product from afar, and not the high-end coolers from brands like Engel and Pelican) may be more of a demand for the "technology" from people that can't/won't pay the premium for it. There's only so many ways to make a good cooler that'll double as a bear container. My issue with RTIC was that they made a blatant copy and used Yeti's name/brand as part of their marketing tools. The Ozark Trails (Walmart) brand astonishingly had the moral high ground with their coolers.

Buy the highest quality, most ethically made product you can afford. You'll never regret it.

 

[slowtwitch]

I think a lot of people support the lawsuit because "yetis are made in America" but if you actually read their website only the rotomolded stuff is made in the US, the rest is made in china in probably the same factory as their competitors

"Our Tundra coolers are manufactured in the USA at facilities located in Iowa and Wisconsin as well as at a facility located in the Philippines. Our Hopper coolers are manufactured in China."

 

[slowtwitch]

Same business model as UnderArmour and dozens of others. Get to market early with something slightly different, hype the hell out of it to create buzz, then charge a premium because it is "special." Lots of lower cost alternatives to UnderArmour that work just as well (5.11, Champion, etc.). Lots of lower cost alternatives to Yeti that work just as well, but you don't have to pay the premium for all the hype.

Agreed. And a cool name. Marketing 101. Get every hodad out there to wear a YETI hat and put a sticker on their truck. The Yeti bike company did the same in the late 80's onward.

 

[downhill]

No, but there's something magic about their marketing campaign. The time it took to go from a niche product to a lifestyle brand is pretty astounding. It's almost like they were trying to see what they could get away with putting the Yeti name on, and as long as they included a sticker for the buyer's vehicle people kept buying. In their defense, I've only ever seen top quality from them, right down to the high-priced bottle openers.

The knock-off issue is something else entirely. The knock-offs (and to be clear, by "knockoff" I'm referring to the cheaper coolers that look exactly like the Yeti product from afar, and not the high-end coolers from brands like Engel and Pelican) may be more of a demand for the "technology" from people that can't/won't pay the premium for it. There's only so many ways to make a good cooler that'll double as a bear container. My issue with RTIC was that they made a blatant copy and used Yeti's name/brand as part of their marketing tools. The Ozark Trails (Walmart) brand astonishingly had the moral high ground with their coolers.

Buy the highest quality, most ethically made product you can afford. You'll never regret it.

You get it.

One reason anyone new to the market with a product charges the highest prices they can, is because THEY KNOW that at best they have 2 years before the "competition" shows up and undercuts the hell out of them. They have a limited amount of time to amortize the cost of molds, tooling and marketing before profitability drops to the point that they may never recover that cost. Remember, they start with a vision. There is no guarantee that their vision will take off. The copies have no burden of developing a market. All they have to do is say "we are just like Yeti", because Yeti has done the work. It is the market that creates this "hype" cycle. No manufacturer can take the luxury of letting his new product mature in the market over time. Once they reach the point that Yeti has, they are probably better off selling out to ACME Outdoors. From here on, it will be a ******* storm of lawsuits, ever dropping revenue, and a market who gleefully drives the whole mess.

 

[Fireman78]

Weird, just ordered from the RTIC site yesterday. No mention of lawsuit and same products as before lawsuit. Getting a 45 qt tan. (No vehicle sticker needed).


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[CSG]

Rock on yeti !! And I call BS on your Walmart brand keeping hot drinks hot the same as yeti and cold drinks cold the same !! Not even close in most cases ! That's why independent reviewers and just real life users .fork over the $$$ . Stanley ... No! And on and on !

Wrong. Bigtime.

 

[Fireman78]

I just bought several Ozark Trail tumblers. I added them to my collection of Yetis and RTIC ones. As far as I'm concerned they are exactly the same except price!!


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