1998.5 Dodge Ram CTD - Sally

frojoe

Adventurer
I was originally going to copy my friend's 2nd gen and have the sliders mounted flat, but something about that just kind of stuck out in my eyes.. made the sliders look more like platforms, and just made them a bit more obvious-looking.. a bit too obvious-looking.

Here the sliders are, mocked up in a flat orientation...

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And here they are with a 15-degree up angle. I find that walking past them, maybe 10ft away, they line up better with my eyesight line and look a bit thinner and less obvious...

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frojoe

Adventurer
For the legs of the sliders to the frame.. I wanted something a bit beefier than 0.120" wall tubing. Also, DOM is hella expensive right now.. so I opted for 1.5" schedule 80 pipe.. it ends up something like 0.24" wall and 1.875" OD, and was quite a bit cheaper. And even if the pipe's A53 mild steel material strength is down in comparison to 1026 DOM tube material, I'm up a fair amount in bending strength purely due to the wall thickness and cross-sectional area.

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frojoe

Adventurer
Mmmm.. dat droop tho! :sneaky:

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And for the frame plates that the legs weld to, I went with 1/4" angle iron, in a minimum height of 4" tall, and 5" tall when possible, and 3-6" wide depending on the space on the frame and holes etc to weld around...

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This is the rough angle I was talking about, that from "head height" the sliders appear pretty minimal...

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wfv56

Active member
I agree the upangle looks much better. Based on the past use of the truck it may allow them to live a additional 15 minutes as well.?
 

wfv56

Active member
By the way you mentioned a previous Nova build early in this thread. You have a link to that build?
 

cd_193

New member
Man, this build just gets better and better.

Are there any updates on the ATP sound insulation pieces you installed? I've been really interested in picking that kit up for my truck.
They don't list costs or anything on their site either, and like you said not much about them on forums.
You're actually the first person I've seen post about them in a while! Including the install pictures which was helpful.
 

frojoe

Adventurer
Thanks!

For the quiet blankets, I still haven't had the chance to install the turbo+manifold blanket.. I had to modify it to add a steel eyelet for my EGT probe to pass through, as well as re-route my turbo oil feed line as its fitting at the filter housing was too close to the SteedSpeed manifold to let the quiet blanket fit past.

Still very happy with the oil pan and valvecover blankets.. if you're standing 5ft away from the front of the truck, it is significantly quieter... like the sound level of a modified New Body Style Duramax or so.. certainly not the traditional noise level associated with a VP44 24V.

I've attached my measured sound levels (further details about the phone app used and my measurement thought process are in a previous post ~2 pages back) including the valvecover blanket. Also attached is my invoice, so you can see the part pricing for the major blankets.

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wfv56

Active member
Any thoughts on why the latest Cummings are so much quiete? That Nova build is crazy. Any quarter mile times?
 

frojoe

Adventurer
For noise on a 24V, it all has to do with the injection pump, injector style, and injection pulses.

A 12V with a P7100 or a 24V with a VP44 relies on the injection pump to individually pressurized each line, and mechanically pop open the injector. That right there introduces a lot of noise from the mechanical operation of the injectors, with metal shuttle valve and spring clanking around via hydraulic pressure. Due to this mechanical-hydraulic operation, there can only be one injection pulse per piston cycle, so it ends up being a big hit all at once in the combustion chamber.. another source for noise. This can be tamed a bit by retarding the injection event to be less-advanced relative to piston TDC.. but that goes against what a lot of the hotboiiiiss want with their coal-rolling diesel street race trucks that need to make maximum power at all times. Generally speaking, the less advance on the injection timing the easier cold starts are, the quieter the injection "hit" event is, but also some top end power is lost (not enough to be a concern for a 'street' truck, IMHO).

A 5.9L commonrail, or the 6.7L, or anything after.. all have a constant-duty high pressure pump (CP3) that is tiny and is constantly pressurizing a common fuel rail to a certain pressure, and the injectors are electronically-controlled, and the operation of the injectors' solenoids is very quiet. This means per piston cycle, you can (and they do come like this from the factory) have multiple fuel injections per piston event. A little injection early on, to start some combustion and start raising cylinder pressure.. so that a later injection (or two) can happen with a smaller amount of fuel overall yet still hitting the cylinder pressures needed to extract the power from the diesel, with less-harsh combustions per injection. This leads to cleaner emissions, more efficient burn, significantly less noise, but also some hotter engine temps generally speaking (have you ever seen the size of a 3rd gen radiator?.. it's like 4ft tall).

For mechanical noise, the 24V is known to have a very thin single-wall oil pan, that lets a LOT of this knocking noise out through it. I haven't confirmed it personally, but I've read multiple times that the older 1st gen 12V engines had a dual-wall steel pan as an attempt to reduce the noise, as well as the 3rd gen and newer oil pans being dual-wall.

On 4th gen and newer Dodges they really started paying attention to NVH since these trucks became pretty popular as more than just a heavy duty work truck, so there is sound and heat insulation everywhere in the engine bay and the cab, and the factory intake piping has all kinds of engineered passages and ribs to limit combustion noise from radiating out the intake end.. and the factory exhaust on a 4th gen... well.. holy... you better just Google that to see what they look like haha.

But I digress. The Nova is crazy for sure.. everything I know about tuning, fabrication, general wrenching.. I taught myself on that car. I got it as a grad present from my parents at age 17 in 2004, and have been building it ever since. From the factory it was an inline-6 3spd on the column car in 'grandma green' interior/exterior, but when I got it the previous owner had swapped a 305ci/TH350 combo into it, with some Chevelle bucket seats, crappily spray painted it orange (I guess to make it sell easier?) but kept the factory open rear 8.2" 10bolt, factory manual steering, and factory manual drum-drum brakes. And then I started taking it apart and learning on it!
 

cd_193

New member
Wow, the sound level of a duramax? I'm sold. My neighbors have been giving me stares lately ever since I got the dodge running again..
How long would you say it took them to ship the parts out for you? Or were they already in stock? I'll have to give them a call this week.
Thank you for all of the detailed info!

Also, excellent description of the differences of single injection events of p pump and Vp44, and multi injection events of the modern common rails!
 

frojoe

Adventurer
Yeah I would say it's not super quiet, but our neighbor has a tuned 2009 Duramax with intake and exhaust, and my truck sounds about as loud idling on the street (and me standing in our front yard) as his does across a hedge and the property line. So the blankets most certainly quieted things down impressively.. but they didn't "fix the noise issue" that these old 24V's have haha.
 

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