Are pop-up campers more popular than hard-side purely due to how they look when mounted on a truck?
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Delberto Montalban
New member
I think you are over-thinking this whole thing. As for both of your queries:
1. Your mileage WILL suffer. Pay to play and get over it.
2. Nobody chooses a poptop because it looks better. And they do look better.
3. A poptop is lighter 9 out of 10 times. This means your driving pleasure will be maximized.
4. A poptop has a lower COG= less tippy. This means your driving pleasure will be maximized.
5. A poptop provides a smaller 3D footprint. They will fit into tighter spots in a less tippy fashion with possibly better fuel mileage. This means your driving pleasure will be maximized.
1. Your mileage WILL suffer. Pay to play and get over it.
2. Nobody chooses a poptop because it looks better. And they do look better.
3. A poptop is lighter 9 out of 10 times. This means your driving pleasure will be maximized.
4. A poptop has a lower COG= less tippy. This means your driving pleasure will be maximized.
5. A poptop provides a smaller 3D footprint. They will fit into tighter spots in a less tippy fashion with possibly better fuel mileage. This means your driving pleasure will be maximized.
While everyone likes a nice looking rig over an ugly one, we HEAVILY weight function and performance over looks. Everyone weights their list of must-haves and nice-to-haves differently as everything is a compromise (is that a dirty word nowadays? Seems like that word is fading from common vocabulary. Ha). We've had two brands of pop-up campers over the years (FWC then OEV CAMP-X). We are always on the lookout for something that fits our particular needs even better so often go through the exercise of "would this model fit our needs better?". We went down the rabbit hole of an adventure van or hard sided flatbed camper and were getting fairly serious in our search during an off-season (aka winter). The next spring-summer, we made a note of every situation that we were in where a taller hard sided would have not fit and required us to turn around or alter our plans. We very quickly realized that hard sided campers and adventure vans would be very limiting in regards to where we go and how we use our camper. Scratched tall rigs off the list.
Literally every weekend, driving our local mountain forest service roads, we would repeatedly encounter low hanging branches that would not have cleared the roofline of a hard sided camper. We'd also often drive off-camber sections where the entire truck/camper would lean far enough to the side that the top of a hard sided camper would have leaned over into the trees or rock walls lining the trail.
We just came back from our annual spring UT trip and this year, part of our trip was driving the White Rim Road in Canyonlands with a camp spot midway at White Crack. On several of the shelf road sections, the top of our pop-up was 1" to 4" away from the rock wall. At one point, our rig must have rocked to the side just enough to hook one of the top latches and slightly bent it, which we only discovered at the next stop. No camper damage, though. Those rock walls angle out over the top of the road, so a hardwall would have been even more of a challenge. I have seen a couple photos of hardwalls making it around the White Rim Road, but they had two spotters on those section, took a very long time, and tied up other trail users.
This same trip, we also drove up Long Canyon Road. Attached image of that drive demonstrates the concern of having a taller rig.
The CAMP-X is about 4" taller than the FWC on our same truck. With the FWC, I could still fit into the underground parking garage at work (cleared door by less than 2"). I can not with the CAMP-X, but I can still fit easily into our shop which is my home parking spot whether the camper is on or off (camper stays on 6 or 7 months per year). A hardwall camper would mean I could only park outside and not in my shop. Also, a hardwall camper would mean we couldn't fit many urban places (parking garages, under overhangs such as my banks drive-through, etc. I store the closed pop-up camper, in the off season, at the back of my shop under the storage loft by lowering it onto a 5x8 trailer and wheeling it into place. A hardwall wouldn't fit under that loft and would really screw up my shop layout.
When researching/considering moving to a hardwall, I was willing to take the additional hit to mileage (due to increased wind resistance), handling (heavier and higher center of gravity, even on the "light weight/COG conscious" hardwall builds), etc. but what killed the idea was observing clearance over a season with our current pop-up. For our particular use, we simply couldn't go where we go currently. At this point, we are not willing to change the areas and terrain we drive to accommodate the height of a hardwall.
Literally every weekend, driving our local mountain forest service roads, we would repeatedly encounter low hanging branches that would not have cleared the roofline of a hard sided camper. We'd also often drive off-camber sections where the entire truck/camper would lean far enough to the side that the top of a hard sided camper would have leaned over into the trees or rock walls lining the trail.
We just came back from our annual spring UT trip and this year, part of our trip was driving the White Rim Road in Canyonlands with a camp spot midway at White Crack. On several of the shelf road sections, the top of our pop-up was 1" to 4" away from the rock wall. At one point, our rig must have rocked to the side just enough to hook one of the top latches and slightly bent it, which we only discovered at the next stop. No camper damage, though. Those rock walls angle out over the top of the road, so a hardwall would have been even more of a challenge. I have seen a couple photos of hardwalls making it around the White Rim Road, but they had two spotters on those section, took a very long time, and tied up other trail users.
This same trip, we also drove up Long Canyon Road. Attached image of that drive demonstrates the concern of having a taller rig.
The CAMP-X is about 4" taller than the FWC on our same truck. With the FWC, I could still fit into the underground parking garage at work (cleared door by less than 2"). I can not with the CAMP-X, but I can still fit easily into our shop which is my home parking spot whether the camper is on or off (camper stays on 6 or 7 months per year). A hardwall camper would mean I could only park outside and not in my shop. Also, a hardwall camper would mean we couldn't fit many urban places (parking garages, under overhangs such as my banks drive-through, etc. I store the closed pop-up camper, in the off season, at the back of my shop under the storage loft by lowering it onto a 5x8 trailer and wheeling it into place. A hardwall wouldn't fit under that loft and would really screw up my shop layout.
When researching/considering moving to a hardwall, I was willing to take the additional hit to mileage (due to increased wind resistance), handling (heavier and higher center of gravity, even on the "light weight/COG conscious" hardwall builds), etc. but what killed the idea was observing clearance over a season with our current pop-up. For our particular use, we simply couldn't go where we go currently. At this point, we are not willing to change the areas and terrain we drive to accommodate the height of a hardwall.
Mules
Well-known member
The answer is easy for me. If I had a dedicated overlander, it would be hard sided.
But this is my daily driver. It's my car for work, my convertible for weekends, my pickup for projects, my tow vehicle for toys, and my camper for fun. It had to look good and be my Swiss army knife of vehicles. Pop up for me.
But this is my daily driver. It's my car for work, my convertible for weekends, my pickup for projects, my tow vehicle for toys, and my camper for fun. It had to look good and be my Swiss army knife of vehicles. Pop up for me.
- I added a little more to the first post to slick up this thread a little.
- It seems that there isn't a huge difference in MPG's if any between Hard-side and popup. Lift, tires, weight, vehicle and speed are equally contributing factors.
- Height for off-road seems to be a real thing but off-road is still limited with the weight of a camper. In my opinion if you're really going off-road then a pop up canopy would be the solution for sleeping in your vehicle.
I guess I'm saying it's more than looks. It appeals to us on a core level as a result of several generations of people associating tents with adventure and being outdoors.
robgendreau
Explorer
Odd conclusion. Looks never entered my mind; they all look like dad jeans. And in comparison between the popups and the minimalists like the Scout and not a Lance with slideouts, it's kind of irrelevant. Both have ligher weights, doors that are small, cramped insides, etc, and all because a few inches or pounds here or there matter. In my bazillion years camping I've never heard anyone—until now—find any popup, whether it be trailer, truck camper, or full sized van say they were about looks. Except for the old VWs. But hey, at least someone thinks my rig looks cool now. 
Mules
Well-known member
OK, I'm an engineer, and I believe form follows function. You can make something both functional and beautiful, but it takes an effort. I think I pulled off both in building this pop-top from scratch. I am a bit bias though, having worked on it for two years. It's extremely light, compact when driving, and spacious when popped (8ft tall inside).Odd conclusion. Looks never entered my mind; they all look like dad jeans. And in comparison between the popups and the minimalists like the Scout and not a Lance with slideouts, it's kind of irrelevant. Both have ligher weights, doors that are small, cramped insides, etc, and all because a few inches or pounds here or there matter. In my bazillion years camping I've never heard anyone—until now—find any popup, whether it be trailer, truck camper, or full sized van say they were about looks. Except for the old VWs. But hey, at least someone thinks my rig looks cool now.
Drives, seats and sleeps (4), two upstairs and two down.
Dad jeans
Come on, isn't she as cute as a VW
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Because you just...won't...listen. Ha.
You ask why people choose a pop-up over hard sided and if it's a look thing, then receive pages of answers and examples of why people choose pop-ups over hard sided (none of which were for looks) and then make a conclusion ("So it's a looks thing") that is the opposite of all the input you received. Ha.I disagree with your above opinion that "if you're really going offroad then a pop up canopy would be the solution for sleeping in your vehicle". As outlined in my response, we drive trails when on long out-of-state trips and in our local Montana mountains that hard sided will not fit in. And, we do not want to overland in a pop-up canopy or rooftop tent as we like the insulation (from weather, cold/heat, dust, etc.), furnace, plumbing, water tank, instant hot water, etc. in our OEV CAMP-X. It is the perfect solution for us since it will let us get down tight trails with rock overhangs and tree-branches that a hard sided will not yet still is a full enclosure with all the comforts that we want in our camper and light/robust enough to do rough trails (South Draw Road in Capitol Reef, White Rim Road in Canyonlands, and other medium rated trails/roads). We have no interest, these days, in canopy or roof top tents. A pop-up camper is what provides the amenities we want (compared to canopy and rooftop tents) yet is compact and light enough to get down all the trails we frequent (hard sides campers are not).
I respect that for your use, you might have a different opinion on what is best or satisfactory, but please realize that everyone has different wants and needs and so maybe this thread was doomed from the beginning. Or maybe I'm just not following why you seem to have a predetermined outcome/opinion that there is no valid use-case for a pop-up camper except looks.
Again:
Not a looks thing; it's a function thing.
Pop-ups will fit the places we go (tight trails, parking garages, home garage) where hard sided will not.
Canopy/rooftop tents don't provide the amenities we want (insulation, plumbing, water tank, furnace, instant hot water heater, etc.)
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Thanks for your well thought out reply. I would never argue against anything you are saying and you clearly have a specific use case.Because you just...won't...listen. Ha.
I disagree with your above opinion that "if you're really going offroad then a pop up canopy would be the solution for sleeping in your vehicle". As outlined in my response, we drive trails when on long out-of-state trips and in our local Montana mountains that hard sided will not fit in. And, we do not want to overland in a pop-up canopy or rooftop tent as we like the insulation (from weather, cold/heat, dust, etc.), furnace, plumbing, water tank, instant hot water, etc. in our OEV CAMP-X. It is the perfect solution for us since it will let us get down tight trails with rock overhangs and tree-branches that a hard sided will not yet still is a full enclosure with all the comforts that we want in our camper and light/robust enough to do rough trails (South Draw Road in Capitol Reef, White Rim Road in Canyonlands, and other medium rated trails/roads). We have no interest, these days, in canopy or roof top tents. A pop-up camper is what provides the amenities we want (compared to canopy and rooftop tents) yet is compact and light enough to get down all the trails we frequent (hard sides campers are not).
I respect that for your use, you might have a different opinion on what is best or satisfactory, but please realize that everyone has different wants and needs and so maybe this thread was doomed from the beginning. Or maybe I'm just not following why you seem to have a predetermined outcome/opinion that there is no valid use-case for a pop-up camper except looks.
Again:
Not a looks thing; it's a function thing.
Pop-ups will fit the places we go (tight trails, parking garages, home garage) where hard sided will not.
Canopy/rooftop tents don't provide the amenities we want (insulation, plumbing, water tank, furnace, instant hot water heater, etc.)
This thread was really intended to try and understand the overall market trend and popularity of popups. Why 4wheel camper is outselling almost everything else and why OEV has been putting so many nuts in the popup camper basket. This thread was a bit botched from the start because I wasn't specific enough about the hard sides I was trying to compare. There also isn't enough data here to formulate any real conclusions.
OEV's evolution is the most interesting since they started building RV's 8 years ago and have made every configuration including trailers and then seemed to move heavily into popup designs.
I suspect that most of the 4wheel campers that have been purchased over the past 3 years aren't' going down trails. But the idea that they could is the very compelling reason to buy one. I also think that 4wheel sold a ton because they were somewhat available on dealer lots, turn key and ready to go. Unlike Scout that had a super long wait. I'm really interested to see how Scout and Total Composites fair over the next 5 years and how much market share they take from the popup sector. It's interesting that Scout just released the Tuktut which is very similar to the Total Composites medium size truck camper. Scout didn't go for a popup.
I'll also say that I've spent all all of my life exploring Washington state and haven't been anywhere else so I don't have first hand knowledge of what a good year round rig would be for the folks down south. A few folks that I talked to camping at the local ski mountain in popups stated that they would rather have a hardside.
Thread caveat notes:
- Spice added.
- I'm also an engineer.
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Agreed that many overland/offroad-capable campers aren't used to their potential and can be more of a "romantic explorer notion". Ha. Similar examples are lifted/big tired pickups and SUV that never go off pavement, or top of the line MTB that are far more capable than the rider (I'm guilty of being "over-biked" myself!).
It makes sense that those doing a fair bit of winter camping (ski resorts) would be better served by a hard sided. While pop-ups can do that, in that specific use case, hard sided just makes more sense. Typically (not always) better insulation and not having to pop up and down the top (with snow and ice getting in the way) when one needs to drive. Usually better sound deadening as well.
My guess is Scout is specializing in the hardsided overland camper simply because there is less competition there. The pop-up segment has quite a few competitors and it makes good business sense to focus on under-served markets. There aren't many light weight, lower cost (by comparison), minimalist hardwall campers on the market. They are actually a bit too minimalist for my tastes, though I appreciate the concept.
It's a great time to be in the market for overlanding/camping rigs. The choices are so much better now than even 6-7 years ago when we bought a FWC. FWC has been around forever and even 7 years ago, they didn't have much competition and so that is why they because so well known as the go-to, robust, light-weight, pop-up rig. Seeing FWC out and about, or on social media, was their best advertising. With long wait times (3 - 8 months wait on orders though some FWC ordered a few campers to have on hand), FWC didn't need to advertise.
Now, there are so many more choices (different construction types, weights, sizes, coverage, designs/layouts, amenities, etc.) Enough so that everyone should be able to find a rig that fits their use case. We've been much more satisfied with our OEV than our FWC. Some day, there may be another rig that fits our use case even better (and that could be because of design/material/manufacturing improvements or because our use case changes over time).
For now, super happy with our 2020 CAMP-X. And there have been many CAMP-X (now Backcountry) updates since my 2020 model that have made it even better than ours. But there are some new camper models, from both OEV and from other brands, that would potentially have us making a different choice if I had to replace our camper today. With so many good choices, it becomes a hard choice, but that is a good problem for a buyer to have.
It makes sense that those doing a fair bit of winter camping (ski resorts) would be better served by a hard sided. While pop-ups can do that, in that specific use case, hard sided just makes more sense. Typically (not always) better insulation and not having to pop up and down the top (with snow and ice getting in the way) when one needs to drive. Usually better sound deadening as well.
My guess is Scout is specializing in the hardsided overland camper simply because there is less competition there. The pop-up segment has quite a few competitors and it makes good business sense to focus on under-served markets. There aren't many light weight, lower cost (by comparison), minimalist hardwall campers on the market. They are actually a bit too minimalist for my tastes, though I appreciate the concept.
It's a great time to be in the market for overlanding/camping rigs. The choices are so much better now than even 6-7 years ago when we bought a FWC. FWC has been around forever and even 7 years ago, they didn't have much competition and so that is why they because so well known as the go-to, robust, light-weight, pop-up rig. Seeing FWC out and about, or on social media, was their best advertising. With long wait times (3 - 8 months wait on orders though some FWC ordered a few campers to have on hand), FWC didn't need to advertise.
Now, there are so many more choices (different construction types, weights, sizes, coverage, designs/layouts, amenities, etc.) Enough so that everyone should be able to find a rig that fits their use case. We've been much more satisfied with our OEV than our FWC. Some day, there may be another rig that fits our use case even better (and that could be because of design/material/manufacturing improvements or because our use case changes over time).
For now, super happy with our 2020 CAMP-X. And there have been many CAMP-X (now Backcountry) updates since my 2020 model that have made it even better than ours. But there are some new camper models, from both OEV and from other brands, that would potentially have us making a different choice if I had to replace our camper today. With so many good choices, it becomes a hard choice, but that is a good problem for a buyer to have.
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waltermitty
Member
I'm purchasing my pop up topper for occasional outings into the nearby forests and parks and also my bugout command post when the big Cascade earthquake hits. Additionally, I've opted for the topper vs slide in since it did not require additional RV type registration here in WA state. Just portable enough and just sturdy enough for fast get up and go.
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JaSAn
Grumpy Old Man
You are asking on the wrong forum. I would venture that most respondents here bought their camper for its utility, to fit their style of camping and their bank account.
Makes sense although I'm not sure a more appropriate forum exists. I appreciate the concentration of people here that are willing the nerd out on these topics.
Macfly
Active member
Even though I don't yet have my rig finished yet, as a long time two Land Cruiser FJ80 owner I wanted the smallest, lowest and most Land Crusier-like ability I could get without having to completely empty the car at each campsite. Vehicle feel and handling are super important to me, but other deciding factors were tree overhang on some of my favorite trails, lower CoG, nominally less weight, the slightly improved economy and the surprising amount of tipped over rigs I saw pictures of when doing my due diligence all made me pick a pop-up.
I follow a bunch of hardsiders on Instagram, including a couple of Earthroamers, and really do appreciate the ease of use I can see they have, but I know there's a lot of trails I like that I'd be too nervous to take such a big rig down.
You gotta know what matters to you, then choose accordingly.
I follow a bunch of hardsiders on Instagram, including a couple of Earthroamers, and really do appreciate the ease of use I can see they have, but I know there's a lot of trails I like that I'd be too nervous to take such a big rig down.
You gotta know what matters to you, then choose accordingly.