Colorado ZR2 and Tacoma TRD Pro compared

Clutch

<---Pass
Mid sized trucks are not built for working and pulling. If you want a work truck get a 3/4 ton. You can get one for the same price as the Colorado and never complain about not being able to haul enough again. Bad argument.

They are in the rest of the world.

2016-toyota-hilux-sr-4x4_600x400.jpg


We just get the watered down version in the States.

Too bad...or is it just sad that if you want to buy a truck to use for actual work, you have to buy a massive bloated fuel guzzler. Small fuel efficient work trucks do exist, just not here...must be the fragile American "bigger is better" ego that is to blame.

The US truck market is a funny thing.
 

Clutch

<---Pass
40% lighter doesn't necessarily equate to being 40% weaker. You'd have to go find what out what GM actually rated the frame and axles for for both platforms to make that kind of determination.

Payload is night and day.

Well we're getting way off track here. If you want to go with a cheaper option like a quad for dirtbike, go for it. For the people who want a mid-sized, diesel 4x4 pickup in North America, the GM ZR2 makes a pretty compelling case (it's really the only option in that market segment for now). And $40k+, while not an easy price to stomach, seems pretty in line with what comparable 4x4's are going for on the market.

Yeah....yaaaaaaawn, again on the ZR2. There was a time where I would be all over something like that....maybe I just getting old? Now I just think vehicles like that are an exercise in marketing, to see if people will buy them. Obviously it is successful, image is everything here in 'Murica. See plenty of street queen Raptors running around. Me, I am just not into it.

Other than the lack of a manual and the 40% heavier frame, I'm not sure what you're getting with the global Holden platform that you don't get with the NA version.

Just a couple little things like I said earlier, mainly payload, payload, payload. Smallish truck that gets good fuel economy, that wouldn't even flinch with a FWC in the bed. Main thing guys with midsizes and FWC complain about is how poorly it handles the weight. Really have no interest in buying a 3/4-1 ton if I buy a FWC.

Honestly, nothing on our US market really excites me. Everything is either lack luster or over compensating. Gaaaad all of the truck look like Transformers...gee-sas...who exactly is the target market? Teen-age boys or middle aged men with erectile disfunction?

They are ALL awful...and they want obscene amounts of money for them. Have no desire throwing money at something I don't like. Have a feeling the wife is going to force me to, since she is getting tired of us fixing my old junk. The old Tacoma with 350K miles on it is back yet again at the shop, getting the carrier bearing fixed for the 3rd freaking time in 3 years. Seems like no one can get it right. Stock one went 250K miles before it gave up the ghost.
 
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Dalko43

Explorer
They are in the rest of the world.

View attachment 403276


We just get the watered down version in the States.

Too bad...or is it just sad that if you want to buy a truck to use for actual work, you have to buy a massive bloated fuel guzzler. Small fuel efficient work trucks do exist, just not here...must be the fragile American "bigger is better" ego that is to blame.

The US truck market is a funny thing.

I'm pretty sure a diesel Colorado or even a gasoline Tacoma could carry/tow that same load, assuming those are 3 hay bales each weighing 1k lbs.

On the one hand there is some truth to what you're saying, but also I think you're overestimating the differences that exist between North American mid-sized pickup's and their global counterparts. The Hilux, for example, has a higher payload rating (up to 2.2k lbs for some variants) than comparable NA mid-sized pickup's (Tacoma and Colorado come in at about 1.5-1.6k depending on the cab variant). However, it's max towing capacity (~7.7k lbs) is hardly that different from what the Duramax Colorado can tow and only a bit higher than what the Tacoma is rated for. Also, go read some reviews; just because a diesel Hilux is rated for certain towing and payload capacities, doesn't mean it will drive well or handle said loads in a decent manner:
https://practicalmotoring.com.au/car-news/2016-toyota-hilux-all-the-details-you-need-to-know/
https://www.carsguide.com.au/car-advice/why-payloads-and-tow-ratings-should-be-taken-with-a-grain-of-salt-36434

Also, to be clear, the Hilux's or Holden's higher payload rating doesn't necessarily equate to their frames being stronger than a NA pickup's. There are a lot of factors that go into payload ratings: suspension; axle ratings; brakes; engine capabilities and cooling. Your statement that the Holden's frame was 40% heavier, and therefore 40% stronger, than the NA Colorado's is not accurate.

The reality is, even overseas, ute's like the Hilux and Ranger and Holden are light duty trucks at best. For the true heavy duty type work, they'll use heavy duty trucks, like the LC70 and even North American 3/4 ton's, like the Ram 2500 and Ford Super Duty.

For all practical purposes, the GM Colorado is as close as we're going to get to a Hilux here in North America, and realistically it isn't that far off in terms of overall capabilities. I think you should count your blessings that we even got that kind of truck in the NA market.
 
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Dalko43

Explorer
Yeah....yaaaaaaawn, again on the ZR2. There was a time where I would be all over something like that....maybe I just getting old? Now I just think vehicles like that are an exercise in marketing, to see if people will buy them. Obviously it is successful, image is everything here in 'Murica. See plenty of street queen Raptors running around. Me, I am just not into it.



Just a couple little things like I said earlier, mainly payload, payload, payload. Smallish truck that gets good fuel economy, that wouldn't even flinch with a FWC in the bed. Main thing guys with midsizes and FWC complain about is how poorly it handles the weight. Really have no interest in buying a 3/4-1 ton if I buy a FWC.

Honestly, nothing on our US market really excites me. Everything is either lack luster or over compensating. Gaaaad all of the truck look like Transformers...gee-sas...who exactly is the target market? Teen-age boys or middle aged men with erectile disfunction?

They are ALL awful...and they want obscene amounts of money for them. Have no desire throwing money at something I don't like. Have a feeling the wife is going to force me to, since she is getting tired of us fixing my old junk. The old Tacoma with 350K miles on it is back yet again at the shop, getting the carrier bearing fixed for the 3rd freaking time in 3 years. Seems like no one can get it right. Stock one went 250K miles before it gave up the ghost.

I think the problem lies less with GM's design choices and more with your unrealistic expectations. You ever hear the expression "You can't have your cake and eat it too?"

The base Colorado's payload is a bit lower than what some global ute's are rated for. But if you can't fit all of your gear and accessories onto a Colorado or Tacoma at under 1.5k lbs, maybe you need to trim back a little bit? Or go get a bigger truck?

The ZR2's payload is even lower, but guess what: that's the price you pay when you get an offroad-focused suspension. The same principle applies to the Power Wagon, Jeep, Raptor and pretty much every other offroad-focused 4x4. If you want to retune the suspension to accept more weight, there is always the aftermarket.

I just find it ironic that you're going to ***** and moan about the supposed inadequacies of a North American designed diesel, 4x4 pickup, which you likely haven't even driven yet, despite the fact that it comes off the factory floor with more offroad equipment and capabilities than what the global version gets overseas. I'm sure there are many on here who want the Hilux to be brought into the states; but I suspect even if we all write hundreds of letters into Toyota's headquarters, that simply isn't going to happen.

Be content with what the NA market has to offer, or go back to scooting around on your dirt bikes....those are the only choices I see for you.
 
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b9ev

Adventurer
An American 3/4 or 1 ton diesel pickup would likely tow that and make 15+ mpg while never struggling for power and handling and braking would be superior. Unless a smaller truck was needed for some other reason a larger one will do everything in that picture better.

When my Tacoma dies, the ZR2 is first on my list as a fun little truck. Then again I usually drive my 1 ton to do everything but go downtown with small parking spaces or very narrow offroading.
 

Clutch

<---Pass
I

Also, to be clear, the Hilux's or Holden's higher payload rating doesn't necessarily equate to their frames being stronger than a NA pickup's. There are a lot of factors that go into payload ratings: suspension; axle ratings; brakes; engine capabilities and cooling. Your statement that the Holden's frame was 40% heavier, and therefore 40% stronger, than the NA Colorado's is not accurate.

Yep, I know that.

Never said 40% heavier equals 40% stronger. Only stated that it is and the overseas version does have a better payload. Why did GM dumb down the US version is my question.

The reality is, even overseas, ute's like the Hilux and Ranger and Holden are light duty trucks at best. For the true heavy duty type work, they'll use heavy duty trucks, like the LC70 and even North American 3/4 ton's, like the Ram 2500 and Ford Super Duty.

Thought they use mostly 2.5-5 tonne cab over flat beds for heavier work. US 3/4 tons are pretty rare everywhere else.

For all practical purposes, the GM Colorado is as close as we're going to get to a Hilux here in North America, and realistically it isn't that far off in terms of overall capabilities. I think you should count your blessings that we even got that kind of truck in the NA market.

It is close, but they really miss the mark, by only offering it on higher trim levels. Seems silly to offer a fuel efficient power plant only in the higher cost trims. Will save on fuel, but won't really save any money...isn't the whole point of buying a fuel efficient vehicle?


I think the problem lies less with GM's design choices and more with your unrealistic expectations. You ever hear the expression "You can't have your cake and eat it too?"

That is the thing, I don't really have high expectations, as I am from the less is more mind set. Is that unrealistic, probably. ;)

The base Colorado's payload is a bit lower than what some global ute's are rated for. But if you can't fit all of your gear and accessories onto a Colorado or Tacoma at under 1.5k lbs, maybe you need to trim back a little bit? Or go get a bigger truck?

Problem is the bigger truck for how much I want to spend, is a 1/2 ton with a naturally aspirated V6, capacities are about the same as the midsizes, and you loose the manual trans. As my English friend once told me, autos are for the elderly and the handicapped.

The ZR2's payload is even lower, but guess what: that's the price you pay when you get an offroad-focused suspension. The same principle applies to the Power Wagon, Jeep, Raptor and pretty much every other offroad-focused 4x4. If you want to retune the suspension to accept more weight, there is always the aftermarket.

Yeah kinda pointless to buy an already spendy vehicle and have to redo the suspension, makes no sense. And again...factory equipped off-road focused trucks seem kind of silly in my eye.

I just find it ironic that you're going to ***** and moan about the supposed inadequacies of a North American designed diesel, 4x4 pickup, which you likely haven't even driven yet, despite the fact that it comes off the factory floor with more offroad equipment and capabilities than what the global version gets overseas.

B!tchin and moaning? Nah...just have a bit of fun. You're easy to get riled up. :D

I have driven the plain jane Colorado, and my truck has lockers, decent suspension...it isn't going to be that much different than those two. No way is it going to handle off road like my buddy's Class 7 truck. He has no where near $40K into it.

Be content with what the NA market has to offer, or go back to scooting around on your dirt bikes....those are the only choices I see for you.

I did buy a new scooter this spring, that is exciting...US truck market, meh...ZR2 can only have wetdreams where that thing can go. :D
 
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Clutch

<---Pass
An American 3/4 or 1 ton diesel pickup would likely tow that and make 15+ mpg while never struggling for power and handling and braking would be superior. Unless a smaller truck was needed for some other reason a larger one will do everything in that picture better.

I have no use for hauling that heavy, pic was only for reference purposes only. ;) :D Only interested in hauling a FWC...reports of diesel Colorados fetching 25 mpg with that camper. That would be nice. Unfortunately can't get the diesel in the extra cab WT model. I have no use for a crew cab as we have no spawn. That and like the Tacomas you see on here, they are well over payload. Which is no bueno.

Don't really want a 1 ton. Over kill for 95% of the stuff I do. Prolly have to forgo the FWC idea, as I can't get the combo I want....speaking of less is more. Kinda liking that camper Iggy is helping to build on Tacoma World.

https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/iggys-1-taco.368214/page-31

...that with a 4 banger SR Taco, not perfect, but that will work!
 
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kojackJKU

Autism Family Travellers!
well, that would explain the MPG thing. They were not very clear in that test. They were driving and talking about the duramax zr2 vs taco Pro. I am not pro Toyota or GM...but I have driven the two trucks (z71 Colorado and TRD Tacoma), and the Toyota is better in every way. I am in the small truck market and the taco is is. The Colorado is uncomfortable, has the predictable cheap GM feeling inside, ride is crap compared to the taco, way less off road ability, and Just overall the truck cannot compare to the Toyota. The Toyota gets the same gas mileage as my patriot, so it's 10 times better than my JKU was. 90 percent of the capability off road, Way more comfortable, better towing, more room for gear, ten times the build quality of the jeep, and just an overall better vehicle. Fun factor is not a concern because the fun happens outside the truck while camping, kayaking, hunting etc.
 

kojackJKU

Autism Family Travellers!
well, that would explain the MPG thing. They were not very clear in that test. They were driving and talking about the duramax zr2 vs taco Pro. I am not pro Toyota or GM...but I have driven the two trucks (z71 Colorado and TRD Tacoma), and the Toyota is better in every way. I am in the small truck market and the taco is it. The Colorado is uncomfortable, has the predictable cheap GM feeling inside, ride is crap compared to the taco, way less off road ability, and Just overall the truck cannot compare to the Toyota. The Toyota gets the same gas mileage as my patriot, so it's 10 times better than my JKU was. 90 percent of the capability off road, Way more comfortable, better towing, more room for gear, ten times the build quality of the jeep, and just an overall better vehicle. Fun factor is not a concern because the fun happens outside the truck while camping, kayaking, hunting etc.
 

kojackJKU

Autism Family Travellers!
They are in the rest of the world.

View attachment 403276


We just get the watered down version in the States.

Too bad...or is it just sad that if you want to buy a truck to use for actual work, you have to buy a massive bloated fuel guzzler. Small fuel efficient work trucks do exist, just not here...must be the fragile American "bigger is better" ego that is to blame.

The US truck market is a funny thing.

I think its more of the bigger AMERICANS. than the ego. ha ha .....
 

upcruiser

Perpetual Transient
I would expect that if the sales are strong enough with the Duramax Colorado you will likely see an LS trim in the future as well as an extra cab. The fact that they are offering a Duramax ZR2 extra cab is promising. A work truck trim might be a bit much. It's a big risk they were taking offering a diesel to begin with so they likely wanted to minimize the risk and only offer it limited trims initially to feel out the demand. This truck is seeing a pretty good swell of popularity despite a rather large notion of GM being inferior to Toyota. That said, in my experience and opinion Toyota quality isn't what it once was and the difference is now nil or even by initial impression, the quality advantage dips towards this gen Colorado. Regarding the frame, I have been in no other pickup that has so little bed deflection. So I will say this, that frame may be 40% this or that, blah blah blah, but that chassis is tight as a drum and exhibits imperceptible flex, even offroad. The foreign market Hiluxes I have driven weren't anywhere near that tight in torsional flex though admittedly I haven't driven the newest gen Hilux.

Towing, payload..... get the LT or Z71, 1,500 pounds payload and 7,600 towing is solid. I have come to the conclusion that the majority of folks in this community pay little heed to payload these days anyway. The amount of junk I see festooned upon Wranglers and caper laden Tacoma's that are WAY over the GVWR show many folks don't care though I am pretty careful to abide by that stuff myself. That said a crew cab Dmax Colorado is going to exceed a crew cab Eco Diesel 1500 Ram and Tacoma. So for the US market it's pretty solid.

Price.... We got our new Dmax LT trimmed Colorado from the dealer at 10k off sticker. 5k of that was GM friends and family discount but the rest of that was incentives. Without the GM employee discount you can actually Wheel and deal so I expect a normal person could have gotten more than 5k off sticker on ours. In addition we got zero percent financing for 5 years. That deal was better than a lower trim crew cab Tacoma, let alone any of the 3 TRD models non of which the local Toyota dealership was willing to budge in retail price. Maybe with the success of the Colorado now Toyota will be willing to budge a bit but by the number of new Tacos I see on the road, Toyota still coasts along on its reputation. Not saying the Tacoma isn't good, it's a GREAT truck but the gulf between the two in regards to build quality is little to null.

ZR2 package... I think any offroad specific package on any vehicle comes with inherit compromises. If you want an offroad toy with bug capability and a warranty it's a no brainier. You couldn't buy a similarly equipped Colorado and add all this stuff without exceeding the ZR2's asking price. I think it's most compelling case for the ZR2 is simply it's ability to blend outstanding technical performance with outstanding handling onroad. As an overlanding platform I don't think you necessarily want or need that much technical ability as payload becomes more important but hey, having options are nice.

Our LT trimmed Dmax with the G80 rear auto locker works pretty damn good in low traction circumstances and with the traction control is less intrusive in its engagement offroad than say our ATrac equipped FJ Cruiser we had. The Diesel engine mitigated the need for hill decent control in my view so we didn't feel compelled for the Z71. The air dam comes off the front, so that's not a big deal and we did that immediately. We have seen 31-33.5 on the highway with this thing, and that was with less than 3,000 miles on the odometer and still on winter blend. Purely driving around town, stop and go we see about 22. So for a crew cab, long bed truck that we got for less than our friends paid for there 4 cylinder Subaru Outback, and yet exceeds their mpg's they get, and yet we can still do this stuff without it breaking a sweat.......



I would say these things can do a pretty useful amount of towing and work for their size. In the manner of the Hilux and other foreign market trucks we seem to be so unrealistically craving. And I can tell you that it is a much nicer place to spend time in than some of those trucks from personal experience. Maybe I am just starting to get soft in my 40's... and I am a guy who loves, the rugged, old, simple stuff, so I am just a big walking talking contradiction anyway... haha. I guess my point boils down to I think GM did a decent job covering most bases with the current lineup offerings, no, not everyone can have anything they want.... my wife and I would prefer a manual but for towing the auto is better and more fuel efficient anyway so it's a good trade off. I am off the mind personally that a Dmax Colorado is the most useful all around vehicle sold in NA or the price, for the combination of reasons above, and a great oerland platform.
 

XJLI

Adventurer
holy ****.

Chevy released LITERALLY the exact truck everyone and their mother has been begging toyota to make for YEARS and it's too expensive plush and fluffy. Oh, sorry you can't row your own, I can't hear you crying over the sound of the 4 cylinder diesel and front and rear lockers. I wish I could buy one, I'd be all over it. Same thing happened with the BRZ/FRS. Everyone cried for a RWD back to basic sports car, it comes, and no one buys them. Again, I'd buy one in a heartbeart if I could. If someone told me to pick a brand new car and truck those would be the two in my driveway. As far as cost goes... ALL VEHICLES ARE EXPENSIVE NOW. You wan't a basic work truck? Ok, $25k please. It isn't 1993 anymore.

/rant
 

upcruiser

Perpetual Transient
well, that would explain the MPG thing. They were not very clear in that test. They were driving and talking about the duramax zr2 vs taco Pro. I am not pro Toyota or GM...but I have driven the two trucks (z71 Colorado and TRD Tacoma), and the Toyota is better in every way. I am in the small truck market and the taco is it. The Colorado is uncomfortable, has the predictable cheap GM feeling inside, ride is crap compared to the taco, way less off road ability, and Just overall the truck cannot compare to the Toyota. The Toyota gets the same gas mileage as my patriot, so it's 10 times better than my JKU was. 90 percent of the capability off road, Way more comfortable, better towing, more room for gear, ten times the build quality of the jeep, and just an overall better vehicle. Fun factor is not a concern because the fun happens outside the truck while camping, kayaking, hunting etc.

Funny, we had the complete opposite impression comparing the two and we were both leaning Toyota going into it having had 3 Land Cruisers, an FJ Cruiser, and Tundra previously. The seating position with your knees up in the Tacoma wasn't as comfortable as the more upright position of the CO. We liked the CO interior better though material-wise I didn't see much difference in quality between the two. A TRD Offroad would definitely have an edge offroad vs the Z71, but the TRD Pro is the same price as a ZR2. The Tacoma has a softer ride too, which I think would be nice on corrugations where as the Colorado feels a bit stiffer but to me more trucklike, in the good kind of way. It's hard comparing ride though I feel as between upgrading the suspension or burdening it with payload like we do in this hobby, the nature of the ride changes anyway. We bought ours for doing pickup work anyway, towing, hauling, daily driving and have a dedicated overland rig for that stuff so I can't speak to day to day with the CO offroad. It does ride nice with some weight in it though and I would reason to think the softer Taco might degrade the ride quality quicker vs the CO with weightvin it for that reason. The foreign market Toyota, Nissan, and Isuzu trucks I have spent time in are all in the rougher ride category than anything we have in the states. I only mention that because people get so starry eyed about Hiluxes at times.
 

onemanarmy

Explorer
View attachment 403156First of that test was on the GAS ZR2 not the Diesel. The Diesel gets 28 to 32 mpg real world miles on the highway and 22 to 24 in town. NO TACOMA EVER CAME CLOSE TO THOSE MPGS! EVER. In fact the in town mileage of the Colorado Diesel beats the Tacoma Highway mileage. LOL. It seems to me the crowd around here are a bit TACO blind to reality. Next you will say the Tacomas will drive on water.........:Wow1:

MOTOR TRENDS TEST: 23.2/31.4/26.3

Those who have had them for a bit are getting mid 30s highway driving. Towing they are still getting better than Tacomas do with nothing but air behind them. LOL.

When Diesel engines break in they get about 10% to 20% better fuel economy.

Not relevant to the original article posted.

The article was about gas vs. gas, which it has to be, due to Toyota not offering a Diesel in the Tacoma.

Now, when/if Toyota offers a Diesel in their small trucks, then you can come back and talk about how awesome your diesel MPGs are.
 

onemanarmy

Explorer
holy ****.

Chevy released LITERALLY the exact truck everyone and their mother has been begging toyota to make for YEARS and it's too expensive plush and fluffy. Oh, sorry you can't row your own, I can't hear you crying over the sound of the 4 cylinder diesel and front and rear lockers. I wish I could buy one, I'd be all over it. Same thing happened with the BRZ/FRS. Everyone cried for a RWD back to basic sports car, it comes, and no one buys them. Again, I'd buy one in a heartbeart if I could. If someone told me to pick a brand new car and truck those would be the two in my driveway. As far as cost goes... ALL VEHICLES ARE EXPENSIVE NOW. You wan't a basic work truck? Ok, $25k please. It isn't 1993 anymore.

/rant

Exactly.....CHEVY released it. Not Toyota. People have been begging for TOYOTA to produce a truck like the ZR2, or a Tacoma with a Diesel (which they already produce for the rest of the world) The TRD Pro is a great off road truck in its own way.

And about the BRZ/FRS......what a great platform. However, the manufactures had the opportunity to hit a home run, but they are underpowered and have no factory backed power adders. Still, for such a niche vehicle, they are selling decent between both Marques.

You being able to buy one IF YOU COULD is of no concern to either car makers in question here.
 

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