For those that carry Guns and Overlanding
- Thread starter The Artisan
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MOguy
Explorer
It doesn't matter why someone open carries. It is a right, not a privilege. The only reason I will open carry is I more comfortable it is I am out in the woods and pocket carry isn't an option. That is how I keep and bear my gun but I have no business to tell other they should or shouldn't carry like I fell they should.
I am opposed to any other type of carry unless it is on your body (open or concealed). I feel if you aren't in contact with your gun it should be unloaded and locked up, but I am not going to insist others do this. I would never encourage carrying gun in a purse, or other bag that you could leave around or someone could grab but I don't have a right to tell others they can't carry this way.
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Fireman78
Expedition Leader
Thread Edit:
Remove infantile ego chest thumping
Remove astounding displays of political ignorance
Merry Christmas
I second this! Cheers! folks.. :friday:
proper4wd
Expedition Leader
"Constitutional carry" exists in states which have chosen not to evoke their Supreme Court affirmed authority to limit, or INFRINGE, upon the second Amendment.
The mere fact that some states have decided to enact limitations, and they have survived Supreme Court discretion, is self evident of the fact that where the ability to "constitutional carry" DOES exist, it is a privilege which that state allows you to have!
I have NEVER said anyone should not have the ABILITY to open carry, my opinion is simply that it shouldn't be done. My desire is not to legislate anyone's life. I wish that people would make the decision not to do it.
The mere fact that some states have decided to enact limitations, and they have survived Supreme Court discretion, is self evident of the fact that where the ability to "constitutional carry" DOES exist, it is a privilege which that state allows you to have!
I have NEVER said anyone should not have the ABILITY to open carry, my opinion is simply that it shouldn't be done. My desire is not to legislate anyone's life. I wish that people would make the decision not to do it.
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MOguy
Explorer
This has nothing to do with privilege, it is about rights.
The states that do not infringe on your RIGHT and not granting you a privilege, they are following the Law of the Land. The states that do not allow Constitutional Carry have made laws that over step there authority.
10th amend:
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people
The 2nd amend is clear that our right to bear and keep arms shall not be an infringed. Telling someone how to keep and bear arms is an infringement. I know there are many laws in existence and are enforceable that could be considered infringements.
14th amend:
Amendment XIV
Section 1.
All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.
Right Guaranteed by the Bill of Rights should fit into this category.
Gun rights should be handled at a Federal level. The Constitution can be amended to keep up with the times if need be.
Matt.H
Adventurer
This:
Along with this:
I believe this is what has many not understanding your views. You state 'fact' that constitutional carry is 'a dream' and then change your mind that it does exist but only because those states have not seen to it to 'infringe' on that right.
CCP, which I believe is in CT., a LEO can not ask a person open carrying for identification for the sole purpose to identify a person that is open carrying. FACT.
That law, which is one that says what you can do, is rare. It was borne out of people being scared and creating a disturbance, or worse. If I am on my way home, with my suitcoat hanging in the back, and need gas I am going to pump it any you may see my revolver. Would you confront a business man, well dresses, 6'02" pumping his gas at night?
I need to go but fear can be the antithesis to freedom.
Along with this:
I believe this is what has many not understanding your views. You state 'fact' that constitutional carry is 'a dream' and then change your mind that it does exist but only because those states have not seen to it to 'infringe' on that right.
CCP, which I believe is in CT., a LEO can not ask a person open carrying for identification for the sole purpose to identify a person that is open carrying. FACT.
That law, which is one that says what you can do, is rare. It was borne out of people being scared and creating a disturbance, or worse. If I am on my way home, with my suitcoat hanging in the back, and need gas I am going to pump it any you may see my revolver. Would you confront a business man, well dresses, 6'02" pumping his gas at night?
I need to go but fear can be the antithesis to freedom.
proper4wd
Expedition Leader
But they aren't, it has been decided at the Supreme Court level that States have the authority to apply limitations to the Second Amendment according to interpretation. Once again I'm only stating fact here - I even posted the quote from Scalia a few pages back. Are your refuting this?
WeLikeCamping
Explorer
For you guys that are all big and tough and confront armed people to harass them for carrying, do you also hand-feed wild bears?
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MOguy
Explorer
you just stated you think keep and bearing arms in manners you do not agree with is a privilege, you don't think that is a violation of a right that says it shall not be infringed on?
Here are other things where you have said or inferred on how you want to infringe on the right for people to keep an bear arms in a manner you personally do not approve of:
"constitutional carry" is an imaginary thing / I don't think that anyone should do it (speaking about open carry), / I still don't know where in the Constitution it defines the right to open carry. In fact, case law is well established that there is no right to open carry. It's a privilege granted by some states in some circumstances /How are you inferring that? You have no god given right to open carry. You have a right to bear arms Defacto case law that open carry is not a Constitutional right. / There are few, if any, justifiable reasons for it and I don't think people should open carry
You don't see those as infringements or restrictions?
proper4wd
Expedition Leader
Dude, all of those statements are either clearly my opinion that I don't think anyone should do it, or they are statements about how 2A has actually been interpreted and limited all the way up to the Supreme Court. I'm not infringing on anybody's rights - we have 50 individual states and a Federal government that has the affirmed authority to do so, though.
proper4wd
Expedition Leader
I can't do another day of this thread, I'll leave you guys with some reading if you want to do some further exploration of the topic.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_case_law_in_the_United_States
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_case_law_in_the_United_States
MOguy
Explorer
The federal government has not made it is illegal to open carry. What the courts have done is band aid BS fixes that should be addressed in the Constitution by our law makers. If the "how or where" we carry needs to be adjusted the Constitution needs to be amended to address this. If they don't want to address the "how and where" in the Constitution then shall not be infringed needs to be replaced shall be handled at the state or local level.
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