2010 patriot soft roader build.

[emtmark]

Thanks for indulging me and my questions guys. All valuable considerations. I have no off-road experience and it will be my DD, so my wife has stipulated that the future overland vehicle has to be 25 mpg (EPA combined), or close (my stipulation). It's a compromise in case she hates overlanding that I'm willing to make right now. That really limits the options, although not beyond possibility. If things go well for a couples of years, I'll be able to get a mall-crawled PRO-4X.

- Rattling is something I hate, but I'm experienced at tracking down and fixing (years of high-end car audio systems).
- Size would be a factor, but my desire is to have a small trailer eventually. The Renegade would require making the step sooner.
- If I were to get something off-the-lot, the "up-and-coming" 'gade would be more attractive, and support will only grow.
- People seem to either love, hate, or don't have any experience with Subarus. I hated them, but that was 15 years ago.

Thanks again. I'll move it from the list of possibilities to the list of test drivers.

Love my xterra P4x!

 

[Dake21]

How was the experience with the CVT and towing? Lack of response or what?

 

[AdventureHare]

Love my xterra P4x!

I probably love your P4X too. :drool: But since I'm married and she's "buying" this vehicle too, and the concession was for our first overlanding rig, it needs to be 25MPG (she says EPA combined and I say highway).

I just towed about 1200 pounds for about 2 hours up and down mountain...the cvt is the worst thing I've ever towed with!

NOPE. I had the off road package in my 2010 and it was almost as bad as my 2011 JK unlimited on gas, the new one with the 6sp is FAR better, in every way. It drives better, better milage, less annoying as its not always buzzing the crap out of the motor...I could go on and on. Really, the new 6sp almost has the same low ratio as the FDII pat, and the rest of the package can be added easily.

I will probably need to tow and I need the better mileage (21/27); ORP/FD2 is no longer on the list.
The 6sp auto low ratio is ~14.2:1 compared to the crawl CVT of 19:1, right? Given I'm considering other "street" AWD rigs, it's now equal footing, but that crawl gear was very attractive even if it wasn't that steep.
And it's 2014 and newer only. That's gonna require a loan if I expect to outfit it with skids and bars.
Given how short my list is, I can't afford to drop it off, but it's not on the top any more.

Once again, thank you for indulging me.

 

[jhill15]

How was the experience with the CVT and towing? Lack of response or what?

Going up hills the cvt was really confused. Starting up the hill and almost to the top it would hit 5k rpm then would drop down to 3k and sit there for about 5 seconds before shifting back down to a lower gear and almost red lining. By the time we would make it to the top of a mountain the cvt would go back and forth and back and forth through gears. On flat, down hill or small grades it was fine.

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[kojackJKU]

Yep, hell put enough gear inside the pat and it does that.

 

[kojackJKU]

I probably love your P4X too. :drool: But since I'm married and she's "buying" this vehicle too, and the concession was for our first overlanding rig, it needs to be 25MPG (she says EPA combined and I say highway).





I will probably need to tow and I need the better mileage (21/27); ORP/FD2 is no longer on the list.
The 6sp auto low ratio is ~14.2:1 compared to the crawl CVT of 19:1, right? Given I'm considering other "street" AWD rigs, it's now equal footing, but that crawl gear was very attractive even if it wasn't that steep.
And it's 2014 and newer only. That's gonna require a loan if I expect to outfit it with skids and bars.
Given how short my list is, I can't afford to drop it off, but it's not on the top any more.

Once again, thank you for indulging me.

The ratio of the 6sp auto is 17:1 in first compared to 19:1 in "low gear" in the FDII with CVT2. Essentally the same, you would not know the difference....but you will know the difference at highway speed where the automatic settles down to 2200rpm at 60mph compard 25-2700 rpm plus major rpm fluctuations with the CVT all the time.

I did a comparison and the automatic wins on acceleration by 2 sec to 60mph and 2 sec. quicker in the 1/4, get much better milage numbers (cvt is 20/23 vs 22/27 for the auto) and has almost the same crawl ratio as the off road CVT2 transmission. And lets not forget the reliability factor. CVT is notoriously weak and failure prone. Not just in Jeeps but in any vehicle that they are installed in. I would pic the automatic any day of the week over any cvt.

 

[kojackJKU]

Bunch of ************** over there....ha ha ha....can't handle someone saying against their thoughts. Sheep. Good luck to rosso racist. ah ha ha. they banned me....whiners!

 

[AdventureHare]

17:1 is quite good. There's much to be said for the refined familiarity of the standard auto trans. I don't quite understand the CVT bandwagon especially when they're not programmed correctly. As a rocket scientist, I know that it's not rocket science.

 

[kojackJKU]

HA HA HA.....Last line is perfect! AdventureHare, its not just the programming. They are notoriously weak, inefficient, and non serviceable for the most part. Everything you DONT WANT in a transmission. I have owned 2 CVT transmission'ed vehicles and both gave me trouble, I have owned literally 100's of regular style gear transmissions and I have one that gave me issue, that's because I was plowing and showing it ZERO mercy....NOT the transmissions fault. plus 500 bucks, a shift kit and some waiting it was rebuilt and back in the burb. Unlike my audi A4 transmission now. Sitting in the car as a lump.

I have so much hard data on the CVT vs. REAL transmission debate, there is no arguing. After owning a 2010 pat with the CVT2 FDII package with the 19:1 ratio and now my 2015 with the 6sp at 17:1, there is no comparison. The 6sp is miles ahead, from 2 secs faster 0-60, 2 sec faster 1/4 mile time, to much better gas milage. Its a no brainer. Make a newer FDI into the FDII with the extra bolt ons.

On a different note, how about Jhills pat! LOOKIN GOOD! ha ha. Mines getting started soon too.

 

[jhill15]

Added some PATRIOT lettering to match my Oscar Mike star

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[kojackJKU]

looks good....esp with the star.

 

[jhill15]

looks good....esp with the star.

Thanks man.

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[Darkrider]

I agree the Star is a nice touch!

Yep for sure. If buying new, and you can afford it, grab the high altitude. Every creature comfort in the book. We bought ours because the dealer traded my hardly ableson in on it, and I sort of had to grab the one they had in their dealer for over 6mon. Even as the cheap altitude package model, we love it. For the driving we are going to do with it, the FD1 package is perfect, and you get rid of that gawd awful cvt then. You can add everything that comes on the FDII package to an FD1 besides the low range gearing. Which when I had my FDII I used a total of 3 times, more as a lets try it. and I put that up river beds etc. Never needed it. The 6spd is so much nicer to drive than my FDII was. Plus the reliability of the CVT is very questionable, I had two, still own one, and both have given me trouble. Needless to say I will never buy a vehicle with a CVT in it anymore. Not worth the headaches. I have since learned that I could have got a HIGH ALTITUDE model with less than 6000 kms on it for only about 2000 more than my base model altitude. DAMN. ha ha .

Either way, they are awesome even if I have to crank my windows down!

Going to bring this up for a moment again...Is there an FD1 and FD2 version of the High Altitude? reason i ask this is because i looked at two yesterday and from what i could see one of them seemed to stand at least an inch to two inches taller then the other. They had two High Altitude versions of the Compass at the same sale as well.

 

[kojackJKU]

There is, but both are the same height. I am guessing the taller one had a lift installed....There is no height difference in any patriot now only options and running gear. run away from the FDII IMO....

 

[jhill15]

A very early birthday present from my pops!

And I added a fuel tank cover...which is pretty much junk! I had to bend it so it would fit right.

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