How capable IS a Tacoma?

[Streakerfreak]

That would be your personal opinion.

AND the Frontier of course I am a Frontier and a Tacoma kind of guy.

I had an 02 Frontier and I loved that thing. Yes much different then the 05 Frontier, but good quality and performance.

 

[jh504]

I hope in my post no one thought I was bashing the new tacos. I really like them, and I think they are a great truck. Hopefully in years to come they will prove themselves as well. My personal choice would be the compact 01-04 simply because I am a light truck guy. I would much rather have a compact truck over a midsized because it is better for me. And yes the trails I run here in NC are extremly tight!

 

[mcm4090]

Now I don't have a Taco but I do have a midsized truck. The wiidth of truck is greater and is noticable on the trails in the east but I have done every trail at URE in N.C.

I do enjoy the size since I have two (one is a teenager) and with the depth of the bed I am able to carry on my camping and trail gear for a four day trip.

 

[Streakerfreak]

Now I don't have a Taco but I do have a midsized truck. The wiidth of truck is greater and is noticable on the trails in the east but I have done every trail at URE in N.C.

I do enjoy the size since I have two (one is a teenager) and with the depth of the bed I am able to carry on my camping and trail gear for a four day trip.

When it was time for me to get out of my Frontier I had a long look at both the new Frontiers and the new Tacomas. The dirty truth is... it was the styling that sold me on the Tacoma.

I loved the styling of the 01-04 Frontiers, but there was something about the new ones that just did not work for me. I actually like the styling of the old Frontiers vs the old Tacomas and visa verse with the 05+ versions.

 

[the dude]

Thanks for some really good responses.

Are there any mechanical issues/differences that people don't like? I am a big fan of lever transfer cases and manual hubs, and I am sure in time these "fixes" will be available for the 05+ tacos (if they aren't already built)

But what about engines, transmissions, axles ect. Did toyota make improvements on the newer tacos?

 

[Streakerfreak]

Thanks for some really good responses.

Are there any mechanical issues/differences that people don't like? I am a big fan of lever transfer cases and manual hubs, and I am sure in time these "fixes" will be available for the 05+ tacos (if they aren't already built)

But what about engines, transmissions, axles ect. Did toyota make improvements on the newer tacos?

There was a problem with some of the 05 models and their rear ends, but that issue has been fixed. I can't remember the exact issue though. I'm sure someone else can chime in.

There is also the problem with the rear springs not being strong enough. Some people have to fight to get them fixed, others have no problem. It was not an issue for me as I had switched to Alcans anyways.

There were a few other smaller problems, but I can't remember them.

 

[maxama10]

As much as I hate to say it,

there is one guy on TN and TTORA

Tacogrande/Tacosupreme


beats the piss out of his truck and he says it is going to be destroyed soon and he is going to get something else.

He's made a ton of modifications, and now says that it is not a good vehicle for a starting point for someone like him.

As I said though, he's beating the snot out of the truck and drives it daily on one of the autobahns.

Edit: our stumptaco wheels with him over there

So, you could also take it the other way and say it is a good truck for putting up with that, but he says he is going to destroy it or is well on the way to destroying it. Either way.

 

[Martinjmpr]

Using this logic, we should all scrap or EFI engines, and see what it would take to perform a conversion back to a carburetor. Adoro la cerradura de vapor :cow:
Oh yea, and lets toss out our electric starters and bring back the hand crank

Just messin with you Martin. The new FJC's have a manual transfer case shifter, so someone will figure out how to retrofit it into the Tacomas given that most of the other drivetrain parts are the same. But regardless, strictly mechanical parts will continue to become more and more obsolete - no way to stop that.

Ah, yes, the Reductio Ad Absurdum argument.

I have no problem with technological advancement. Given that may first 4x4 was a 1957 International Travelall (making it about 5 years older than me when I bought it in 1979) I appreciate a lot of things that have improved. In fact, I go against the grain of many younger Toyota fans who seem to worship the solid-axle pre-86 trucks. As an owner of a 1985 Solid Axle Toyota 4x4 I can tell you that IFS is a vast improvement. Same with EFI, electronic ignition, power steering and brakes, AC and the like.

What I have a problem with is unneccessary technology that adds complexity without adding any real tangible benefit.

I'll trade off, for example, the fact that an AC compressor might fail and cause other problems because the benefit - not burning up in the Summer - is worth it. I'll trade off the complexity of electronic ignition - and the fact that if your computer dies the only thing you can do is replace it, at a probably exorbitant cost - because in exchange I get a much more reliable and maintenance-free ignition. I'll trade off the complexity and expense of an IFS system (and the fact that it limits articulation and makes lifting a vehicle more difficult and expensive) because in return I get a vehicle with significantly better road manners and a vehicle that can go more than 10mph on a washboard road.

But what benefit does the electic T-case or the power windows give you? The electric t-case in particular is a benefit to the designer, because they can put the switch wherever they want and they don't have to design two different interiors, one for the 4x4 that has a big cutout on the transmission tunnel and one for the 4x2 that doesn't. But for the end user all they've done is taken a system that worked fine the way it was and introduced yet another possible point of failure. Same with power windows. Yes, it does let the driver open the passenger window without having to reach over, but besides that, what is the advantage? Again, a potential point of failure has been introduced into a system that worked fine the way it was.

At the stock show in January (jointly sponsored by Toyota and Dodge) there was a nice display of some big work trucks. Now these aren't pampered suburban garage trucks, these were by-God farm and ranch trucks being marketed to people who would actually use them. Anyway, one thing I noticed on the Dodges was that the half-ton models all had nice, comfy leather or velour seats, automatic transmissions, IFS and an electronic T-case, as well as power windows, door locks, RKE, etc.

What was interesting was that the 1-ton dually flatbeds on display had simple vinyl seats, a solid axle, a manual transmission (6 speed), a manually shifted T-case and crank windows. Was it because the company wanted to save money for the potential buyer? I suppose that's possible (although these trucks sell for upwards of $50k new, especially with the Cummins Turbo Diesel, so it's hard to imagine that saving money is much of a concern) but it seems more likely that Dodge (and their potential buyers at the stock show) realized that these older, simpler components were just more reliable and more likely to survive the rugged use to which a farm/ranch truck is put.

 

[heeltoe989]

As much as I hate to say it,

there is one guy on TN and TTORA

Tacogrande/Tacosupreme


beats the piss out of his truck and he says it is going to be destroyed soon and he is going to get something else.

He's made a ton of modifications, and now says that it is not a good vehicle for a starting point for someone like him.

As I said though, he's beating the snot out of the truck and drives it daily on one of the autobahns.

Edit: our stumptaco wheels with him over there

So, you could also take it the other way and say it is a good truck for putting up with that, but he says he is going to destroy it or is well on the way to destroying it. Either way.

Too me this seems just so pointless and a large waste of money. Show me any truck that will take a large amount of abuse, none will without putting a little bit of care back into it. Any farm or ranch truck is usually pretty well taken care of, because of its life, plane and simple "IT HAS TO WORK AND MAKE MONEY"

Living in Alberta Canada and the oil patch the average life span for one of our one ton Ford, Chevy, Dodge is about 80000 KM and there worn out....everything in the drive train is done, this is all due to abuse.

My way of thinking is that, sure I abuse my truck wheeling, but I take care of it and I think most of us do, because we don't want to be in the middle of now where with a broken down truck. The only way you'll get something to last in really hard abuse conditions, is build a one off type truck built specific for the application, or build the hell out of a one ton, which will cost well into the 100K.

My 2 cents.

 

[heeltoe989]

Thanks for some really good responses.

Are there any mechanical issues/differences that people don't like? I am a big fan of lever transfer cases and manual hubs, and I am sure in time these "fixes" will be available for the 05+ tacos (if they aren't already built)

But what about engines, transmissions, axles ect. Did toyota make improvements on the newer tacos?

Everything on the new Taco was shared with the previous Gen Tundra, axles, Transmission and transfer case I think, and the 4.0L V6 came from Lexus's Shelf. So yes everything got a little bigger on the new Tacoma and still proven items.

 

[Spenser]

First, my Tacoma is not 4 wd but it is my first new Toyota since grad school in 1984 when I had similar 2 wd Toyota with 200k that took me all over Idaho, Wyoming and MOntana for 5 years. This truck replaced a beloved saab wagon with 199,960 miles that was rear ended while stopped, with me in it, by an 84 cadillac doing 55. Saabs work in accidents! Anyway, I went looking for the typical replacement, another used saab (had 4 before the wagon), audi, merc, etc as daily driver for work. Found nothing decent for the price paid by insurance company. Happened to swing by Toyota dealer to check out LC's and saw the Tacoma. Missed having a PU so took one for a drive and I am big person and had to say that the regular cab truck ROCKED for leg room and size, in comparison even to my saabs. Then I saw the price for quaility-14k with AC, tilt, and CD player. You cant touch used cars for that now adays! Not only that, but they gave me another $1k off for being new toyota owner and threw in auto transmission since my wife cant drive a stick.As you can see, I put on new shocks and bigger tires to make it a little tougher to haul dirt, crap and trees from property. I use it as my daily driver, averaging 25 plus MPG and it takes me pretty much everywhere I need to go fishing, hunting and related driving around New England. It isnt a hard off road vehicle, it is tough to get up my driveway and dirt road in winter, since it is only 2 wd but even the stripped down version is a good car for the money, and relatively comforatble for a tall person that has trouble finding cars that fit. One of the earlier commetns regarding the options pacakges are spot on-I wanted crank windows and hand locks, but asked about a king cab 2 wd version. I could have gotten the 2 wd king cab, but the price jumped to $20k+, and had to come with power windows, locks, etc, which I didnt want or need, so that is where they get you. Bottom line, the truck is economical, makes me laugh every time I get in it and go somewhere and is just fun to have, plastic bed or not.

 

[Martinjmpr]

First off, let me say that if my earlier posts made it sound like I'm "bashing" the 05+ Taco, that wasn't my intention. I'm sure those of you who have your 05+ Tacos like them just fine, and I certainly see a lot of them out and about. So I hope nobody took offense at that.

Second, it seems to me that what's been happening in the car market is that as the American marques fade, Toyota and Honda have been moving steadily "up market." IOW they are making their vehicles more expensive and adding more features. Things that used to be options become standard, that sort of thing.

What does that do to the truck market? Well, IMO it creates a vacuum at the "bottom" end of the market (especially since the bargain-basement Ranger is slated to be taken out of production after 2009.)

So the million $$ question is, who fills that vacuum? I think if Toyota was smart they'd import some no-frills Hiluxes or come out with a no-frills truck to compete, but that may not be viable. Hyundai or Kia could come in with a stripped down, no-frills truck and undercut Toyotas price and I think they would do very well, especially if they offered it with a fuel-sipping 4 cyl and a simple 5 speed and regular 4wd setup. It wouldn't be a speed demon but it would work, and more importantly it might get the same 25mpg that my 85 Toyota pickup routinely returned. Combine that with a price in the mid- to high-teens for a 4wd and I think they'd have a real hit on their hands.

Another possibility is Mahindra coming in with a small truck.

I think it may be difficult for younger people to understand, but Toyota didn't enter the market as the 800lb gorilla they are now. They entered the market as a niche-filling maker of small, efficient cars. That niche still exists, even if Toyota's now too big to fill it.

 

[heeltoe989]

First off, let me say that if my earlier posts made it sound like I'm "bashing" the 05+ Taco, that wasn't my intention. I'm sure those of you who have your 05+ Tacos like them just fine, and I certainly see a lot of them out and about. So I hope nobody took offense at that.

Second, it seems to me that what's been happening in the car market is that as the American marques fade, Toyota and Honda have been moving steadily "up market." IOW they are making their vehicles more expensive and adding more features. Things that used to be options become standard, that sort of thing.

What does that do to the truck market? Well, IMO it creates a vacuum at the "bottom" end of the market (especially since the bargain-basement Ranger is slated to be taken out of production after 2009.)

So the million $$ question is, who fills that vacuum? I think if Toyota was smart they'd import some no-frills Hiluxes or come out with a no-frills truck to compete, but that may not be viable. Hyundai or Kia could come in with a stripped down, no-frills truck and undercut Toyotas price and I think they would do very well, especially if they offered it with a fuel-sipping 4 cyl and a simple 5 speed and regular 4wd setup. It wouldn't be a speed demon but it would work, and more importantly it might get the same 25mpg that my 85 Toyota pickup routinely returned. Combine that with a price in the mid- to high-teens for a 4wd and I think they'd have a real hit on their hands.

Another possibility is Mahindra coming in with a small truck.

I think it may be difficult for younger people to understand, but Toyota didn't enter the market as the 800lb gorilla they are now. They entered the market as a niche-filling maker of small, efficient cars. That niche still exists, even if Toyota's now too big to fill it.

Very true, I still love the very first little Toyota 4x4 trucks, I just don't fit in the very well.

No offense taken either :beer:

I get bashed all the time by my Ford, chevy, dodge friends for having a "little toy truck"

 

[blatant]

I'll play.

I bought an o7 4wd regular cab, 5spd. i'm 6'3 225 and very surprisingly fit fine, now this is a bench seat. Earlier models are much tighter than the o5. I like it bigger.

It took me QUITE a while to find this particular truck as it has


4cyl
5sp,
Roll down windows
rear slider
4x4.
trd/bilsteins and skids.

Apparently like 95% of these new taco's are all power.

Now i don't "wheel" but i do a ton of camping and forest road exploring. So the truck gets used. Probably about 3-500miles a month of being jostled around and shaken up on miserable dirt roads per mth.

I just felt that the least amount of power options, the better, considering my use. This seemed like the right choice for me.

 

[Streakerfreak]

So the million $$ question is, who fills that vacuum? I think if Toyota was smart they'd import some no-frills Hiluxes or come out with a no-frills truck to compete, but that may not be viable. Hyundai or Kia could come in with a stripped down, no-frills truck and undercut Toyotas price and I think they would do very well, especially if they offered it with a fuel-sipping 4 cyl and a simple 5 speed and regular 4wd setup. It wouldn't be a speed demon but it would work, and more importantly it might get the same 25mpg that my 85 Toyota pickup routinely returned. Combine that with a price in the mid- to high-teens for a 4wd and I think they'd have a real hit on their hands.

I 100% agree with you.