Hello from Europe! And why is USA so (UNINFORMED/UNDER-EQUIPPED)

[Paddy]

Unless I’m mistaken, compressor based fridges are way more efficient than the three way fridges that have to be level. 12/24/120/220v... add a solar panel or two and have cold on a 30 deg slope.

The compressor fridge may be ultimately more energy efficient but a 3 way fridge is quieter (way) and runs way longer off the cord on propane so in practice they are much more effient in lifestyle. If you must run your engine or genset or have massive battery or solar to run the compressor fridge those are limitations that the propane fridge can answer. Personally I’ve had both and I will use a propane fridge on my next build. The noise factor is worth it alone.

Do you really need to park on a 30° slope? And solar only works in the sun. I know, seems obvious but my findings are that a typical panel output is really only good for 10-20% of its rating by the time you factor in night, shade, cloud, dirt, and efficiency losses. That perfect spot under the tree won’t provide any solar for your fridge. Now you’re on a ticking clock running battery and listening to it run. Propane don’t care about that.

Food for thought. Just my experience. YMMV

 

[Paddy]

One interesting difference in euro campers vs American is typically American campers will have a TV, micro, AC and a roof fan, where none of these exist on the luxury models here.

 

[Paddler Ed]

I've been reading this with interest, and have finally decided to put size 13/14/48s in (depending on UK/USA/Europe...)

Couple of things to think about in this conversation:

• Up to 3500kg is a car licence, over that is a truck licence. Now some people got that automatically, but after 1997 in the UK you didn't.... so you have to do a full commercial vehicle licence to get the truck licence
• In the UK over 3500kg is a lower speed limit, and if it's a commercial under 3500kg it also has a lower speed limit than car (few caveats, but they get complicated). The difference from memory is about 10-20mph depending on road classification
• Fuel costs and road tax - fuel isn't as cheap as the USA or Australia - a mate back in the UK was saying diesel had hit £1.50/litre... I filled up with diesel at AU$1.50 or about £0.85/litre... and road taxes will vary depending on country. Also tolls will vary depending on size of vehicle or if it's a commercial or not.
• Europe - Spain, Italy and France in particular - has had a long history of motorhome/campervan conversions, as have the Germans. The vans started off a lot smaller, and have grown over the years.
• Fiat/Peugeot/Ctiroen (the van that is now being sold in the USA as a Ram IIRC) have a very good cab supply, along with a good relationship with Al-Ko and BPW for chassis for motorhomes, as well as Fiat doing their own special chassis
• European stuff is generally better put together than British stuff - I saw that Knaus caravans have a 10 year water ingress warranty... my folks in the UK used to be lucky to get to 4 years in their UK vans without damp problems (and they'd then sell the 'van)... their German 'vans were sold at about 7 years old because they were that bit more solid and water ingress wasn't a problem.

Hope that all helps a bit...

 

[luthj]

The license bit makes a lot of sense. Part of the reasons Europeans build such compacting light campers with great features, It's because of the extra weight and cost/difficulty of operation makes the customer base smaller. Here in the United States there's a lot of allowances made for big heavy rvs, in many states you can drive a class A rig (35 ft long, 25klbs+) on car license without a commercial test. The big rvs are also not required to weigh or follow DOT rules.

If some Eurostyle restrictions on operating these vehicles start to be implemented in the United States a sudden and rapid shift towards compact and light RVs would occur.

 

[Paddy]

It’s not as though the market for smaller rv isn’t in USA. They sell the sports mobiles and van based units like crazy. Personally I’m shopping for a Mercedes powered RV like the view or Thor types and one thing I’m running into now is they ALL have slide outs! No camper in Europe has these, first guess might suggest weight savings, or cost, but to me I can’t understand what these slide outs provide? They seem to push the dinette out and create a bunch of floor space that’s frankly useless. Or they pop out a bed which means you can’t use the bed while underway? It’s these kind of design cues that makes me wonder ****** is going on in the industry. I don’t want to do ballroom dancing inside my rv. Is it because American butts have grown so big they can’t fit by the dinette? SO I’d love a sprinter based RV chassis that has no slide outs and a full bed forward and aft.

 

[Buliwyf]

Bed slides are useless, like you said. But dinette slides are priceless. The extra space is a great when the weather is terrible outside.

And when the others you're traveling with have their tents collapse, and their Rtt's flood, that floor space is going to look really great for sleeping bags and pads. You can pack a ton of people into a 23' TT if you utilize the floor space like you would in a tent.

 

[Paddy]

That’s a good point, although I do t really want to pack a ton of people into my pickup.

 

[s.e.charles]

For only a bit more than the price we are paying for crap, quality rigs could be built. Big companies can make Huge money building crap... and then selling us new crap a few years later. Why would they build something with smaller margins that won’t fall apart?

that's why the local shoe store went out of business. they sold Mephisto & Born & Ecco shoes when they were made well. people had no need to come in for another pair.

 

[eblau]

Americans do not question anything enough. We do not do our research when buying things we simply just buy stuff. He who has the most stuff wins. We shop based on price vs features, period. Things are built to a price for Americans, not a standard. We abandoned standards a long time ago.

We want to drag an impossibly huge 5th wheel camper with our F450 King Ranch to "camp" in which is basically just sitting in a chair watching TV and drinking bud lite. We may venture outside the RV to sit in a chair, watch TV and drink bud lite.

 

[Grenadiers]

Americans do not question anything enough. We do not do our research when buying things we simply just buy stuff. He who has the most stuff wins. We shop based on price vs features, period. Things are built to a price for Americans, not a standard. We abandoned standards a long time ago.

We want to drag an impossibly huge 5th wheel camper with our F450 King Ranch to "camp" in which is basically just sitting in a chair watching TV and drinking bud lite. We may venture outside the RV to sit in a chair, watch TV and drink bud lite.

THAT is funny~! We ran the gamut, '93 diesel pusher, falling apart, to F350 powerstroke, with '96 Lance behemoth, to '04 Winnebago Vectra 8.3L diesel, to now our Saurer 6dm. The Vectra with three slides, was a one bedroom apartment. More space than was really necessary. And, we'd park, pull out the Bud Lite, and watch other old people in the RV parks. Boring. American Corporations took over the word 'happiness' a few decades ago, and invented the 'keep up with the Jones' mantra. Since then, more stuff, more happiness.

 

[HSSC]

Started camping almost 60 years ago with my parents in trailers with a dirt bike or two. Camped out of a pickup when I was on my own and poor. Always had a offroad toy. Smart camping/ over landing is base camp with a highly capable exploration vehicle for day trips out of base camp. When our child came along gitting out of the bad weather, a shower, and a toilet, were welcome necessities. Hence our first wooden box on a steel frame toyhauler. A bathroom, a galley, and 21 feet of cargo space. Ordered my way, no cheap stereo, no front bed room, no slide out. Price was right, I focused on the steel frame and decent construction. Lots of junk out there. I can carry a 4 seat dune buggy and three quads. We camp out there and 99% of the time we are buy our selves. Exploring vast areas with our offroad vehicles.

Retirement time has arrived for my wife and myself. I want to get farther out there and have chosen a ambulance on a 4x4 platform and will tow a small street leagal two seat buggy, dual sport Suzuki, Hobbie kayaks.

The Europeans do have some very capable exploration vehicle's. No dought. Smarter than me?

I take offense to that statement. In our freedom loving country I've become and ok surfer, an exceptionally powerful graceful skier. A highly skilled offroad driver. Particularly in sand dunes. Who came up with mountain bikes? Snowboards? And all these new ideas that evolved from free thinkers.

I don't need government agencies to baby sit and coddle me. This amazing country that I've had the opportunity to grow up in gives me the opportunity to choose what makes me happy and not tax me into poverty.

 

[86scotty]

This amazing country that I've had the opportunity to grow up in gives me the opportunity to choose what makes me happy and not tax me into poverty.

America isn't taxing you into poverty? You're in the wrong trade then. Try starting a small business!

 

[Buliwyf]

I wouldn't be able to afford any of this if I worked in Europe.

The 9 weeks of vacation in France is nice. But not so nice if you're broke. I used to live five miles from reefs in Florida. But couldn't afford to dive them. In Ohio I can spend a week diving in Fl and another in the Caribbean every year. No problem.

 

[HSSC]

Don't worry, I'm a self made blue collar man working on my next million. In Europe that is quite a bit more difficult due to taxes. The east and west coast of this country don't want you to keep your own hard earned dollars as well. Add Illinois to that group.

A new term called " Overlanding" has hit the news stands. Well my family has been doing "overlanding"for over 55 years..........old school "camping". I've been backpacking for close to 50 years. Mountain biking sense 1980.

If you want a Sport$$mobile or a ninety five foot diesel pusher with eighteen slideouts, God bless you in the United States Of the Americas because our freedoms have given us that choice.

 

[NMC_EXP]

So, can someone please tell me WHY this type of motorhome isn’t available in USA? I’ve used these since forever in Europe and theyre brilliant for touring.

The short answer is the US government.

For starters (1) Diesel engines are the devil's tool even if theyh get 50 mpg (ask VW). (2) It costs a small fortune to run a vehicle thru all of the required tested to get it approved for sale in the US. (2) US requirements probably include all sorts of safety gear not required over there.