Stryder106
Explorer
Head's up: Finally got The Mojave Road trip report posted. http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/threads/167174-The-Mojave-Road-A-Newbie-s-Tale-Pt-1-Pic-Heavy
Hey Vortec Guys! / Sierra pickup / Suburban / Yukon etc - Finally has Index!
- Thread starter rayra
- Start date
rayra
Expedition Leader
Cool. Looking forward to reading it later tonight or tomorrow.
Got my animated GIF comp done, sorta. Had a break in the rain today. I think I stood on a curb for the 1st and 3rd pics and on the asphalt for the middle pic, perspective is screwy. But close enough. I'm sizing and aligning the images on the wheel rims.
Got my animated GIF comp done, sorta. Had a break in the rain today. I think I stood on a curb for the 1st and 3rd pics and on the asphalt for the middle pic, perspective is screwy. But close enough. I'm sizing and aligning the images on the wheel rims.
Last edited:
Stryder106
Explorer
I still struggle with the math on this. If the nose is down 2" stock, and you level it - you are raising it 2". So, if you then add 2" spacers to the rear springs, how is it still level? Seems like it should have the 2" rake again. It looks great.
You don't want your rig level. I have never figured out the whole "leveling" thing. I put the "leveling kit" on my F150 and had to go back a week later and buy the rear blocks to lift it. It looks like crap, drove like crap and when you put weight in the back your lights were in the sky. You NEED rake for various reasons....one - load useability, two - the suspension works better with a rake to the vehicle, three - I just looks dumb leveled.
rayra
Expedition Leader
I put about 250-lbs worth of **** in the cargo area, between rounds.
Plus slump in the front @ 14yrs / 130k mi. I've been fiddling with the front torsion height repeatedly. I've raised it while stock, put the 3/4" spacers in and raised it, lowered it some, added the weight in the back and lowered the front again, swapped the rear coils took out the 3/4" and put in the 2" and raised the front some more. At this point, I couldn't even tell you how much it's changed, other than by the fenderwell measurements I've reported along the way. (shrug)
To each their own, Kojack, I kind of like it. Looks better to me than the nose-down rake. And I drive it around near-empty 99% of the time. It is my daily driver.
Last edited:
Hillbilly Heaven
Explorer
I would much rather have a slight downward rake in the front than it being sky high in the front. Running high in the front or level does not give you any load capacity. One to two inches high in the rear allows you to carry recommended axle load capacity.
I have been following this closely and it has given me some ideas on what to do with my 2001 Suburban 2wd. I wished it was 4wd, but it can handle what we want it for. I want to lift it about 2" to allow for a larger tire and give me a little more ground clearance. Most of the places we would take it, 2wd will be fine.
I think going with Z71 springs with 2 inch spacers and use white torsion keys up front will give me what I need. Instead of using shock mounting extension brackets use Bilstein shocks with longer travel designed for lifted vehicles. Bilstein offers a selection of lengths with factory mounting. The rear maybe a little soft now and I could tolerate a little stiffer as long as it ain't a kidney buster. Any thoughts on swapping rear sway bar to help with towing stability? I wouldn't want to go crazy on the rear sway bar as it affects front end handling.
I have been following this closely and it has given me some ideas on what to do with my 2001 Suburban 2wd. I wished it was 4wd, but it can handle what we want it for. I want to lift it about 2" to allow for a larger tire and give me a little more ground clearance. Most of the places we would take it, 2wd will be fine.
I think going with Z71 springs with 2 inch spacers and use white torsion keys up front will give me what I need. Instead of using shock mounting extension brackets use Bilstein shocks with longer travel designed for lifted vehicles. Bilstein offers a selection of lengths with factory mounting. The rear maybe a little soft now and I could tolerate a little stiffer as long as it ain't a kidney buster. Any thoughts on swapping rear sway bar to help with towing stability? I wouldn't want to go crazy on the rear sway bar as it affects front end handling.
rayra
Expedition Leader
"sky high"? It's level. I'm not running around with some Bro-tastic nose-high ***-droop. Words used to mean things.
I replaced my rear sway bar end links when I first put the lift spacer in the rear, found the originals to be a bit worn. I have the Z-71 with the tow package, my rear sway bar is 1-1/8" thick (the front is 1.25"), part no. 15762971 (label is still on it and legible, yeah Socal weather-environment conditions). We've towed all sorts of things with both our Z-71 Tahoe and Sub and have had zero stability issues.
The missus' Tahoe is over 170k mi now, almost all highway and its drivetrain and suspension and brakes are practically like new. Bought my Sub used at 12yrs and 116k mi and it was a well worn mom-taxi. Suspension and brakes beat to **** from local driving. So I replaced a lot of bushings, brakes, end links etc. and now it rides much like our Tahoe. It got a little jouncy after I put the new keys in and raised things a bit more, but I then went ahead and thoroughly lubed everything and the ride is nice and pleasant again. Like the way a car feels when you put fresh tires on it.
As for 'handling', well it's a high-CG 4wd 6000-lb+ 7-passenger 18' long bus. Not sure what sort of 'handling' expectations you are projecting on it. It's got almost no inherent roll or wallow, ours are handling the 'handling' demands of L.A. traffic just fine and refreshing your suspension wear items is only a couple hundred bucks tops, for parts. I don't think there's anything there that needs 'fixing', in terms of handling. But if you want to pay $400-600+ for a brightly painted set of thicker aftermarket stab bars and poly bushings, have at it.
/
Threw a tweak adjustment on my tie rods this morning, before it started showering again. Trying to get my steering wheel re-centered. No obvious toe-in trouble, no apparent feathering in ~75mi. Whatever length mistakes I made on the initial install to have my steering wheel off 15-20deg were apparently complementary. The Rough Country inner tie rod sleeves do indeed obscure the wrench-adjustment notches on the inner shafts. My simple workaround was to use a pipe wrench higher up on the reamining exposed shaft, nearer to the center link attachment point / boot. ViseGrips would work just as well. A non-rusty tie rod set will let the inner shaft turn readily. I would suggest that anyone using these sleeves in a region with more wet weather or salt should heavily grease the inner shaft before putting the sleeves on.
To keep my current toe-in while correcting my steering wheel alignment, I used a metal washer of my desired thickness as a shim / gauge. I broke the sleeve loose on the PAX side and backed the inner out until the washer barely fit in the resulting sleeve-to-outer tie rod gap. Then tightened the sleeve back up to the outer. On the driver side I backed the sleeve off until the washer fit, then drover the inner into the outer until it was in contact again and snugged things down.
It's a crude inexact thing, but it should do until I get my new steering parts and ball joints and alignment.
I got what I wanted out of the sleeves, a low-cost upgrade to that spindly factory inner rod, all of 1/2" thick. I've been known to get in a rut or two and run things over. I was a bit concerned about something striking the inner from the front aspect and bending it. I am less concerned now. not a bad deal for $30 (now $35).
I replaced my rear sway bar end links when I first put the lift spacer in the rear, found the originals to be a bit worn. I have the Z-71 with the tow package, my rear sway bar is 1-1/8" thick (the front is 1.25"), part no. 15762971 (label is still on it and legible, yeah Socal weather-environment conditions). We've towed all sorts of things with both our Z-71 Tahoe and Sub and have had zero stability issues.
The missus' Tahoe is over 170k mi now, almost all highway and its drivetrain and suspension and brakes are practically like new. Bought my Sub used at 12yrs and 116k mi and it was a well worn mom-taxi. Suspension and brakes beat to **** from local driving. So I replaced a lot of bushings, brakes, end links etc. and now it rides much like our Tahoe. It got a little jouncy after I put the new keys in and raised things a bit more, but I then went ahead and thoroughly lubed everything and the ride is nice and pleasant again. Like the way a car feels when you put fresh tires on it.
As for 'handling', well it's a high-CG 4wd 6000-lb+ 7-passenger 18' long bus. Not sure what sort of 'handling' expectations you are projecting on it. It's got almost no inherent roll or wallow, ours are handling the 'handling' demands of L.A. traffic just fine and refreshing your suspension wear items is only a couple hundred bucks tops, for parts. I don't think there's anything there that needs 'fixing', in terms of handling. But if you want to pay $400-600+ for a brightly painted set of thicker aftermarket stab bars and poly bushings, have at it.
/
Threw a tweak adjustment on my tie rods this morning, before it started showering again. Trying to get my steering wheel re-centered. No obvious toe-in trouble, no apparent feathering in ~75mi. Whatever length mistakes I made on the initial install to have my steering wheel off 15-20deg were apparently complementary. The Rough Country inner tie rod sleeves do indeed obscure the wrench-adjustment notches on the inner shafts. My simple workaround was to use a pipe wrench higher up on the reamining exposed shaft, nearer to the center link attachment point / boot. ViseGrips would work just as well. A non-rusty tie rod set will let the inner shaft turn readily. I would suggest that anyone using these sleeves in a region with more wet weather or salt should heavily grease the inner shaft before putting the sleeves on.
To keep my current toe-in while correcting my steering wheel alignment, I used a metal washer of my desired thickness as a shim / gauge. I broke the sleeve loose on the PAX side and backed the inner out until the washer barely fit in the resulting sleeve-to-outer tie rod gap. Then tightened the sleeve back up to the outer. On the driver side I backed the sleeve off until the washer fit, then drover the inner into the outer until it was in contact again and snugged things down.
It's a crude inexact thing, but it should do until I get my new steering parts and ball joints and alignment.
I got what I wanted out of the sleeves, a low-cost upgrade to that spindly factory inner rod, all of 1/2" thick. I've been known to get in a rut or two and run things over. I was a bit concerned about something striking the inner from the front aspect and bending it. I am less concerned now. not a bad deal for $30 (now $35).
Last edited:
Hillbilly Heaven
Explorer
Sorry I didn't mean yours was Sky High far from it. I like the stance you have. I was making a comment in general.
No I have no desire to go crazy on the suspension mods. No not looking for the super stiff race car handling either. Far from it. Hate the weeble wobbles though especially when towing. Looking for a slightly firmer secure driving feel not the soft luxury ride. I think it can be had especially using Z71 factory parts. Thanks for the part number on the front bar. I would think though that the bar would be different for 4wd vs 2wd.
No I have no desire to go crazy on the suspension mods. No not looking for the super stiff race car handling either. Far from it. Hate the weeble wobbles though especially when towing. Looking for a slightly firmer secure driving feel not the soft luxury ride. I think it can be had especially using Z71 factory parts. Thanks for the part number on the front bar. I would think though that the bar would be different for 4wd vs 2wd.
Stryder106
Explorer
Mine sits perfectly level - love it and it rides great. I never liked the 2" nose down rake mine had stock. When I add weight to the rear, I have 1000# Air Lift bags inside of my springs. Fully loaded out camping and exploring - rig is perfectly level.
I was asking the question because I want to go to a heavier spring, to not have to rely on the air bags while out in the back country. Had been reading on here about the H2 springs, but the give an additional 2" increase in ride height. Given that my nose is already leveled - I was assuming that would put the rake back in my truck as I don't want to go up anymore with my CV angles. Hence my question,
rayra
Expedition Leader
Hillbilly that's the part number for the rear bar on my Z71 Sub. The front is thicker / different.
I think you'll find if you just put fresh stock bushings and end links, even if only with stock OEM parts / equivalents, that you'll get good performance at the lowest cost. Or find an aftermarket kit that covers everything. I try to do preventative maintenance when I can, or especially when I'm already doing much of the same disassembly for something else. Targets of opportunity.
Since I'm going back into the front end on this thing for the pitman and idler, I'm looking at budget tie rod parts and decent OEM ball joints and control arm bushings. If I'm going to take it halfway apart again I might as well change it all. The parts will likely last me the rest of the use of the vehicle. I'm not driving it far or hard.
And laughably, my steering wheel is now off just as much in the other direction. I only shifted the tie rods 3/32-1/8". So I'm going to repeat things in the other direction, trying to halve the amount.
I think you'll find if you just put fresh stock bushings and end links, even if only with stock OEM parts / equivalents, that you'll get good performance at the lowest cost. Or find an aftermarket kit that covers everything. I try to do preventative maintenance when I can, or especially when I'm already doing much of the same disassembly for something else. Targets of opportunity.
Since I'm going back into the front end on this thing for the pitman and idler, I'm looking at budget tie rod parts and decent OEM ball joints and control arm bushings. If I'm going to take it halfway apart again I might as well change it all. The parts will likely last me the rest of the use of the vehicle. I'm not driving it far or hard.
And laughably, my steering wheel is now off just as much in the other direction. I only shifted the tie rods 3/32-1/8". So I'm going to repeat things in the other direction, trying to halve the amount.
Hillbilly Heaven
Explorer
Thanks gotcha. Yeah going to at least replace all the bushings and end links to start with. Then I am have a good reference point to start with. I do need go over this thing with a fine tooth comb as we bought it or rather stole it and don't know much about it's history. Judging from how nasty the inside was I would say someone drove and didn't care about anything else.
rayra
Expedition Leader
Sounds a lot like my mom-taxi when I got it. All kinds of food and junk embedded in it, coffee stains all over the cupholder console and under it. Family medical papers and hair salon cards jammed in the tape deck tray and in the instrument cluster. I spent a lot of time and effort detailing it and baselining all the maintenance. Dug up the whole list of 100k interval maintenance and did it all. The cabin air filters were totally disgusting. And earlier in this topic you see the horrendous black crud that was my brake fluid (in fact I should flush it again). I've had it just over two years now and 12-13k mi and now I seem to have been getting hit by all the high mileage wear stuff crapping out.
Hillbilly Heaven
Explorer
I want to know who was the brilliant engineer that designed the door pockets so that when you opened the doors in the rain, they were self cleaning. The rain goes straight in the pockets and anything in there gets soaked.
rayra
Expedition Leader
The only thing I keep in mine is dog hair.
But your post makes me consider putting some stuff there. Small binoculars. Maybe some road flares in a gallon ziploc. Maybe a small extinguisher. I have a medium sized extinguisher and a good first aid kit in my storage drawers (and a bunch of flares etc). Maybe get one of those cheap disposable rain ponchos or a compact umbrella. Thinking along the lines of the 'first grab' sort of stuff that you'd want in an emergency. And all of that stuff wouldn't care about the rain.
I already have a maglite and glass breaker mounted on my center console. And my center console is full of comfort and electronic stuff.
But your post makes me consider putting some stuff there. Small binoculars. Maybe some road flares in a gallon ziploc. Maybe a small extinguisher. I have a medium sized extinguisher and a good first aid kit in my storage drawers (and a bunch of flares etc). Maybe get one of those cheap disposable rain ponchos or a compact umbrella. Thinking along the lines of the 'first grab' sort of stuff that you'd want in an emergency. And all of that stuff wouldn't care about the rain.
I already have a maglite and glass breaker mounted on my center console. And my center console is full of comfort and electronic stuff.
Hillbilly Heaven
Explorer
Do not put your favorite multi-tool and flashlight in there. I carry a tire air gage handy for airing up or down. It would be nice if someone would design a flap to just give the water some place to run off instead of in.