2020 Defender Spy Shots....

[JeepColorado]

No, they quite clearly state it's built on the same platform as the Disco. The electronic systems have been updated, and the monocoque is significantly stiffer, and the interior is completely different, and it looks different and comes with different options and can take larger tires and can do better off-road right off the lot, but yes, it's basically the same thing. Such is the way of things in world auto platforms these days.

The Disco was always more of an all-around daily driver that can overland when you want to, and go on 90% of the roads in the world. Still is. The Defender was always the technical off-roader that could be your expedition vehicle or weekend warrior trail basher. Still is. Except now it's much, much nicer to drive, safer, and more durable than the old Defender, and it's more capable off the lot than the old Defender.

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Whether or not it's durable enough is yet to be seen.. LR says it is, what else would they say? Time will tell. After some real off-road beta testing and lots of miles by those willing to risk dropping $80K on a decently spec'd version; we'll see. Does the aftermarket respond?...has LR built it in a way where they realistically can? Once it has a proven track record and has been through the gauntlet of actual use we'll see. I've not seen 1 article yet by a journalist who has actually driven it and you are already claiming it "much nicer to drive" than the Disco 5- how do you know that? I do agree with you on one thing- it's very likely more capable than the old Defender- so are most Subaru's.

 

[Paddler Ed]

Wow that's a really good article. I must admit I am a bit disappointed. I did not expect it to be that close to the Discovery. It makes the $80k price tag a bit harder to swallow.

What I Found When I Crawled Under The 2020 Land Rover Defender

I just crawled under the 2020 Land Rover Defender—the unibody, independent suspension-equipped successor to a legendary body-on-frame, solid-axle off-roader.

jalopnik.com

Land Rover have always specialised in bitsa models - the last 3 new models that have had their own (not shared chassis) have been the original Range Rover and the Land Rover 90/110/127, and the most recent 2x Range Rovers, that's it. Everything else has had some degree of platform sharing within the company - it's how they can be somewhere near profitable/not hemorrhaging cash.

To those bemoaning the lack of a pickup from Land Rover, it would never be cost effective to import into the USA market because of the Chicken Tax - and don't expect that to disappear anytime soon with Trump in charge - and so that's probably one reason why it's not going to happen.

As others have said, the Japanese (Thai) pickups dominate the UK farm market now for under 3500kg; if you need something like a 110 with a decent load on it you're going to be pushing the 3500kg GVM, so in Europe you're going to be up to the next licence category (which is upto 7500kg GVM) and you get something much more suitable (ie a proper truck with truck sized components). Likewise, over 9 seats? That's another licence category...

 

[treckin]

True, and unfortunately our intellectual superiors in the Democratic People's Republic of California are on a mission to ban diesels from our roads, so I guess we're going to have to accept mild hybrids and KERS to get the performance we used to get from a diesel. But at least we will be used to the fuel prices because they all run on premium fuel....

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Uh, you can thank VW and the emissions cheating scandal, not the people of California....

 

[JeepColorado]

Explorer Pack

 

[JeepColorado]

Urban Pack

 

[JeepColorado]

Adventure Pack

 

[JeepColorado]

Country Pack

 

[blackangie]

I really want to like the new Defender. It is, among vehicle offerings for remote touring in the U.S., unique in its combination of payload and off road capability. I can tolerate styling that I dislike, and trust the suspension, though not live axle, has been engineered to work well enough. But for purposes of remote touring and not being left stranded, Land Rover's bottom-of-the-barrel dependability ranking is, for me, disqualifying. They really need to fix that in order to be taken seriously in this segment.

This has been discussed in depth on this thread.. Land Rovers dependability in the US has increased 180 percent over the last 20 years.. what has happened is the industry as a whole has improved also.

If you look at Land Rovers reliability in the UK on the same study it is almost on par with Toyota, why? Because Toyota sell diesels there also and it is a more level playing field.

In my opinion there is nothing to worry about me I'm driver's reliability these days, fact wise it is twice as good as 20 years ago in America.

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[blackangie]

Sorry - but calling **************** on any claim that "computers don't break". Have gotten rid of several cars that were longer in the tooth because they needed expensive computer module updates/replacements (loved my old VW Passat 4Motion wagon) that were too expensive (given what the car was worth) to replace. Yes, things have gotten better and they are trying their best to waterproof stuff, but I'm very sympathetic to the worries of folks on this thread who say all the computerized gizmos will make the new Defender something that you won't want to own past its warranty. Sad, but don't think we're going to see anything in this vintage run long term like the early Rovers were . . .

Airplanes are some of the most technologically complicated vehicles on the planet if not the most, and yet they are the most reliable.

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[blackangie]

If you think about the 110 is basically like a pickup with a roof on it with that payload. Won't suit everyone, but most.
I would say a pick up will come if its popular enough.

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[Nautadoc]

Some friends had their "older" Defender restored in a place in WI. Turned out well. They are fun vehicles.

 

[Victory_Overland]

If you think about the 110 is basically like a pickup with a roof on it with that payload. Won't suit everyone, but most.
I would say a pick up will come if its popular enough.

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I do not see a market for a 130 P/U anywhere on the planet for that price! Sure, there are peeps paying $65-75k for Denalis and ******** but they are die hard loyalists LR I think understands the market enough to know that the juice is not worth the squeeze on cost vs reward to build a P/U. The Defender stretch or whatever it is will see an armor version almost guaranteed and I'll be curious if it makes its way into the Queen or Prince's motorcade.

 

[calicamper]

I do not see a market for a 130 P/U anywhere on the planet for that price! Sure, there are peeps paying $65-75k for Denalis and ******** but they are die hard loyalists LR I think understands the market enough to know that the juice is not worth the squeeze on cost vs reward to build a P/U. The Defender stretch or whatever it is will see an armor version almost guaranteed and I'll be curious if it makes its way into the Queen or Prince's motorcade.

Im currently shopping the Denali market. Nearly bought one two weeks ago. $68,000 is about as low as it gets for those and they are selling like crazy right now. On the flip side the much more modern and way way better interior layout of the new Expedition isn’t selling well in the Platinum trim. I’m going to push to see if we can land in the $69k range on a msrp 80k rig this weekend. It’s doable given dealers are advertising them very close to that now yr old lot queens.

The 2020 Explorer platinum is about a $57,000 rig “IF” you can get invoice on a all new rig just arriving?? Probably a long shot.

 

[68camaro]

Keep in mind that Land Rover must get the vehicles certified for fuel economy and emissions. Metal belly pans are heavy, which reduces fuel economy. Also, metal bellies are loud and ringy as highway noise and associated road imperfections pass under the vehicle...NVH is a significant perception issue for many drivers. If it costs $75k and sounds like a $25k used Jeep, auto journalists will complain and then buyers will feel like they're not getting their money's worth.

I can't speak to Rovers, but on my WK2 Grand Cherokee I have metal plating from front skid plate all the way to rear including rocker guards from Mopar, Rocky Road Outfitters and Chief Products, there is no additional road noise and weight impact on fuel has been neglible. With a full tank, 24 gal, I am roughly 500 mile range.

 

[JeepColorado]

Very interesting comparison using an off-road index-