PS- I think the guy who thinks the 4Runner looks like a Montero meant the late 90's Montero Sport. A very good looking car for its time. No good at posting photos, so here is the link. http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/6/6c/Montero_Sport_1997-99.jpg
All new 2010 4runner revealed...
- Thread starter Martinjmpr
- Start date
Martinjmpr
Wiffleball Batter
I can't speak for anyone else but for me it's because the electric T-case control is a single-point-failure item that adds nothing to the capability of the vehicle. They can and do fail (over on the Tacoma & 4runner boards there are a number of people who have experienced problems with the electric shifters on both the 3rd gen 4runner/1st gen Taco and the 2nd gen Tacos.) OTOH, a vehicle has to be in pretty bad shape for the manual T-case to fail.
To me the electric T-case lever is an example of laziness and cheapness on the part of the manufacturer. It's a recognition of the fact that a large number of 4x4 owners never even put their vehicles in 4wd (except maybe for the occasional snowstorm.) The electric switch is easier for the manufacturer because then they can have the same dashboard and center console on the 2wd vehicle as they have on the 4wd vehicle - the only difference is the switch on the 4wd version. In contrast, a manual t-case lever requires a more complex mechanical linkage to the case, as well as a center console that is designed to accomodate the lever.
Is it a coincidence that on most heavy duty applications, that is, vehicles where the 4wd is an important component that is expected to be used, the electric t-case switch is almost completely absent? Vehicles in this category either have manual t-cases or full time 4wd.
Cackalak Han
Explorer
as for a pathfinder making it...
it was never marketed towards hardcore off roading, hence independent suspensions front and rear. are we really surprised it can't do the rubicon?
I'm a big fan of the new 4runner.
Then what was the point of your post? Should Toyota never have even tried going through Rubi? Is it a pos since it sustained "massive body damage?"
Ok, so the Pathfinder wasn't marketed as a real offroader. The Trail Edition IS! Is it bad that they tried to take it on one of the toughest/respected trails in NA? I'd like to see more companies promote their product this way.
Life_in_4Lo
Explorer
the electric tcase switch has not seen many problems. It's a solenoid operation and I haven't seen much if any problem with it.
I prefer a lever for sure but would not let this sway a decision at all, at least on a Toyota and not this platform.
The reason for a switch is to save dashboard and console space for other things and also add precieved refinement. Most consumers think a t case lever is archaic and ugly while offroaders precieve it as rugged and reliable.
It has nothing to do with Toyota being lazy or cheap. It's a marketing issue.
Backwoods Rambler
Explorer
I need some clarification here...
Isn't the center locking diff a means for the mfg to turn a full time 4wd transfer case into a 50/50 split transfer case; like a part time system?
If the trail edition has a part time system, it seems safe to assume that engaging it gives you a 50/50 split, therefore the center diff lock is not necessary.... right?
As for the rig in general, I do like it. It does seem a bit big in the pics, but internet proportions are often decieving, so seeing one in person is a must.
270hp for the v6 does seem sufficient, if not impressive. But I do wonder where that power comes into play vs. the previous gen's v8. And since this rig looks bigger, the extra hp may be more than offset by the extra weight?
That being said, I can't believe tha Toyota didn't push a 300+ hp v8 into this rig, and hopefully they will.
Overall I'm liking the previous gen style & v8 option better, but again without seeing them side by side and test driving them back to back to compare, it would be a tough call to make.
I think I'll just be keeping the XJ and dropping in a [insert 290+ hp engine here] some day.
Isn't the center locking diff a means for the mfg to turn a full time 4wd transfer case into a 50/50 split transfer case; like a part time system?
If the trail edition has a part time system, it seems safe to assume that engaging it gives you a 50/50 split, therefore the center diff lock is not necessary.... right?
As for the rig in general, I do like it. It does seem a bit big in the pics, but internet proportions are often decieving, so seeing one in person is a must.
270hp for the v6 does seem sufficient, if not impressive. But I do wonder where that power comes into play vs. the previous gen's v8. And since this rig looks bigger, the extra hp may be more than offset by the extra weight?
That being said, I can't believe tha Toyota didn't push a 300+ hp v8 into this rig, and hopefully they will.
Overall I'm liking the previous gen style & v8 option better, but again without seeing them side by side and test driving them back to back to compare, it would be a tough call to make.
I think I'll just be keeping the XJ and dropping in a [insert 290+ hp engine here] some day.
Martinjmpr
Wiffleball Batter
There aren't many problems but there are some. Toyota's probably better than some others (I had a buddy in WY who hated the electric T-case controls on his Ranger because it would occasionally fail to actuate in extremely cold weather) but it's not trouble free. We've had threads on this very forum where people had problems getting their Tacomas into 4wd because the electric T-case didn't work.
Which "most consumers" are you talking about? The people who have never owned a 4wd and don't know what 4wd is for? I've never heard anyone say they disliked the T-case lever or perceived the switch as "more refined."
Those who didn't know anything about 4wd ignored the lever/switch altogether and most of those that actually knew what 4wd was and how it worked preferred the lever. Certainly that was the case when I went vehicle shopping this Summer. I came very close to getting a 4th gen 4runner but between the cost, the low-slung stance and the electric T-case switch I just couldn't do it, and went with the 3rd gen 4runner instead.
Life_in_4Lo
Explorer
The t-case lever and switch activation are marketing decisions. They are not, as you said, lazy and cheap choices by Toyota.
alexrex20
Explorer
it's a bit irresponsible and blinded of you to actually believe a "stock" 4Runner completed the Rubicon without assistance and/or taking bypass routes. a stock jeep rubicon can't do it unassisted; do you think it's less capable than a 4Runner?
regardless, that 4Runner is not stock. it was rolling oversize MTR Kevlars and sliders, none of which are available from the factory. and don't argue with me that they're "just tires" because we all know that tire selection is one of the biggest factors in off road performance.
alexrex20
Explorer
in my experience (in texas), people prefer the switch to the lever. when my friends shop for trucks, they make a point of having a switch and not a lever, as though it makes their truck better than mine. these are the people that buy 4WD because they can; because every now and then they need it in the wet grass parking lot. they're certainly not aloof when it comes to 4WD, but they're not the same demographic as people like us - like me, who prefers the lever because it has less parts to break.
Cackalak Han
Explorer
******?? Who said anything about the 4Runner fully completing the Rubicon?? Did I ever say a stock 4Runner could do that?? All I did was post a video of a TE going through some testing at Rubicon. That's it. If I were a dolt and believed the Rubicon were 50 ft long, made of a few boulders and a tree that can be covered in a 5 min video, your rants would be justified. But your whining about this video, based on your ASSumptions is unwelcome.
alexrex20
Explorer
i'm sorry. i didn't mean to offend the toyota fanbois on this forum.
you downtalk the pathfinder that it can not do the Rubicon, on the implication that a stock 4Runner can. sorry, it can't.
because you admit that it can't, then ****** is your problem with the Pathfinder? with your flawless logic, it's just as capable as a TE 4runner, because i'm sure i could take one to the Rubicon and compile 5min of video.
you downtalk the pathfinder that it can not do the Rubicon, on the implication that a stock 4Runner can. sorry, it can't.
because you admit that it can't, then ****** is your problem with the Pathfinder? with your flawless logic, it's just as capable as a TE 4runner, because i'm sure i could take one to the Rubicon and compile 5min of video.
That 4runner in the picture is $39,000 smacks. I paid $25,000 for my FJ 6 months ago. Which would you rather bang up on the Rubicon? IMHO the 4runner is a soccer mom vehicle. Unless something bad happens to the FJ, I wouldn't buy that soccer mom vehicle for fear of ridicule. I would buy a Jeep Rubicon with an extended warranty though.
If you want to see a real offroader on the Rubicon click the link. His bike weighs 500lbs and he's a nice guy.
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=480690&highlight=rubicon
If you want to see a real offroader on the Rubicon click the link. His bike weighs 500lbs and he's a nice guy.
http://www.advrider.com/forums/showthread.php?t=480690&highlight=rubicon
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wyorunner
Observer
Lets put it this way NO STOCK vehicle could make it completely through the rubicon, but the portions that the semi modified (bigger tires and sliders) 4runner made it through is impressive, as far as a pathfinder, i have no idea never put one in 4 wheel drive.
Jim why such hate against a soccer mom vehicle, thats what i drive and i feel it does quite well. But the fj is a great rig as well, however it was designed more for the offroad appeal, not hauling people.
CA-RJ
Expo Approved™
That 4Runner is a much nicer vehicle. It also has 4 real doors.
I'm curious, what makes a vehicle a "real offroader"?
I'm curious, what makes a vehicle a "real offroader"?
Not hatred at all. Toyota simply designed that vehicle to appeal to women (since women make all the decisions in the family) and they are discontinuing the FJ next year and pumping all their efforts into that Woman pleasing vehicle. It's sad to see the FJ, which is a fine looking off road vehicle go down the tubes in favor of this over priced soccer mom vehicle.