HI LIFT AS A WINCH?

[Antichrist]

If you can weld or have a friend who can you can often get in to a winch set up for well less than $1000.
About 10 years ago I put a Ramsey RE10000 on my '95 Discovery.
RE10000 - $200 off of ebay
New solenoids - $100
Bumper material and metal shop bending it - <$100 (I think it was $50 but that seems low)
Other miscellaneous steel and bolts - $50
Wiring - <$50
A day of fabrication

You don't have to buy new

 

[AndrewClarke]

If your current vehicle is the 110 listed in your sig then buy one of these (pic).

There are 4 factory installed jacking points that fit that adaptor on your truck. 2 on the rear cross member and 1 on the end of each front fame dumb iron (remove the rubber plugs if they are still there). You can buy sliders with the same holes in them as well for side lifts if you want.

On the chain front. There is a shear pin in the hi-lift that is designed to break well before the chain as long as you use the correct welded link chain that is made for this type of recovery. Most winch kits come with a section or you can buy it the same places you buy straps and stuff. It has a hook that is designed to fit over the links so you can use it to shorten the length easily and take up the slack in the rigging as is mentioned above.

As with anything else chain is not a 1 size fits all item. You need to make sure you use the correct type for what you are doing or it can break just like anything else.

That's a cool product. I hadn't seen it before. If it came down to it I could use the bumper on the front and the frame on the back, but I might pick one of those up. It's the sides of the vehicles where I wish I had the mounting points. I'd also like to pick up a wheel strap as that might come in handy too. Honestly what I really need for my 110 is a bottle jack, in case I have a plain, old-fashioned flat tyre.

You make good points about the chain. I have what may be an unnecessarily averse reaction to them. Once (almost) bitten, twice shy.

 

[ebg18t]

I would wait till you can swing the price of a winch with synthetic line.

After watching someone get injured by a snapped regular cable I couldn't run a regular cable on my truck.

 

[AndrewClarke]

I would wait till you can swing the price of a winch with synthetic line.

After watching someone get injured by a snapped regular cable I couldn't run a regular cable on my truck.

Or, learn how to use your winch with a regular cable. As soon as you either feel that you have the hang of it, or you see ANY damage on the cable, pull it off and replace it with synthetic.

A brand new wire cable should be fine, and they're easy to inspect for damage. I know when I first got a winch, the first few times I used it I was really glad I wasn't using an expensive synthetic rope as I didn't really know what I was doing. Maybe other people aren't as clumsy as I am, though.

Hehe, I'm editing my post to note that I still don't really feel like I know what I'm doing with my winch, and I still have my wire cable. I don't want to come across as a winching expert.

 

[ebg18t]

Both the failures of wire cables I have seen were with experienced operators, I beleive both were fluke events. But enough to scare me. Warn replaced the cable for free and the other winch company gave the owner a credit to use towards a new cable. The warn still as a wire cable on it, I don't know what the other owner did after.

I am definitely NOT an expert, but I do like the synthetic winch line I have been using, for me it works out well. Plus it is a Ton lighter than the wire equivalent. My goal is to NOT have to use my winch.

 

[aka rover]

As mentioned in prior post a High Lift jack can be dangerous even if used as it is intended.

I think most all rigs can use a high lift if they are set up for it and used in a safe manner, my suggestion would be to find a level spot and try to simply jack up each corner of your rig in a safe place where you can see just how the thing works.

A few things we did back in my winch challenge days was to take short heavy duty straps to choke up the axle to the frame, We used a large ratchet strap to stop axle droop while jacking. This method keeps the vehical stable while jacking because you are only lifting the chassis a small amount to get wheel and tire up high enough to change tire.

Another problem is lack of maintance on the jacks, they stick and hang up if not properly taken care of and get people into trouble when the pins stick and don't move when there supposed to.

As far as cable or rope goes, Cable is as dependable if not more than synthetic rope and cable requires less maintance than rope does and will outlast it if used correctly. Both wire and rope after each use should be un spooled and respooled to verify it is on the drum nice and this is also when you check the condition of your wire or rope.

Cable can be dangerous but if cable dampers are used which should be used on rope as well it will help absorb the energy of the break, most close calls you here about with cable or chain breakage is due to a situation that shouldn't have been. Why was someone in a place where the cable or chain if broke could have hit them, I always say the one operating the winch is responsible for the dumb people in the wrong spot! its up to the operator of any recovery device to police the situation and sure its safe to start the recovery.

So all in all the high lift is a good item to use as a winch and is only as dangerous as the operator "IT CAN BE A TOOL, OR A WEAPON IN THE WRONG HANDS"

If you are going to use the jack as a winch you will need twice the rigging to be safe! you in many cases will need a second rigging to hold the vehical from slipping back into the hole or ditch while you get another 48" or 60" bite on the rigging. Again find a spot you can practice with a scenario and you will have a good idea what your up against in the field.

I make my 16 year old son practice winching and useing his high lift in the drive from time to time to make sure he understands what he has with him when hes alone in the bush.

ok enough of me rambling about this stuff

Cheers Ed

 

[ipgregory]

A few things we did back in my winch challenge days was to take short heavy duty straps to choke up the axle to the frame, We used a large ratchet strap to stop axle droop while jacking. This method keeps the vehical stable while jacking because you are only lifting the chassis a small amount to get wheel and tire up high enough to change tire.

We do it all the time. I keep a shortened ratchet in the truck for just that purpose and my hi-lift is externally mounted and easy to get at. Its quick and easy and often the only choice if the truck is over a depression or hole and you can't get a good stand for the hydraulic. Problem is the typical stated WLL of most ratchets is well below the probable down force the spring is exerting on the axle. So I am not going to recommend it on here and get the rigging police down on my head. Especially when half the thread revolves around safety.

 

[aka rover]

We do it all the time. I keep a shortened ratchet in the truck for just that purpose and my hi-lift is externally mounted and easy to get at. Its quick and easy and often the only choice if the truck is over a depression or hole and you can't get a good stand for the hydraulic. Problem is the typical stated WLL of most ratchets is well below the probable down force the spring is exerting on the axle. So I am not going to recommend it on here and get the rigging police down on my head. Especially when half the thread revolves around safety.

Very good not recomending it! but if you have a strap made at your local wire and rope company they can build it to your WLL of your intended load for not much money. They will also put a nice anti chaff gaurd on it for you.

But you are right NOT just any strap will do!

 

[Roverhound]

I've used a Hi-lift several times to winch. Get the kit and a chain and it will get you out of about everything.
Winches have been known to fail, the Hi-Lift is a good back up.

 

[ipgregory]

Thought I would revive this and post this up to show that yes, as has been mentioned, a hi-lift can be used as a winch if all else fails or its your only option. This is us demonstrating using one to right a vehicle during the rolled vehicle demo at the Expo over the weekend.

In that staged set up it took us 1-1/2 racks (only 1 re-rig) of a 60" jack to right the truck using a low on frame rig point. Cost of that is a higher load meaning more sweat on the handle but a quicker recovery.

Thanks to Suntinez on the forum for taking the picture as we didn't get chance to take any.

Ian

 

[Dave Bennett]

Just remember the pulling strength/capacity is about 2k lbs IIRC on a Hi-Lift. It has it's uses but doesn't pull much.

 

[maxingout]

That was an awesome demonstration at the Overland Expo of using the high lift jack to right a vehicle that was turned on it's side. I never saw the high lift used as a winch before that demonstration, and I was impressed what you can accomplish when you have the right gear and know what you are doing. Before I set off on a major overland adventure, I will get some chain and kevlar line to back up my wire winch cable.

 

[ipgregory]

Just remember the pulling strength/capacity is about 2k lbs IIRC on a Hi-Lift. It has it's uses but doesn't pull much.

Yes they are low but the one we were using is rated to about 4.5k lbs WLL. Test rating is about 7k from memory. Shear pin is likely to go after that. That truck weighs about 5500lbs so we were well within the rating just tipping it back over. Not sure I would like to be trying to get it out of a deep mud pit or up a 60 degree slope though.

That was an awesome demonstration at the Overland Expo of using the high lift jack to right a vehicle that was turned on it's side. I never saw the high lift used as a winch before that demonstration, and I was impressed what you can accomplish when you have the right gear and know what you are doing. Before I set off on a major overland adventure, I will get some chain and kevlar line to back up my wire winch cable.

Glad you enjoyed it Dave. We wanted to show that it can be done but also that it isn't something you want to try 1st if you have options. Frank sweating on the handle and suggesting a winch is the 1st 3 things you should fit to your truck hopefully demonstrated that? :sombrero:

The other thing we wanted to show was that a high-lift and/or a winch alone are useless without additional equipment and the knowledge on how to properly rig and use them.

In the high-lift pull for example there were 6 shackles, 2 x 50’ synthetic winch extensions, a 10’ welded link choke chain, 2 x rope bungs (a stick and a magazine) as well as the high-lift itself with pulling adaptor.

In the 3 point self-recover pull with the winch we did just before the hi-lift we had 5 shackles, 1 x 50’ synthetic winch extension, 2 x snatch blocks and 2 x anchor points (My 90 and the X-Anchor in the demo). If using different anchor points such as buried tires, trees or rocks then additional straps and shackles would be needed.

Hope it was helpful.

Ian

 

[maxingout]

It was helpful and very worthwhile. In fact, my wife thought it was awesome. Watching you guys demonstrate how it is safely and properly done made our day. If we ever get in trouble with our trucks, we will be much better prepared because of your demonstration. Thanks for doing such a good job.

Recovery gear is only posing gear unless you know how to use it.

 

[AndrewClarke]

Thought I would revive this and post this up to show that yes, as has been mentioned, a hi-lift can be used as a winch if all else fails or its your only option. This is us demonstrating using one to right a vehicle during the rolled vehicle demo at the Expo over the weekend.

In that staged set up it took us 1-1/2 racks (only 1 re-rig) of a 60" jack to right the truck using a low on frame rig point. Cost of that is a higher load meaning more sweat on the handle but a quicker recovery.

Thanks to Suntinez on the forum for taking the picture as we didn't get chance to take any.

Ian

Umm, what kind of terrible driver would roll their car in a field like that? To drive like that you'd have to be really unsafe, with all those people around.

Plus, speaking of all the people watching, why not just have them pull the car back over without use of the hi-lift? That would have been quicker and safer.

Sorry, I couldn't stop myself